Confirmed with Link: Alex Semin and Hurricanes agree to 5 year, 7 million avg deal

[Unsustainable]

Great signing. I am going to pick up a jersey on the April 6 game to show support for our new overlord.

 

[Sasha Cares]

Damn that's a lot. How are we going to stay under the cap with Semin, EStaal, JStaal, and Ward?

 

[Sasha Cares]

I assume Ruutu and Jussi have to be gone next year. Maybe Joni

 

[Unsustainable]

Ruutu has to be on the buyout block.

 

[Roboturner913]

According to Capgeek, the Canes now have 17 players signed for next year and $6M left in capspace. Need to sign 2 defensemen, 3 forwards and a back-up goalie at a minimum..so they can afford $1M / player (unless they make a trade).

Good stuff.

Don't forget each team gets two amnesty buyouts to get down to the $64m cap. You have to assume Ruutu and Jokinen are going to be marked on that. That makes it more like 13.5 million to sign 8 guys.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Ruutu has to be on the buyout block.

Possibly the trade block. Ruutu is the kind of guy who would make Cup contenders drool.

If Dallas could get a top-shelf D prospect for Morrow, JR has to at least be entertaining the thought of swapping Ruutu for someone on an ELC and going from there.

 

[Roboturner913]

I assume Ruutu and Jussi have to be gone next year. Maybe Joni

Pitkanen has decent trade value, the other two not so much.

 

[FlyingSquirrels]

Possibly the trade block. Ruutu is the kind of guy who would make Cup contenders drool.

If Dallas could get a top-shelf D prospect for Morrow, JR has to at least be entertaining the thought of swapping Ruutu for someone on an ELC and going from there.

There is a huge difference that you are failing to mention. Morrow is an impending UFA. Ruutu is far from it.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Good stuff.

Don't forget each team gets two amnesty buyouts to get down to the $64m cap. You have to assume Ruutu and Jokinen are going to be marked on that. That makes it more like 13.5 million to sign 8 guys.

I don't assume Ruutu and Jokinen will be marked on that.

EDIT: I'm not saying there's no chance, I just don't assume that it's automatic as many are thinking.

 

[Sasha Cares]

Joni trade, ruutu trade or amnesty, jussi amnesty.

 

[Mr America]

Right, let's make a ****** defense that much worse by getting rid of Joni.

 

[Roboturner913]

I don't assume Ruutu and Jokinen will be marked on that.

"Assume" is a strong word, safer to say that if JR cannot make the appropriate signings within his budget then those are the moves he would make. I think he would probably like to hold on to both guys, especially if Ruutu plays well for the remainder of the season.

Right, let's make a ****** defense that much worse by getting rid of Joni.

Only if things aren't working and they become sellers. I like Joni a lot but the reality is he has a big contract, is injured far too often, and has essentially been replaced by Faulk as the #1 d-man. If JR wanted to deal Joni he could get a very fair return.

 

[My Special Purpose]

According to Capgeek, the Canes now have 17 players signed for next year and $6M left in capspace. Need to sign 2 defensemen, 3 forwards and a back-up goalie at a minimum..so they can afford $1M / player (unless they make a trade).

This. JR has to make choices. He has to make moves and signings. Every move and signing affects the next. As we continue to pile more and more money into the forwards, the other positions suffer. There is no other way to do this.

So when everyone complains we need a winger to play with Staal, we find one, and trade him for a draft pick which will be a questionable player if he even makes it in the NHL. I agree that 7M is a bit much but looking at Getzlaf, Perry, Parise deals, its a bargain IMO

If we miss the playoffs even after finding this elusive winger to play with E. Staal, then yes -- CONSIDERING THE CURRENT STATE OF THE ROSTER -- I'm fine with trading him for a pick and a prospect.

That was my initial reaction too.

But the more I think about it, the more I think this was a vote of confidence by JR. With the team faltering the last few games, you know people were starting to wonder if he was going to start shipping guys out of town.

We'll see whether it was the right move or the wrong one probably by the end of this week. but either way JR is showing that he has a plan and he's sticking to it for the long haul. And I really respect that even if I don't like all his moves.

Even if it's the dreaded "vote of confidence," do it some other way. This is a $35 million risk. Sign Tlusty to an extension. Sign Ellis to an extension. This is locking up well over 10% of your budget for five years for a guy who has played about 30 games here.

Because the trade deadline is April 3.

Fine, 10 days, so sue me.

I usually agree with everything you say, but not this time. Letting him walk for a draft pick or prospect would be a fine idea...IF we had ANYONE capable of filling the top line spot next to EStaal next year and beyond. We do not. And we would be right back to where we were last year complaining for years about not having a legit winger for the #1 unit.

But I absolutely agree about the state of our defense. I have an idea though...why don't we hold on to our draft picks and prospects for once. And...I don't know...maybe develop a capable defensive unit?? Losing Dumo and a #1 for another forward when our defense is so utterly horrible is not my favorite move of all time. Throwing unnecessary draft picks for Westgarth is another of my least favorites.

The thing is, Dumoulin is having a down year in the AHL and isn't even on the list of callups for the Penguins. Drafting isn't necessarily how you build a strong defense. You've got to give up something to get something, in a lot of cases. For every Weber who is drafted and developed, there's a Chara who was allowed to leave by his drafting team. And what your post fails to acknowledge, is that we're building a legit No. 1 line *at the expense* of our defense. All that money tied up at forward just makes it borderline impossible to ice an NHL defense.

So you would rather have a prospect or draft pick whom we can only hope will turn out as good as Semin several years from now? Ya, that makes sense. You trade guys like that if you're not going to retain them or you're in a total rebuild. We're in neither of those positions.

You can't keep thinking this way. We thought the same way about Ruutu's extension -- how are we going to find a guy like Ruutu in the draft. Well, the bottom line is that we don't always have to keep our guys. Especially when it's not working. So we lose Ruutu. So we lose Semin. What's the big deal? We'll spend that $7 million somewhere else. Maybe even -- gasp -- on a defenseman!!

 

[Mr America]

According to Capgeek, the Canes now have 17 players signed for next year and $6M left in capspace. Need to sign 2 defensemen, 3 forwards and a back-up goalie at a minimum..so they can afford $1M / player (unless they make a trade).

Actually, we really only need to sign two forwards and one defensemen. Possibly a backup goalie, but Peters is signed for next season and already counting against the numbers on Capgeek.

And look at the pending UFA's, Larose, Wallace, Hall, Brent, Corvo, Sangs, Ellis. Hardly the people that are going to make or break any team next season.

 

[snakepliskin]

Now that this is done, they should seriously look into trading Skinner for a defenseman. Before this season that would have been unthinkable, but now they have a vastly superior hockey player locked up for only 1.25M/yr more than Skinner. It's the only way to address the defense long term. All you are getting otherwise at the deadline is some mediocre #4/5.

this is exactly what ive been trying to say! trade him at his peak value!

 

[Moosetache]

Ok, the Ruutu contract is just awful. Nobody who scores 40-50 points should be getting 5 mil a year. I cant even believe I just had to write that.

That is where our top tier defenseman should have come from. I have no problem signing him to that contract. There are plenty of teams with multiple huge dollar forwards, and they still have money left over to ice a decent defense. Dont even get me started with Cam Wards contract, jeez. Guy got hot for a month, with a defense in front of him that just dumped the puck out, and he's labeled "elite"....hes not close to elite.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Actually, we really only need to sign two forwards and one defensemen. Possibly a backup goalie, but Peters is signed for next season and already counting against the numbers on Capgeek.

Ah..good point on Peters. I missed him.

I disagree on the Forwards/D though. Right now they have 10 guys at the NHL level and under contract (and that includes Westgarth). They need to sign (or bring on prospects like Rask/Welsh) 3-4 forwards. Also, signing 1 D gives them 6 so they will sign (or promote Murphy) 2. The team has pretty much always had 7 D and 13-14 forwards.

I'm not saying it can't work as most of the players they need to fill spots with are bottom guys, so it's definitely doable. Won't be able to make a marked improvement on defense though without a trade or two. And I'm not complaining about the Semin signing, just stating where the team stands after this signing.

 

[Zombie Mike Murphy]

I mean, we've been filling those bottom spots with callups anyways, and they've been serviceable enough - we were comfortably leading the division until Ward went down.

 

[WWAD]

Ah..good point on Peters. I missed him.

I disagree on the Forwards/D though. Right now they have 10 guys at the NHL level and under contract (and that includes Westgarth). They need to sign (or bring on prospects like Rask/Welsh) 3-4 forwards. Also, signing 1 D gives them 6 so they will sign (or promote Murphy) 2. The team has pretty much always had 7 D and 13-14 forwards.

I'm not saying it can't work as most of the players they need to fill spots with are bottom guys, so it's definitely doable. Won't be able to make a marked improvement on defense though without a trade or two. And I'm not complaining about the Semin signing, just stating where the team stands after this signing.

Further complicating matters, Murphy's ELC isn't exactly cheap - 1.344 M per.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I mean, we've been filling those bottom spots with callups anyways, and they've been serviceable enough - we were comfortably leading the division until Ward went down.

True, but we won't be in this weak division next season. With the forwards, I think the team can probably get away with some callups or minor signings provided (1) Nash cements a 3C spot and (2) there are no injuries to the top 6. It does mean another year without an upgrade on defense (again, unless there is a trade).

Again, I'm just stating where the Canes stand with regards to the cap, not complaining about this signing.

 

[tarheelhockey]

There is a huge difference that you are failing to mention. Morrow is an impending UFA. Ruutu is far from it.

He also has some career left, which you can't say for Morrow. If he has trade value for anyone, it makes more sense to trade him than buy him out.

Fine, 10 days, so sue me.

Well, that's a big difference in terms of what you're proposing, which is essentially that our next 4 games should have made the difference between trading Semin away and signing him to a 5-year deal. That's a pretty huge decision to make based on 4 games, with us on the bubble of both the division and the 8th seed.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

Like the J. Staal/Skinner extensions, I'm not too excited about the cap hit/salary, but I am very happy to see the player under contract for the long-term. Now off to buy a Semin jersey-shirt.

Good stuff.

Don't forget each team gets two amnesty buyouts to get down to the $64m cap. You have to assume Ruutu and Jokinen are going to be marked on that. That makes it more like 13.5 million to sign 8 guys.

I can’t see the Canes using a compliance buyout on Ruutu, at least not this offseason. Ruutu is owed $15 mil over the next 3 years according to CapGeek --> http://capgeek.com/player/519. Compliance buyouts aren't free; teams are responsible for 2/3 of the remaining value of a contract with the buyout --> http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2013/01/06/teams-get-two-amnesty-buyouts-over-next-two-summers/. Despite this signing presumably signaling the Canes position as a ceiling team going forward, I have a hard time believing they would actually drop $10 mil just to get some cap relief. Furthermore, I don't think Ruutu is as expendable as some of think. It’s not like the team has anybody to take his place, presently in the system. It’s going to cost assets and/or significant money to replace him. Combine all of that with his NMC and I’m almost 100% positive he’s going to be in a Carolina uniform next season.

 

[Roboturner913]

I can't imagine any GM giving up much of anything for Ruutu's contract, unless he was semi-obsessed over him. But I guess anything's possible, somebody took Kaberle off us after all.

I can’t see the Canes using a compliance buyout on Ruutu, at least not this offseason. Ruutu is owed $15 mil over the next 3 years according to CapGeek --> http://capgeek.com/player/519. Compliance buyouts aren't free; teams are responsible for 2/3 of the remaining value of a contract with the buyout --> http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2013/01/06/teams-get-two-amnesty-buyouts-over-next-two-summers/. Despite this signing presumably signaling the Canes position as a ceiling team going forward, I have a hard time believing they would actually drop $10 mil just to get some cap relief. Furthermore, I don't think Ruutu is as expendable as some of think. It’s not like the team has anybody to take his place, presently in the system. It’s going to cost assets and/or significant money to replace him. Combine all of that with his NMC and I’m almost 100% positive he’s going to be in a Carolina uniform next season.

I essentially agree, although coming up with that 10 million isn't as much a problem now as it has been in the past. I think it's far more likely they buy out Jokinen and leave Ruutu alone. If he's healthy and back to his old self, it's almost a no-brainer to keep him.

Keep in mind I am differentiating between Ruutu the hockey player (who I like) and Ruutu's contract (which is beyond terrible).

 

[ramp23]

I am really taken aback by this thread. If you read the main board, there has been thread after thread about Semin and everyone here has had his back, saying what a good job he was doing and how we would love to re-sign him. Now that we have, almost everyone is against it! What is going on? You are afraid we are going to lose Pitkanen? Heaven help us all!

 

[Roboturner913]

I am really taken aback by this thread. If you read the main board, there has been thread after thread about Semin and everyone here has had his back, saying what a good job he was doing and how we would love to re-sign him. Now that we have, almost everyone is against it! What is going on? You are afraid we are going to lose Pitkanen? Heaven help us all!

I don't see very many at all against it. Just looking at the ramifications thereof. What's wrong with that?