Player Discussion Adam Larsson (Hall talk will result in a thread ban)

[Zaddy]

Also, @Drivesaitl these four posts were literally the only ones I found from me from page 1-10 (didn't bother going farther), I think it's perfectly in line with my earlier take that I wasn't heavily engaged in that discussion at all, since actually I only replied to you once with that single comment. Maybe there's more somewhere down the line but at the time I certainly did not engage much in the discussion. Those first three quotes were not replies to you, in fact only one of those three were a reply to anyone at all. So yeah...

Larsson also finished with a +13 rating, best on Team Sweden and I think 3rd best in tournament only behind Aho and Teräväinen who scored a ton of points for Finland.

Wonder when people are going to start appreciate how good he is defensively. It's not a coincidence he keeps leading his teams in that stat while playing shutdown minutes.

People are just really attached to these offensive defensemen nowadays. A guy like Burns is tremendous offensively but terrible in his own zone. It's honestly a bit of a joke that a guy like him won the Norris. The guy had 58% OZ starts that year too, the most out of anyone on that Sharks team and had Vlasic and Braun taking all the tough minutes. Guys of Larsson's ilk don't get enough recognition in this league.

Don't know if this was posted yet but here's an article with swedish NT coach talking about Larsson as well as some comments from Larsson himself. Some interesting stuff in there.

WORLDS: Larsson encouraged to activate offensively

So why are you even in this thread and posting? Seriously.

 

[Drivesaitl]

That's very disingenuous of you. I went back and looked and I questioned why you were posting on the subject only in response to your comment "Who cares what Larsson did at the WC?". That piece of context is quite important, wonder why you left that out

Again, my comments back then was exactly in line with what I mentioned in my previous post here: I want the best for Larsson and I am happy when he plays well. I don't know why I wouldn't want him to do well. He's both an Oiler and a swede so...twice the reason to support him. So just from a quick glance on those early pages of this thread I was expressing joy that he was playing well at the WC, and then you come with your comment "who cares what Larsson did at the WC?", well obviously both me and others did care, so to come in as a negative nancy like that is not a lot of fun and it's probably not weird that you received a lot of pushback after that. Maybe your argument had a point, but you could've worded it a lot more eloquently than you did.

And sorry for not remembering everything I post on here, I am certainly not against accountability but I'm not gonna sit and dig through my entire post history to see if I may or may not be contradicting myself every now and again.

The comment I don't care what Larsson did in Sweden is very different than if I stated "I don't care what Larsson does at all. This is a Larsson thread, surely can you understand my comments were very appropriate, all of them, within this thread, and there was no need for you to defiantly ask why I'm posting in the thread.

I was posting on the topic of Larsson, the NHL player, which is the purpose of this thread on hfboards Edmonton oilers, which just happens to be an NHL club. I don't need to explain this. But THAT of course is the context of my posts to an NHL club team board.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Also, @Drivesaitl these four posts were literally the only ones I found from me from page 1-10 (didn't bother going farther), I think it's perfectly in line with my earlier take that I wasn't heavily engaged in that discussion at all, since actually I only replied to you once with that single comment. Maybe there's more somewhere down the line but at the time I certainly did not engage much in the discussion. Those first three quotes were not replies to you, in fact only one of those three were a reply to anyone at all. So yeah...

I never engaged, I never, ever, had sex with that woman..



said for laughs.

But as Harpoon explained it was odd that you engaged me in the thread 2yrs ago, posted multiple times right in that time frame in the thread, and then you claim to have recollection of several posters saying what Tippett did when really it was me.

Lets carry on and move forward. No biggy.

 

[Zaddy]

I never engaged, I never, ever, had sex with that woman..



said for laughs.

But as Harpoon explained it was odd that you engaged me in the thread 2yrs ago, posted multiple times right in that time frame in the thread, and then you claim to have recollection of several posters saying what Tippett did when really it was me.

Lets carry on and move forward. No biggy.

I think you're reading too much into my original post here. It was literally just a throw-away line in my post that I didn't even include originally. I just mentioned it as I thought it was interesting as I had a memory of it being discussed here previously but that's as far as it went, I didn't remember who said what or even the details of the discussion in itself or which posters were involved. So no need to try and paint me as a villain or a hypocrite or anything, it was a purely innocent comment on my part.

I don't keep track of what anyone says in here (including myself most of the time unless it's something that I am particularly passionate about, but even then my memory is usually foggy) unless they have some very strong opinions that are impossible to forget because they keep reiterating it (see Nabob and Pulju for instance, or his constant strawmen arguments, or Steven and his hate for Drai. Ironically neither guy is here anymore), those are the only ones I really remember vividly, certainly not what anyone said in this thread 2 years ago.

The comment I don't care what Larsson did in Sweden is very different than if I stated "I don't care what Larsson does at all. This is a Larsson thread, surely can you understand my comments were very appropriate, all of them, within this thread, and there was no need for you to defiantly ask why I'm posting in the thread.

I was posting on the topic of Larsson, the NHL player, which is the purpose of this thread on hfboards Edmonton oilers, which just happens to be an NHL club. I don't need to explain this. But THAT of course is the context of my posts to an NHL club team board.

I disagree but lets move on.

 

[Panda Bear]

 

[Shizuka]

Larsson is a beauty even with his struggles since becoming an Oiler. I'm really hoping he bounces back under Tippett's tutelage.

 

[DerpMorg]

It’s been discussed in the PGT thread tonight, but it’s becoming apparent that mentally Larsson may not be checked in right now to playing hockey. With what happened to his dad, one could speculate he’s still dealing with that and processing it.

Does anyone think the management of this team needs to sit down with him and see if he needs time away from the game, or to see if there’s some sort of route to getting him back to where he needs to be? Maybe a year back home playing? Who knows?

This team has a bad reputation when it comes to the mental health of players. This might be a chance to redeem that a bit.

 

[Aerchon]

Larsson is a beauty even with his struggles since becoming an Oiler. I'm really hoping he bounces back under Tippett's tutelage.

It’s been discussed in the PGT thread tonight, but it’s becoming apparent that mentally Larsson may not be checked in right now to playing hockey. With what happened to his dad, one could speculate he’s still dealing with that and processing it.

Does anyone think the management of this team needs to sit down with him and see if he needs time away from the game, or to see if there’s some sort of route to getting him back to where he needs to be? Maybe a year back home playing? Who knows?

This team has a bad reputation when it comes to the mental health of players. This might be a chance to redeem that a bit.

Step one: Remember it's preseason and these games mean nothing to a vet like z Larsson.

Step two: Watch the Oilers and Larsson in the regular season and see if he continues to suck.

Step three: Enjoy it if he doesn't suck... if he does... it's a huge blow to the Oilers and the Oilers need to come up with a plan to replace him moving forward. It will be three years of bad if he has another weak season.

He was NJ best defensemen when we acquired him.

He was a beast in 2016-2017. Both regular season and playoffs. Most/all hockey pundits actually has the Oilers winning "the trade" he played so well.

Having followed him in Jersey a bit and on the Oilers I never ever imagined he could possibly be as bad as he was the last 2 years.

I have no idea what happened but I hope it doesn't happen again.

 

[DerpMorg]

I don’t give a single solitary f*** about his on ice performance if he is still having difficulty with his dads passing. That’s the point I’m making.

This isn’t about replacing him. This about making sure he’s in a good spot mentally.

 

[guymez]

I don’t give a single solitary **** about his on ice performance if he is still having difficulty with his dads passing. That’s the point I’m making.

This isn’t about replacing him. This about making sure he’s in a good spot mentally.

It is preseason though so its hard to know just how dialed in he is. Many vets only go at 3/4 speed for these games so its hard to know if Larsson is doing that or if he is still in a funk.

I guess we just have to wait and see how this plays out. I truly hope that he is in a better place.

All that being said I have concerns about the Larsson Nurse pairing...we shall see how it works out.

 

[ujju2]

It is preseason though so its hard to know just how dialed in he is. Many vets only go at 3/4 speed for these games so its hard to know if Larsson is doing that or if he is still in a funk.

I guess we just have to wait and see how this plays out. I truly hope that he is in a better place.

All that being said I have concerns about the Larsson Nurse pairing...we shall see how it works out.

Agreed. I think one thing that I is hurting his party regardless of other factors is the lack of any chemistry between him and Nurse.

 

[DaGap]

1.) his Dad's death
2.) His back

He's done see if you can trade him for a MVP like forward

 

[Drivesaitl]

Step one: Remember it's preseason and these games mean nothing to a vet like z Larsson.

Step two: Watch the Oilers and Larsson in the regular season and see if he continues to suck.

Step three: Enjoy it if he doesn't suck... if he does... it's a huge blow to the Oilers and the Oilers need to come up with a plan to replace him moving forward. It will be three years of bad if he has another weak season.

He was NJ best defensemen when we acquired him.

He was a beast in 2016-2017. Both regular season and playoffs. Most/all hockey pundits actually has the Oilers winning "the trade" he played so well.

Having followed him in Jersey a bit and on the Oilers I never ever imagined he could possibly be as bad as he was the last 2 years.

I have no idea what happened but I hope it doesn't happen again.

Larsson has been crap for two seasons and counting now and was deplorable in preseason.

He was not NJ best D, not even Close. He was the underling of Andy Greene, who had always been NJ's best D and was essentially the playing tutor to all other D there.

Talbot was a "beast" in 2016-17. That Larsson made all that difference was fiction then, and has been outed since, that Larsson makes negligible difference.

"Won the trade" hahahahahahaha

"enjoy his play" nah, I'd prefer he was playing in Sweden again tbh.

Seeing this player, and seeing him suck all the time is just a bad bad reminder.

 

[Aerchon]

Larsson has been crap for two seasons and counting now and was deplorable in preseason.

He was not NJ best D, not even Close. He was the underling of Andy Greene, who had always been NJ's best D and was essentially the playing tutor to all other D there.

Talbot was a "beast" in 2016-17. That Larsson made all that difference was fiction then, and has been outed since, that Larsson makes negligible difference.

"Won the trade" hahahahahahaha

"enjoy his play" nah, I'd prefer he was playing in Sweden again tbh.

Seeing this player, and seeing him suck all the time is just a bad bad reminder.

People love revisionist history.

The last year he played in Jersey he was not "under" Greene. Only someone who did not follow the Devils that year would say that.

There were various media sources that declared the Oilers won that trade during the Oilers playoff appearance in 2017 and leading into the 2017-2018 season. Vegas had Edmonton being the Stanley Cup runner up after that year. Much praise was heaped on the Larsson acquisition.

I'm not saying it's right or wrong. I'm saying it happened, that's just the facts.

Talbot was no more or less beastly than Larsson that year IMO. They both had great years and both have gone on to suck badly since. As have the Oilers in general.

I really hope we get to see Larsson in beast mode for the Oilers again.

 

[Drivesaitl]

People love revisionist history.

The last year he played in Jersey he was not "under" Greene. Only someone who did not follow the Devils that year would say that.

There were various media sources that declared the Oilers won that trade during the Oilers playoff appearance in 2017 and leading into the 2017-2018 season. Vegas had Edmonton being the Stanley Cup runner up after that year. Much praise was heaped on the Larsson acquisition.

I'm not saying it's right or wrong. I'm saying it happened, that's just the facts.

Talbot was no more or less beastly than Larsson that year IMO. They both had great years and both have gone on to suck badly since. As have the Oilers in general.

I really hope we get to see Larsson in beast mode for the Oilers again.

You mean its a fact that idiots exist?

You can find people who believe the moon is made of cheese.

That's a fact...

I was never swayed by the Larsson hype. I've seen great D, a lot of them. Larsson was NEVER anything close to a great D. Barely moved the line over good. He was Jason Smith.

 

[Aerchon]

You mean its a fact that idiots exist?

You can find people who believe the moon is made of cheese.

That's a fact...

I was never swayed by the Larsson hype. I've seen great D, a lot of them. Larsson was NEVER anything close to a great D. Barely moved the line over good. He was Jason Smith.

To each their own.

Not the same player imo but I also liked Jason Smith too.

 

[Drivesaitl]

To each their own.

Not the same player imo but I also liked Jason Smith too.

Hype is hype. The over claims on the 16-17 season were utterly ridiculous. We barely got by SJ who were missing their best players through injury, we lost in 2nd round to a very ordinary Ducks team that has missed the playoffs since.

It was a mini run on a house of cards. It happens. But it was impossible to repeat. People read way too much into that season and I said so at the time. In fall 2017 this didn't even look like a playoff club.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

What is a bit surprising is that I remember Larsson hitting hard, being very strong along the boards (IMO our 2nd strongest player outside of Looch back in his first season here) yet he has as many hits in each of the last 2 seasons and he hasn't been nearly as bullish behind the net and in the corners. I think that his back has really hampered him the last 2 years as he hasn't really hammered guys as frequently. As with most players that rely on physicality, when they get hurt they aren't nearly as effective.

If Persson and Bear prove to be real NHL defensemen and with the impending arrival of Bouchard, Larsson's days are numbered unless he has a bounceback year this season.

 

[Aerchon]

My apologies but the idea that Vegas odds makers and the vast majority of hockey pundits were all idiots and you were right on the money back in the summer of o17 just doesn't really impress me.

There was 10 times more reason to be hyped after the real legitimate success of 2017 than there is for hypothetical "what if" line ups that never existed, or unfortunately, the line up we are going into this year with.

 

[Drivesaitl]

My apologies but the idea that Vegas odds makers and the vast majority of hockey pundits were all idiots and you were right on the money back in the summer of o17 just doesn't really impress me.

There was 10 times more reason to be hyped after the real legitimate success of 2017 than there is for hypothetical "what if" line ups that never existed, or unfortunately, the line up we are going into this year with.

"The vast majority of hockey pundits(…...were saying the Oilers were cup favorites" Is absolutely false and you know that.

Really its a ridiculous assertion that the 2017 starting lineup would be anything other than an also ran. Turns it time proved that to be right as well.

This lineup was going to compete for a cup? Any notion of that was supreme hyperbole. That team was missing useful forwards like Eberle, Perron, Purcell, Pouliot, and Slepy.

Where, really, was the offense going to come from with that lineup? Jussi Jokinen, Yamamato, Chris Kelly, lol.

We had enough talent there for a one line team, which. Which proved to be the case.

The good news is our lineup this season is probably better than the miserable lineup below.

The 17-18 season starting lineup was already well into the Chiarelli scorched earth policy. I don't know how people didn't spot it considering we were trading talent and getting dreck in return. It took awhile but Chia decimated the lineup by opening game 17-18 season.

Goaltenders	Left Defense	Right Defense
Cam Talbot	Oscar Klefbom	Adam Larsson
Laurent Brossoit	Kris Russell	Matt Benning
	Darnell Nurse	Eric Gryba
X – Yohann Auvitu
Left Wing	Center	Right Wing
Patrick Maroon	Connor McDavid	Leon Draisaitl
Milan Lucic	Ryan Nugent-Hopkins	Kailer Yamamoto
Drake Caggiula	Ryan Strome	Jussi Jokinen
Jujhar Khaira	Mark Letestu	Zack Kassian
X- Iiro Pakarinen	Chris Kelly*

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

 

[Fourier]

Larsson has been crap for two seasons and counting now and was deplorable in preseason.

He was not NJ best D, not even Close. He was the underling of Andy Greene, who had always been NJ's best D and was essentially the playing tutor to all other D there.

Talbot was a "beast" in 2016-17. That Larsson made all that difference was fiction then, and has been outed since, that Larsson makes negligible difference.

"Won the trade" hahahahahahaha

"enjoy his play" nah, I'd prefer he was playing in Sweden again tbh.

Seeing this player, and seeing him suck all the time is just a bad bad reminder.

The consensus amongst people who watched the team day in and day out was that in his last year with NJ Larsson was the best defenseman on the Devils in that year and a case could be made that he was Greene's equal in the previous year prior to that. Here is an article that supports this assertion.

The 2015-16 AATJ Awards for the Devils

What evidence do you have to support your position concerning the bolded claim?

 

[Fourier]

Nurse and Larsson have each made a couple of boneheaded plays. That's pretty clear, and they have paid for those with goals against. But as a pair that have actually been fairly effective outside of those plays. The shot totals and scoring chances they have given up are both very low relative to the time they were on the ice. Nurse and Larsson did a lot of good things in the game I saw live versus Arizona. But the mistakes were killers. They need to get rid of those and both will be fine.

 

[Drivesaitl]

The consensus amongst people who watched the team day in and day out was that in his last year with NJ Larsson was the best defenseman on the Devils in that year and a case could be made that he was Greene's equal in the previous year prior to that. Here is an article that supports this assertion.

The 2015-16 AATJ Awards for the Devils

What evidence do you have to support your position concerning the bolded claim?

You mean like Andy Greene being a good to great D for at least a decade and mentoring other D in that time.

Are we talking about who is actually the better D, or who had a very short time frame in which they fooled some people?

Lots of players, any position, can have a couple good seasons and disappear.


Are you, or anybody else going to argue though who is actually the better D, and who has had the better NHL career?

Lets see what the Devils org themselves have to say;

Devils Name Andy Greene Next Captain

The key point here that I've been saying for years;

"At 32, Greene leads a defense who not including himself, has an average age of 23.7. Partnered with Adam Larsson for the beginning of the season, Greene has mentored and served as an example for the young defense as they've become NHL regulars. It's not a coincidence every defenseman seems to improve their play alongside Greene."

But its a weird thing. Partner Greene with anybody and that's the Devils best pairing. Doesn't matter whether its Larsson, Lovejoy, Severin, and interestingly Greene and the Devils never even missed Larsson all that much if we're being honest. Greene-Lovejoy was a better pairing. But Greene isn't a sexy D in anyway. He's very competent, reliable, a work horse, and decent moving the puck, but gets less credit than he should. Many pundits feel his contributions are underrated.

 

[RegDunlop]

Hmmmm

Good arguments - both sides guys.

I think we can all agree though that he is an extremely capable NHL defenseman who is a shadow of what he was 2/3 years ago

 

[Aerchon]

You mean like Andy Greene being a good to great D for at least a decade and mentoring other D in that time.

Are we talking about who is actually the better D, or who had a very short time frame in which they fooled some people?

Lots of players, any position, can have a couple good seasons and disappear.


Are you, or anybody else going to argue though who is actually the better D, and who has had the better NHL career?

Lets see what the Devils org themselves have to say;

Devils Name Andy Greene Next Captain

The key point here that I've been saying for years;

"At 32, Greene leads a defense who not including himself, has an average age of 23.7. Partnered with Adam Larsson for the beginning of the season, Greene has mentored and served as an example for the young defense as they've become NHL regulars. It's not a coincidence every defenseman seems to improve their play alongside Greene."

But its a weird thing. Partner Greene with anybody and that's the Devils best pairing. Doesn't matter whether its Larsson, Lovejoy, Severin, and interestingly Greene and the Devils never even missed Larsson all that much if we're being honest. Greene-Lovejoy was a better pairing. But Greene isn't a sexy D in anyway. He's very competent, reliable, a work horse, and decent moving the puck, but gets less credit than he should. Many pundits feel his contributions are underrated.

Again, if you followed the Devils you would know that Greene struggled after they moved Larsson.

And since then in general I don't believe he has been as successful.