Proposal: 3 Way Trade (Sabres-Wild-Habs)

[Habs Halifax]

Sabres get
- Domi with extension (6 or 7 years somewhere between Ehlers and Nylander cap hits)
- 2020 4th from the Habs (Ducks pick)
- Rights to Ikonen. Injuries has set him back in development but when healthy, a good prospect with potential

Wild Get
- 8th OA
- Hillis. Solid B+ prospect at center with some potential
- 2020 4th from the Habs (Jets pick)

Habs Get
- Brodin with extension (6 or 7 years somewhere between Muzzin and Ellis cap hits)
- 2022 2nd from the Sabres
- 2021 2nd from the Wild

Click to read more...

 

[the Chad Kilger]

seems overly complex. 8OA for domi for brodin does make sense as someone without a horse in this race as sabres and habs want to complete. Minnesota embraces adding high end prospects they probably need a plus on top of the pick

 

[Habs Halifax]

seems overly complex. 8OA for domi for brodin does make sense as someone without a horse in this race as sabres and habs want to complete. Minnesota embraces adding high end prospects they probably need a plus on top of the pick

Best pieces in this package

1) Domi with extension
2) Brodin with extension
3) 8th OA dart

Adds need to come from all sides but the Habs giving up the young proven 25 year old Domi is the best piece. Don't agree. Try trading Brodin to the Sabres and the Habs stay out of it where we would be happy with Domi for 7 years at $6.5M cap hit.

Domi and Brodin are close but Domi is 2 years younger and has 2 RFA years. Brodin is UFA in one year so his sign/trade value is not as high as Domi. Player vs Player on the ice, it's close. But Domi is 2 years younger and Habs need more. I included Hillis cause the Wild are looking for young centers. Hate to trade him but I think the Wild would value him. He's the best piece after the obvious 3

Trying to help all 3 teams here but if some get cranky, Habs will just keep Domi

 

[AKL]

I get confused when people say Hillis is a B+ prospect, and it makes me feel like the Wild have a better prospect pool than I originally thought.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I get confused when people say Hillis is a B+ prospect, and it makes me feel like the Wild have a better prospect pool than I originally thought.

He is a very solid B prospect. Check out the depth on the Storm last year. Hillis and Gogolev dominated and the 3rd guy a substantial gap behind them. Hillis is better than you realize.

You really going to focus on Hillis in this package? Good job bud.

 

[Patagonia]

Sabres get
- Domi with extension (6 or 7 years somewhere between Ehlers and Nylander cap hits)
- 2020 4th from the Habs (Ducks pick)
- Rights to Ikonen. Injuries has set him back in development but when healthy, a good prospect with potential

Wild Get
- 8th OA
- Hillis. Solid B+ prospect at center with some potential
- 2020 4th from the Habs (Jets pick)

Habs Get
- Brodin with extension (6 or 7 years somewhere between Muzzin and Ellis cap hits)
- 2022 2nd from the Sabres
- 2021 2nd from the Wild

I think a direct deal between Habs & MIN would make sense.

Domi

for

Brodin

 

[Habs Halifax]

I think a direct deal between Habs & MIN would make sense.

Domi

for

Brodin

Some Wild fans prefer the pick though from the conversations I have had. If they are open to leaving the Sabres out of it and they want Domi over the 8th OA, we can talk. but I'm not trading Domi for Brodin as equals in a sign/trade value. I believe some Habs fans would but I wouldn't. The 25 year old Domi who has 2 RFA years left and just touching prime years is the biggest piece.

 

[Langdon Alger]

Would the Sabres move the 8OA for Domi?

 

[Habs Halifax]

Would the Sabres move the 8OA for Domi?

Some would and some would not I imagine. Sabres should be adding proven piece now vs later to avoid Eichel getting more frustrated with no playoffs. I expect them to make some moves

 

[AKL]

He is a very solid B prospect. Check out the depth on the Storm last year. Hillis and Gogolev dominated and the 3rd guy a substantial gap behind them. Hillis is better than you realize.

You really going to focus on Hillis in this package? Good job bud.

I don't have any issues with the Brodin for 8oa part. I just get confused when blue chip prospects are considered "A" prospects, and a 3rd round pick from two years ago that finally had his first decent season in the OHL as a 20 year old getting to center an even better 20 year old is considered a "B+" prospect.

I just compare him to our own Khovanov, who had similar draft year production (albeit Khovanov missed time with a significant injury that caused him to be out of shape when he returned), quite a bit better draft+1 production (though this time Hillis missed most of a season, not sure what the injury was), and significantly better draft+2 production. Nobody would say Khovanov is a B+ prospect, most people are hoping he can become a 2C, but there are still uncertainties. He's definitely a better prospect than Hillis is at this point, though, so assigning so much value to a guy who can, what, maybe become a 3C? 4C?

Hillis also isn't a great skater and has no stand out attributes from what I can tell. This isn't the first time MTL fans have tried to pimp up Hillis in a trade thread with MIN.

My point is, I wouldn't trade our 2nd rounder for a guy like Hillis and a 4th. I don't believe Hillis has that much value, I would rather keep our 2nd for use in a future deal or to try and draft someone better.

 

[Baksfamous112]

As another poster said deal looks too complicated for nothing. 3-way trade between Buffalo’s 2020 first round pick (given they are taken out in the play-in), signed Domi and signed Brodin does make sense though

 

[Habs Halifax]

I don't have any issues with the Brodin for 8oa part. I just get confused when blue chip prospects are considered "A" prospects, and a 3rd round pick from two years ago that finally had his first decent season in the OHL as a 20 year old getting to center an even better 20 year old is considered a "B+" prospect.

I just compare him to our own Khovanov, who had similar draft year production (albeit Khovanov missed time with a significant injury that caused him to be out of shape when he returned), quite a bit better draft+1 production (though this time Hillis missed most of a season, not sure what the injury was), and significantly better draft+2 production. Nobody would say Khovanov is a B+ prospect, most people are hoping he can become a 2C, but there are still uncertainties. He's definitely a better prospect than Hillis is at this point, though, so assigning so much value to a guy who can, what, maybe become a 3C? 4C?

Hillis also isn't a great skater and has no stand out attributes from what I can tell. This isn't the first time MTL fans have tried to pimp up Hillis in a trade thread with MIN.

My point is, I wouldn't trade our 2nd rounder for a guy like Hillis and a 4th. I don't believe Hillis has that much value, I would rather keep our 2nd for use in a future deal or to try and draft someone better.

Where Hillis was drafted is irrelevant today. And it's not a 2nd vs Hillis. It's the offset between Domi/Brodin/8th OA. Domi at 25 with 2 years on Brodin and 2 years of RFA is the best piece. Habs won't do that trade straight up.

The adds are required if I pull that trigger. Adds can be negotiated but it has to be worth it for the Habs or I just keep Domi and play him wing while we explore other options.

You don't like Hillis? Adds are certainly negotiable but the adds coming back to the Habs need to be higher than the adds going to the Wild or Sabres. No deal? That's fine with me

 

[Habs Halifax]

As another poster said deal looks too complicated for nothing. 3-way trade between Buffalo’s 2020 first round pick (given they are taken out in the play-in), signed Domi and signed Brodin does make sense though

Domi is the best piece. I would not do that trade straight up with no adds. The adds are not there to complicate it. It's there to offset the values and give each team something added on. It's not the first time this concept was introduced and it's not that complicated really.

 

[DiglettDangles]

OP, you're well known around the Habs and Trade boards for repeatedly showing interest in Brodin and/or Buffalo's 1st in deals involving Domi.
People have expressed their feedback on multi-page discussions, and while I did not comment earlier, I would personally be open to both.
But what more do you expect to get out of this discussion with yet again the same assets involved?

 

[Langdon Alger]

Some would and some would not I imagine. Sabres should be adding proven piece now vs later to avoid Eichel getting more frustrated with no playoffs. I expect them to make some moves

I just wonder if maybe they couldn’t get a player for the 8th overall pick than Domi. Not saying he’s bad, but maybe another team offers up a better player. Plus he isn’t coming off a great year, so his value isn’t at an all time high.

 

[Habs Halifax]

OP, you're well known around the Habs and Trade boards for repeatedly showing interest in Brodin and/or Buffalo's 1st in deals involving Domi.
People have expressed their feedback on multi-page discussions, and while I did not comment earlier, I would personally be open to both.
But what more do you expect to get out of this discussion with yet again the same assets involved?

3 way trade between the Sabres, Wild, and Habs has not been discussed before. Between the Wild and Habs only, I am not even sure I pull the trigger on Domi with extension for Brodin with extension and a 2nd. I've seen chatter between Habs and Sabres and Habs and Wild so I merged it. And yes, I added two 2nd's going to the Habs cause (agree or not), I think Domi at 25 with two RFA years left is the best piece. If Brodin was the same age and under team control, I probably would be saying they are very close (Take your pick).

 

[Habs Halifax]

I just wonder if maybe they couldn’t get a player for the 8th overall pick than Domi. Not saying he’s bad, but maybe another team offers up a better player. Plus he isn’t coming off a great year, so his value isn’t at an all time high.

Post the 8th OA in a separate thread and see what you get offered. Doubt you get a guy at 25 who can play wing or center and can put up 55-75 pts. And consider this... Who has Domi played with so far in his career? Who is the best player he has played with? You will have a hard time figuring that out.

Domi played with Cousins, Lehkonen, Drouin, Suzuki, Armia, Weal this year. He had no stable line to play on. Last year he played with Shaw and sometimes Drouin and Lehkonen.

As a Habs fans, I am very worried about trading him and he ends up a pt/game player on another team cause he has better talent to play with. This is why I would demand adds like I did.

 

[AKL]

Where Hillis was drafted is irrelevant today. And it's not a 2nd vs Hillis. It's the offset between Domi/Brodin/8th OA. Domi at 25 with 2 years on Brodin and 2 years of RFA is the best piece. Habs won't do that trade straight up.

The adds are required if I pull that trigger. Adds can be negotiated but it has to be worth it for the Habs or I just keep Domi and play him wing while we explore other options

Domi is the best piece. I would not do that trade straight up with no adds. The adds are not there to complicate it. It's there to offset the values and give each team something added on. It's not the first time this concept was introduced.

The thing about Domi is he's 25, which for many forwards is not "just entering their prime" but pretty much smack dab in the middle of it. And historically he's only been about a 50 point player, apart from one season, which IS the exception at the moment. He's not being traded for as a 70 point center, he's being traded for as a 50 point guy who might have more in him, and can be a band-aid center because our only other options are Joel Eriksson Ek. Further, if Brodin has the extension, it doesn't really matter that Domi is 2 years younger, because you know you still have X number of years of control over Brodin. His game will certainly age well enough to keep him at the current level for another 7-10 years because he relies on his brain, not his body. Same can't be said for Domi.

The Wild fanbase is pretty split on trading either Brodin or Dumba for Domi. We acknowledge that Domi isn't a natural center, and doesn't have the value he would if he were. We're open to a trade for him because he could fill in temporarily alongside Fiala or Kaprizov and probably not look awful doing it, and because he could be the most available option this summer. But we're not going to add significant value to get it done, and frankly, there haven't been any rumblings of Guerin even being interested in trading either of those defensemen for Domi. He refused to move Brodin for Trochek, who would have been a better option at center than Domi.

Minnesota management is perfectly fine with keeping Brodin on the defense and looking for another option too. That street goes both ways.

 

[Langdon Alger]

Post the 8th OA in a separate thread and see what you get offered. Doubt you get a guy at 25 who can play wing or center and can put up 55-75 pts. And consider this... Who has Domi played with so far in his career? Who is the best player he has played with? You will have a hard time figuring that out.

Domi played with Cousins, Lehkonen, Drouin, Suzuki, Armia, Weal this year. He had no stable line to play on. Last year he played with Shaw and sometimes Drouin and Lehkonen.

As a Habs fans, I am very worried about trading him and he ends up a pt/game player on another team cause he has better talent to play with

he’s not coming off a great year though, and that’s my main concern with your proposal. I do agree Buffalo needs immediate help to make Eichel happy and get back to the playoffs, so your proposal might work, but it’s hard moving a guy for the 8th pick when his value isn’t that high.

What do you think is the main reason he had such a down year compared to the year before?

 

[Habs Halifax]

The thing about Domi is he's 25, which for many forwards is not "just entering their prime" but pretty much smack dab in the middle of it. And historically he's only been about a 50 point player, apart from one season, which IS the exception at the moment. He's not being traded for as a 70 point center, he's being traded for as a 50 point guy who might have more in him, and can be a band-aid center because our only other options are Joel Eriksson Ek. Further, if Brodin has the extension, it doesn't really matter that Domi is 2 years younger, because you know you still have X number of years of control over Brodin. His game will certainly age well enough to keep him at the current level for another 7-10 years because he relies on his brain, not his body. Same can't be said for Domi.

The Wild fanbase is pretty split on trading either Brodin or Dumba for Domi. We acknowledge that Domi isn't a natural center, and doesn't have the value he would if he were. We're open to a trade for him because he could fill in temporarily alongside Fiala or Kaprizov and probably not look awful doing it, and because he could be the most available option this summer. But we're not going to add significant value to get it done, and frankly, there haven't been any rumblings of Guerin even being interested in trading either of those defensemen for Domi. He refused to move Brodin for Trochek, who would have been a better option at center than Domi.

Minnesota management is perfectly fine with keeping Brodin on the defense and looking for another option too. That street goes both ways.

2nd tier talent have prime years from 25-30 (+/-). Some start a bit early or finish a bit late but if you have prime years well before 25, you are near star level. Look at Brodin, his best season comes at 26 this past year. Didn't take a massive jump forward but you can see a little jump as he will be 27 here soon.

If the Habs plans with Brodin fall through, we can try Leddy. Islanders need cap space to sign Barzal and Pulock. Brodin is a great fit with Petry and that's why I would consider Domi to get him. Habs will not trade Domi lightly. Works two ways. This is a hockey trade so if you want to engage, you engage. If you don't, don't. But if the situation was reversed and you had Domi where we had Brodin, you would ask us for more.

I have no interest in Dumba. I'm looking for a certain type of piece that I feel might be available.

 

[Habs Halifax]

he’s not coming off a great year though, and that’s my main concern with your proposal. I do agree Buffalo needs immediate help to make Eichel happy and get back to the playoffs, so your proposal might work, but it’s hard moving a guy for the 8th pick when his value isn’t that high.

What do you think is the main reason he had such a down year compared to the year before?

If Domi was coming off back to back 70+ seasons, you can't touch him in trade value. You think the 8th OV gets you a sniff of a guy at 25 who has two seasons over 70+ pts and can play center? Domi was still on pace for 50+ pts and 20 goals in a season where he played with almost 10 different line mates.

You think guys like Raymond, Holtz, Rossi, Quinn end up as good or better than Domi? I'm not offering some 30 year old here.

 

[AKL]

2nd tier talent have prime years from 25-30 (+/-). Some start a bit early or finish a bit late but if you have prime years well before 25, you are near star level. Look at Brodin, his best season comes at 26 this past year. Didn't take a massive jump forward but you can see a little jump as he will be 27 here soon.

If the Habs plans with Brodin fall through, we can try Leddy. Islanders need cap space to sign Barzal and Pulock. Brodin is a great fit with Petry and that's why I would consider Domi to get him. Habs will not trade Domi lightly. Works two ways. This is a hockey trade so if you want to engage, you engage. If you don't, don't. But if the situation was reversed and you had Domi where we had Brodin, you would ask us for more.

I have no interest in Dumba. I'm looking for a certain type of piece that I feel might be available.

The only reason I'm willing to add more to Brodin is because I prefer the 8th overall to Domi in the first place. Now you're speaking as if the deal is Domi for Brodin, and I wouldn't add anything to Brodin (with an extension) to get Domi. It's either 1 for 1, or I don't do it. It's that simple.

Like I said, Domi would be a band-aid center for us. He's a 50 point LW that has been able to cover center in the past. If Brodin is willing to sign a reasonable extension with the receiving team, it would open up more options for us than Domi, and I'll explore those.

 

[KaprizovEntitlelist]

Brodin was never available, neither Dumba was either. The value an NHL General manager Bill Guerin sees in both is different than a Montreal or other Minnesota fans sees of them.

Leaving this tweet here from a freelance Minnesota wild podcaster: A while ago, some of you attacked me, but the truth is Guerin was never trading either for nothing short of what he perceives as 1c.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Not a future #1 Center. A #1 Center right now. That’s been reported in Minnesota to what it would likely take for a team to pry him away and I’m still not convinced they’ll move him</p>&mdash; Brett Marshall (@B_Marsh92) <a href="">June 19, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Habs Halifax]

The only reason I'm willing to add more to Brodin is because I prefer the 8th overall to Domi in the first place. Now you're speaking as if the deal is Domi for Brodin, and I wouldn't add anything to Brodin (with an extension) to get Domi. It's either 1 for 1, or I don't do it. It's that simple.

Like I said, Domi would be a band-aid center for us. He's a 50 point LW that has been able to cover center in the past. If Brodin is willing to sign a reasonable extension with the receiving team, it would open up more options for us than Domi, and I'll explore those.

Why are you concerned with what the Habs get if you get your 8th OA and you were willing to add on top of Brodin to get the 8th? Why are you concerned with the Sabres getting Domi? Sounds like your narrative is to dump on Domi and he's not even going to the Wild in this package. Weird bud

If Domi is a 50 pts winger, Brodin is a 20 pts D man who can barely score 5 goals. I think you are guilty for accepting the absolute best value for the pending UFA in Brodin and trolling Domi.

In all sign trades where the player is a pending UFA... the value increases but not to full value. So you are not getting full value for Brodin as if he is a controllable team asset like Domi is with his 2 RFA years

 

[Langdon Alger]

If Domi was coming off back to back 70+ seasons, you can't touch him in trade value. You think the 8th OV gets you a sniff of a guy at 25 who has two seasons over 70+ pts and can play center? Domi was still on pace for 50+ pts and 20 goals in a season where he played with almost 10 different line mates.

You think guys like Raymond, Holtz, Rossi, Quinn end up as good or better than Domi? I'm not offering some 30 year old here.

Even if those guys you mentioned don’t end up better than Domi, the advantage to keeping the pick is they are younger and will cost less, at least for the first three years of their deals. I think Buffalo is a good team to look at to trade their first, because as we already discussed, they need to get into the playoffs. You may be right that Domi is worth that pick, but I’m not completely convinced. Depends on how highly the Sabres view him.

I think your proposal is interesting and it has created discussion, which is good, since so many proposals on here don’t accomplish that since so many trade proposals are so one sided.