Draft 2020 Draft & Undrafted Free Agent Thread: Part VII

[Oscar Lindberg]

Reading that Athletic piece just shows me scouting and drafting in general is a total crapshoot haha

 

[Edge]

It's a fun read but this made me chuckle, on Noel Gunler:


Scout in favor: “He’s grown on me. He’s got skill, he makes a lot of plays, he has a big shot and he can make himself known physically. This guy is going to score in the NHL and will help your power play.”

Scout against: “His compete is in and out, it’s hard to trust him. If the skill and speed were high-end and he could create his own chances, it would be one thing, but he needs someone to create for him and his effort is inconsistent. In the top 30-40, he wouldn’t be for me.”

It's like looking at the girl at the bar. People see different things.

 

[bobbop]

I don’t scout anywhere near the level of some of the experts here but when we were Expected to slot in the teens, I did watch tape of Holloway from early in the season and late in the season. Completely different player.

If he was available at #22 I would be ecstatic. But he won’t be.

 

[JCProdigy]

I honestly think there will be some really good choices on the board that could lead to a tremendous outcome.

I know we're focused on names like Lundell or Mercer, but I think there's quite a bit of runway with names that will be available at 22.

And frankly, with the depth we have in our system, who's to say they might not click with the right teammate and end up in a high profile role?

....and this is where Lafreniere and Kakko hitting their ceilings in their prime would be so huge for reasons beyond their individual play. Much like Panarin showed, they can have the ability to carry a line and as such, a #22 OA drafted forward in 3-4 years.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Holloway at 22 is a good pick, although as been stated I can't imagine he's there for us to take

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

It's like looking at the girl at the bar. People see different things.

Yep. And this is why all this is fun, but shouldn't be taken too serious. It's a fun article, but it reminds me of what we see each year. Scouts like or dislike certain players for various reasons and others will disagree with that. I find myself coming away frustrated when watching Raymond and if I had a top-5 pick, I wouldn't be so sure I would pick him. However, others are walking away with him saying he's the 3rd best or even 2nd best in this draft.

 

[Leetch3]

I don’t scout anywhere near the level of some of the experts here but when we were Expected to slot in the teens, I did watch tape of Holloway from early in the season and late in the season. Completely different player.

If he was available at #22 I would be ecstatic. But he won’t be.

and that is a huge thing when looking at conflicting scouting reports. often these scouts are seeing a limited sample size because they are trying to see so many scouts. and rarely are players consistent game in and out. so depending on which games you saw, it could give you drastically different views

 

[Edge]

and that is a huge thing when looking at conflicting scouting reports. often these scouts are seeing a limited sample size because they are trying to see so many scouts. and rarely are players consistent game in and out. so depending on which games you saw, it could give you drastically different views

Growth throughout a season is one of the big attractions for a lot of scouts and observers.

For example, if you're talking about growth from begining to end, guys like Holloway, Greig, Sanderson, Guhle, etc. all come into play.

If you're talking about steady play from beginning to end, you're probably hearing names like Zary, Lundell, Amirov, Drysdale, Bourque, etc.

 

[Joey Bones]

This interview with Greig is quite interesting. Apparently he's not headed to Sweden anymore and does not want his dad to draft him (aka the Flyers)....

Brandon's Greig urging his dad, a Flyers scout, not to draft him

 

[Joey Bones]

Great article on scouts' diverging takes on the more controversial prospects in this year's draft:

NHL Draft prospects up for debate: Who causes the biggest divide among scouts?

A couple of examples for the guys who've received a ton of coverage here:

Holloway:


Gunler:


Lapierre:


Others covered:

Kaiden Guhle
Tyson Foerster
Jeremie Poirier
Jack Quinn
Anton Lundell
Justin Barron
Tyler Kleven
William Wallinder
Will Cuylle

It's stuff like this why the Athletic is totally worth the price.

Those Holloway and Lapierre comments are accurate. We see those same concerns, either positive or negative, on this board site all the time, lolol.

It's interesting to hear a scout's negative view on Gunler. At least he didn't say he had an attitude issue, lolol.

 

[Edge]

Those Holloway and Lapierre comments are accurate. We see those same concerns, either positive or negative, on this board site all the time, lolol.

It's interesting to hear a scout's negative view on Gunler. At least he didn't say he had an attitude issue, lolol.

I will say that his personality is something that comes up fairly regularly. Even the people who speak highly of him admit that he has some growing up to do.

Sometimes that's a red flag, other times that kid becomes Marc Savard.

 

[Leetch3]

Growth throughout a season is one of the big attractions for a lot of scouts and observers.

For example, if you're talking about growth from beginging to end, guys like Holloway, Greig, Sanderson, Guhle, etc. all come into play.

If you're talking about steady play from beginning to end, you're probably hearing names like Zary, Lundell, Amirov, Drysdale, Bourque, etc.

getting better as the year goes on is definitely big, especially for a younger players like Greig. But I was also thinking about inconsistency and hot/cold streaks from game to game....you could easily have a completely different view on a player based on which games you saw them...

but my assumption would be the nhl teams have their staff seeing a much higher volume of games especially for the players they are focused on, giving them a clearer picture, then you'd get from independent scouting that fans get to see.

 

[Leetch3]

This interview with Greig is quite interesting. Apparently he's not headed to Sweden anymore and does not want his dad to draft him (aka the Flyers)....

Brandon's Greig urging his dad, a Flyers scout, not to draft him

Doesn't want to play for philly. I love him already lol

 

[Edge]

getting better as the year goes on is definitely big, especially for a younger players like Greig. But I was also thinking about inconsistency and hot/cold streaks from game to game....you could easily have a completely different view on a player based on which games you saw them...

but my assumption would be the nhl teams have their staff seeing a much higher volume of games especially for the players they are focused on, giving them a clearer picture, then you'd get from independent scouting that fans get to see.

Strangely enough it can cut both ways.

If a team focuses on a player, they see the player multiple times in person, often with multiple scouts and front office personnel taking looks to get a consensus, and then review a ton of footage of the player.

Quite a few teams will also recruit local videographers and others to film videos of prospects of in action. In some cases, the videographers sole purpose is to keep the camera on the player.

Teams will then look at how he reacts to plays around him, how he intereacts with teammates, how he interacts with the opposition, his body language, how he reacts to instruction, etc.

As for what teams see, in some cases there might be fans who have a much better read on a player than scouts do. You have knowledgeable fans, people who played or worked in the sport, who teams might chat with because they know that person is going to see a prospect 25-36 times a season in the CHL.

Believe it or not, they will look to see if the notes match up or if there is anything to consider that they may have overlooked.

It's quite common in the weeks leading up the draft for teams to go back and re-watch footage because something was brought to their attention.

 

[Joey Bones]

Doesn't want to play for philly. I love him already lol

I think it's primarily because his dad is a scout with the Flyers and he expressed interest of trying to work his own path into the NHL without being viewed by the "bloodlines".

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I think it's primarily because his dad is a scout with the Flyers and he expressed interest of trying to work his own path into the NHL without being viewed by the "bloodlines".

He won't get to Philly's pick so he doesn't have to worry about that.

 

[JCProdigy]

I will say that his personality is something that comes up fairly regularly. Even the people who speak highly of him admit that he has some growing up to do.

Sometimes that's a red flag, other times that kid becomes Marc Savard.

Only "problem" is usually, like Marc Savard's case, the success is not with the team that drafted them.

 

[LaffyTaffy]

Something interesting this year is that without the tradition draft we dont have any inside info on who the Rangers have been interviewing and liking. I remember the hype last year with all the videos being released and us trying to figure out who we interviewed @Edge

 

[wafflepadsave]

It's like looking at the girl at the bar. People see different things.

I wanna talk with the guy that hasn’t had too many yet.

 

[wafflepadsave]

I don’t scout anywhere near the level of some of the experts here but when we were Expected to slot in the teens, I did watch tape of Holloway from early in the season and late in the season. Completely different player.

If he was available at #22 I would be ecstatic. But he won’t be.

Bob, I have to wonder if that wasn’t the best environment to adjust to being a down year and not as many good players.

 

[cwede]

in case you guys didn't see this at the trade board,
and sorry if someone else already posted
- just another unsubstantiated 'insider' rumor ...

On the Missin Curfew Podcast, former NHL’er Jimmy Hayes says he’s heard a few trade rumors.
....
- NYR 1stOA pick for Brady Tkachuk + 3rdOA
... he heard this from somebody who is connected to a lot of national league GM’s.

 

[bobbop]

Bob, I have to wonder if that wasn’t the best environment to adjust to being a down year and not as many good players.

Agreed. Some kids also mature at different ages. He was pretty young for NCAA. Just watch some of his late season tape (vs. Penn State)

 

[mike14]

Ok, this is probably just me getting overly picky with words, but figured I'd ask anyway.
Leslie posted on Twitter that as part of the online interviews with prospects Perfetti "agrees that he is a hockey savant".
Is Perfetti saying that:
a. He's studies the game to such a degree that he could be considered a savant (a learned scholar, someone with a higher level of understanding, a master),
b. he is a savant in that his hockey skills are off the charts but his development is limited in other areas (ie 'savant syndrome'), or
was it just a really poor choice of words by whoever asked the question and he's just trying to say that hockey is his life and he enjoys practicing and learning the game?

I ask because either A or B would raise different flags for me in terms of drafting.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Imagine drafting a player based off of one game and ignoring 2/3rds of the season.

Ok, this is probably just me getting overly picky with words, but figured I'd ask anyway.
Leslie posted on Twitter that as part of the online interviews with prospects Perfetti "agrees that he is a hockey savant".
Is Perfetti saying that:
a. He's studies the game to such a degree that he could be considered a savant (a learned scholar, someone with a higher level of understanding, a master),
b. he is a savant in that his hockey skills are off the charts but his development is limited in other areas (ie 'savant syndrome'), or
was it just a really poor choice of words by whoever asked the question and he's just trying to say that hockey is his life and he enjoys practicing and learning the game?

I ask because either A or B would raise different flags for me in terms of drafting.

Why would A raise flags for you?

 

[mike14]

Imagine drafting a player based off of one game and ignoring 2/3rds of the season.



Why would A raise flags for you?

A minor one, but it would raise a flag about ego and where the player thinks they are in their standing and understanding of the game. Do they honestly believe they are one of the most learned? If so will they listen to other players/coaches, or do they know better? Will they tune out if it is things they don't agree with?