Draft 2020 Draft & Undrafted Free Agent Thread: Part VII

[Harbour Dog]

We can have a second plate as long as we stop calling him Alf

And so begins the hunger strike.

 

[eco's bones]

I agree and I don't.

I think Lapierre has shown glimpses that he is capable of scoring goals and beating goalies with his shot. He just hasn't done it consistently enough. Now, whether that's a result of his playing style or the injuries is another question. But he's definitely shown an ability, including this pre-season where he seems hell-bent on showing that he can shoot too.

Generally speaking, I've always found that playmaking prospects tend to have their goal scoring ability discounted, yet they tend to carry over their success rates because they're generally smarter, higher-IQ players.

It's not a hard rule, but I find myself more comfortable that a playmaker who tops out at 20-25 goals at the junior level can net 15-20 goal in the NHL than a guy with a reputation as a "sniper" can get within the same range of his junior league goal totals.

In other words, I can envision a 25 goal/115 point CHL player hitting the 15-20 goal, 65 point point level at the NHL more than I can envision a 50 goal/90 point CHL player hitting 35 goals, or even 30 at the NHL level.

I just tend to feel like playmakers find a way to translate the high-percentange shots better than the kids who are volume shooters and who take advantage of the space at the junior level.

Well so far in 67 games in the Q he has 15 goals + 3 in 4 playoff games. That's not anything special for that league. I guess we're going to get something of a peek at another Q season though leading up to Oct. 6. It is necessary for an offensive player to be something of a goal scoring threat if only to keep the opposition honest. I've seen some people comparing Lapierre's junior goal scoring numbers to Barzal but Barzal is continually driving the net (which is what kind of strikes me with a guy like Jarvis) and the WHL is usually a harder league to score in.

 

[Polar Bear]

Hype train engaged! Lezzzz do it!

 

[Edge]

Well so far in 67 games in the Q he has 15 goals + 3 in 4 playoff games. That's not anything special for that league. I guess we're going to get something of a peek at another Q season though leading up to Oct. 6. It is necessary for an offensive player to be something of a goal scoring threat if only to keep the opposition honest. I've seen some people comparing Lapierre's junior goal scoring numbers to Barzal but Barzal is continually driving the net (which is what kind of strikes me with a guy like Jarvis) and the WHL is usually a harder league to score in.

Assuming the health is there, I would "expect" offensive production that somewhat looks like what you see from Krejci. I think Lapierre's D+1 and D+2 goal scoring would probably look similar to Krejci's in the Q, and maybe his NHL numbers as well.

 

[JCProdigy]

The way it feels for me right now is like the #1 is like I've just had the best dinner of my life and the #22 is dessert, lot's of good options and I might have a preference, but not really any that I'd be terribly upset about getting

In this scenario Lapierre is like that artisan 3 scoops of different flavored ice cream, made in house from natural ingredients including whole milk. It's so smooth, rich, and creamy....only problem is the Rangers are somewhat lactose intolerant.

I feel like Lafreniere is an amazing 10 oz. filet mignon. That 22nd pick might give us the chance to add a hell of a crab cake/lobster tail to go with.

I've always wanted that one draft where we really look back and it feels like we just nailed/aced it.

Not a B, or a B-plus, or even just an A. I want that A+ draft that we talk about 20 years from now. Something that looks like Montreal's 2007 draft, or Anaheim's or Nashville's 2003 draft.

I want the draft I feel like we should've had in 1990 if we didn't take Michael Stewart and instead went with Keith Tkachuk, or the draft we could've had in 1988 if we didn't trade our first for a coach and had instead managed to select Roenick, Selanne, or Brind'amour.

I feel like we've always flirted with that possibility. But I want that one draft where it feels like the outcome you'd want playing Franchise in the NHL video game series.

Curse you for bringing up that 1988 draft and the trading of a first round pick for Bergeron. I had wiped that awfulness from my memory. Now imagine this board being here during that dumbass move by Espo....and people want Gorton fired.

The first round of the '18 draft still has a chance to be a homerun if all three picks really really hit their potential, unlikely as that may be.

 

[Edge]

In this scenario Lapierre is like that artisan 3 scoops of different flavored ice cream, made in house from natural ingredients including whole milk. It's so smooth, rich, and creamy....only problem is the Rangers are somewhat lactose intolerant.

Curse you for bringing up that 1988 draft and the trading of a first round pick for Bergeron. I had wiped that awfulness from my memory. Now imagine this board being here during that dumbass move by Espo....and people want Gorton fired.

The first round of the '18 draft still has a chance to be a homerun if all three picks really really hit their potential, unlikely as that may be.

The 2018 draft certainly has the potential based on that first round. Factor in Keane (and how we used him) and Pajuniemi and you've got a lot of potential to work with.

Frankly, 2019 looks damn good too with Kakko, Robertson and company.

If anything it's those two drafts that make me feel a little more comfortable rolling the dice on Lapierre if he's there.

Getting a top 10 pick, let alone the top pick is highly unlikely to happen again anytime soon. I also think we're getting past the point of moving guys for picks. In that sense, the Skjei deal kind of feels like the end of a chapter for the Rangers. I don't know when we'll have multiple firsts again --- though I think it's likely to be a little while if the Rangers can help it.

So this might be our last chance to do something like this for a while.

 

[Heckler81]

I feel like Lafreniere is an amazing 10 oz. filet mignon. That 22nd pick might give us the chance to add a hell of a crab cake/lobster tail to go with.

I've always wanted that one draft where we really look back and it feels like we just nailed/aced it.

Not a B, or a B-plus, or even just an A. I want that A+ draft that we talk about 20 years from now. Something that looks like Montreal's 2007 draft, or Anaheim's or Nashville's 2003 draft.

I want the draft I feel like we should've had in 1990 if we didn't take Michael Stewart and instead went with Keith Tkachuk, or the draft we could've had in 1988 if we didn't trade our first for a coach and had instead managed to select Roenick, Selanne, or Brind'amour.

I feel like we've always flirted with that possibility. But I want that one draft where it feels like the outcome you'd want playing Franchise in the NHL video game series.

filet mignon? Lafreniere is more like a 96 oz Tomahawk Ribeye!!!!!

 

[QJL]

I feel like this draft is full of guys who "play center but project to be a winger at the NHL level" . Like who are the stone cold Centers outside of Byfield and Lundell?

Zary
Lapierre

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Zary
Lapierre

Think Zary makes it to 22? I feel like he's the type we need more than a Lapierre type

 

[Leetch3]

Think Zary makes it to 22? I feel like he's the type we need more than a Lapierre type

are there concerns with his skating? or am I confusing him with someone else?

 

[Leetch3]

the more I get interested and excited about potential players at 22 the more i'm certain that JG is going to trade the pick the day before the draft LOL

 

[Polar Bear]

the more I get interested and excited about potential players at 22 the more i'm certain that JG is going to trade the pick the day before the draft LOL

It's far from impossible he does. If we can find the right 2C or D piece whose age fits our timeline, I would not be surprised at all if 22 is traded.

 

[Edge]

are there concerns with his skating? or am I confusing him with someone else?

Some with the skating, the high-end skills, and how both impact the offense at higher levels.

He's arguably the most well-rounded center in the draft. The question is whether you're looking at a two-way second line type, or more of a third line type.

He's one of the older prospects slated to go in the first round, so there's some belief there may not be quite as much for growth as some other options.

 

[Leetch3]

It's far from impossible he does. If we can find the right 2C or D piece whose age fits our timeline, I would not be surprised at all if 22 is traded.

it feels like last year...the top pick was a no brainer and warranted no discussion so we spent all our time looking at the 2nd pick and then it was dealt.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

the more I get interested and excited about potential players at 22 the more i'm certain that JG is going to trade the pick the day before the draft LOL

There's about a 70% chance he trades the pick, yeah lol.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Some with the skating, the high-end skills, and how both impact the offense at higher levels.

He's arguably the most well-rounded center in the draft. The question is whether you're looking at a two-way second line type, or more of a third line type.

He's one of the older prospects slated to go in the first round, so there's some belief there may not be quite as much for growth as some other options.

I always find this so ridiculous. The "older" prospects are still 18 years old (19 for some like Laf because the draft was postponed)! Does it really make that much of a difference?

 

[Polar Bear]

There's about a 70% chance he trades the pick, yeah lol.

I don't know if I'd go nearly that high, but it's certainly not an insignificant number.

 

[CaptTennille]

I do wonder if the Rangers see Greig as a currently undercooked version of Zary. He may not have shined as brightly this year, but he has flashes of excellent vision and puck skills (like Zary), loves to be in the middle of things all over the ice(like Zary) and is better skater and may have more room for physical maturation.

 

[Edge]

I always find this so ridiculous. The "older" prospects are still 18 years old (19 for some like Laf because the draft was postponed)! Does it really make that much of a difference?

It does and it doesn't.

Generally speaking, you have a pretty good trajectory of your player within a year of drafting them. In other words, you tend to know pretty quickly whether or not flaws are being polished, whether growth meets, exceeds, or is coming in under expectations, etc.

So having an extra year can go a long way toward cementing a player's reputation, or in most cases the "perception" of that player. But that cuts two ways.

For someone like Lafreniere, it pointed a bigger spotlight on his competitive nature, his ability to step up in big games, and his place among the top picks from the last decade or so.

For someone like Zary, it pointed to a player who is very smart, but still wasn't really dominating his peers on a skill or talent level. He was out-thinking them most nights. But it may have also re-affirmed that you're potentially looking at more of a middle six support player at the NHL level.

Or maybe a more apt counter to Zary might be someone like Greig, who is a year younger. Zary was consistent from start to finish of the season, but what you saw was essentially what you got with him. In Greig's case, the player he was at the end of the year was substantially different than the player you saw earlier in the year. He showcased more skills, better decision making, maybe a more attractive set of tools for scouts as the season progressed.

Seeing as he's roughly the same age as Zary was last year, some scouts start comparing the players at the same points in time. Is Greig equal to, better, or worse than Zary was last year at the same points? If you think Greig was better, and you feel you saw more growth over the same period, now you attempt to project what his age 18/19 season might look like compared to Zary.

Depending on how you feel, you may start to elevate Greig, while dropping Zary a little. Now you do that for 4 and 5 guys and suddenly you have the difference between the guy you prefer at 15 vs. the guy you have 20th on your list.

Likewise, you have some scouts who pay less attention to the age difference.

But I'd say most scouts factor into their equations because it's maturity, it's skill development, it's physical development, and in-season player growth. In some cases you might have a preference for the younger kid who is "punching up" to compete with bigger, stronger, and older kids compared to a kid who is "punching down" against younger, and maybe less developed or experienced competition.

 

[eco's bones]

Assuming the health is there, I would "expect" offensive production that somewhat looks like what you see from Krejci. I think Lapierre's D+1 and D+2 goal scoring would probably look similar to Krejci's in the Q, and maybe his NHL numbers as well.

Well that would be a very good player.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I do wonder if the Rangers see Greig as a currently undercooked version of Zary. He may not have shined as brightly this year, but he has flashes of excellent vision and puck skills (like Zary), loves to be in the middle of things all over the ice(like Zary) and is better skater and may have more room for physical maturation.

Offensive game wise, maybe but he has that natural bark to his game that a bunch of guys don't have.

His game really took off late in the year (including a stand out performance against Prince Albert. Ottawa was the favorite to win the Memorial Cup but I bet PA would have ended up shutting them down) so if you take him in the 1st, you're banking on him building off of that rather than it just being a hot streak. If that flash was the start of progression, we'll be talking about Greig as a top half of the 1st round guy a few years from now when someone inevitably does a 2020 NHL re-draft.

The one element that we sorely lack (and really, a ton of teams lack) are guys who are willing to fight for their ice and win those battles. Kreider does it when he's locked in, Fast did it, Lemieux can do it when he's trying to play hockey and not troll everyone. Lafreniere has that in spades and Greig does too. Would be an excellent add to our prospect pool and a player who would fit in seamlessly when ever he's NHL ready (likely 3-4 years down the line.)

 

[Cag29]

filet mignon? Lafreniere is more like a 96 oz Tomahawk Ribeye!!!!!

It’s coming !!!

 

[Mikos87]

Your first overall pick this year is a Wagyu Oyster Cut. Not something you get so easily.

 

[TheWhiskeyThief]

Reminds me of the debates we were having on Boqvist. He’s done ok so far but I would be hesitant with head injuries.

D is still an issue(but not the horrorshow it was,) figured out how to use his shot but the other things that made him interesting have been turned off(for now.)

 

[TheWhiskeyThief]

if this draft is so deep and the difference between (say) #15 and #35 is slight, then why not? The Senators have so many picks after their top two #1’s.

In my model the difference between 15 & 35 is more than double: you go from a probable 2nd liner to a low end 3rd/4th liner.