2020/2021 Around the League Thread | Part 3

[Snatcher Demko]

Bergevin is on the hot seat too. As he should be. The Habs have been middling for too long.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Bergevin is on the hot seat too. As he should be. The Habs have been middling for too long.

He was getting high praise a month ago for transforming the Habs.

 

[WTG]

He was getting high praise a month ago for transforming the Habs.

That Habs team would be good with an actual #1 center. They've had trouble finding a #1 center for a decade it seems.
Honestly, I think he's done a rather good job. He took a lot of risks but he managed to get some really good moves in retrospect, Gally for Domi and Subban for Weber. Then some misses like Drouin for Sergachev.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

That Habs team would be good with an actual #1 center. They've had trouble finding a #1 center for a decade it seems.

Thats what kind of bugs me..On paper, we have a really good 1-2 punch at centre...What the f***?

Montreal doesnt even have a legit 1C, and its pretty tough to trade for one.

 

[Snatcher Demko]

He was getting high praise a month ago for transforming the Habs.

Not from me. He is generally a good asset manager, but that team has no direction and won't win a Cup. Embracing mediocrity is what he's done.

 

[Hit the post]

Not from me. He is generally a good asset manager, but that team has no direction and won't win a Cup. Embracing mediocrity is what he's done.

Benning can't even achieve mediocrity. These Canucks are worse than that.

 

[WTG]

Thats what kind of bugs me..On paper, we have a really good 1-2 punch at centre...What the f***?

Montreal doesnt even have a legit 1C, and its pretty tough to trade for one.

When was the last time a #1 got traded? Jones for Johansen?
It's amazing how good of possession teams Julien has coached. He'd be awesome here.

 

[deckercky]

Thats what kind of bugs me..On paper, we have a really good 1-2 punch at centre...What the f***?

Montreal doesnt even have a legit 1C, and its pretty tough to trade for one.

Let's be honest, Montreal effectively went all in with an overall very average roster due to Price and Weber (it was go in now, or wait until those contracts are gone). Given that the flat cap is expected to remain for several seasons, Montreal will be facing a reckoning 3-4 years down the line.

Look how much money they have invested in:
1.) old declining players; and
2.) good, but not great players signed for lengthy contracts.

For all the poop Benning deserves for anchoring the team in contracts, almost everything is off the books by the end of next season, and the only two contracts of any length currently are Myers and Schmidt.

Obviously this offseason we expect extensions for Pettersson, Hughes and Demko.

If the cap remains flat and the market for supporting players remains goofy for a few seasons, the Canucks could actually be structured very well to compete going forward.

 

[Hit the post]

When was the last time a #1 got traded? Jones for Johansen?
It's amazing how good of possession teams Julien has coached. He'd be awesome here.

He'd turn EP into a checker.

 

[MS]

Montreal's main problem is that Carey Price isn't very good anymore.

 

[WTG]

He'd turn EP into a checker.

If he can develop Pettersson's and Horvat's defensive game that would be fantastic.

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

Montreal's main problem is that Carey Price isn't very good anymore.

I'd say it's that he ties up 10.5 million of their cap space, but it's precisely because he's declined so hard that it's such an issue.

 

[StreetHawk]

Montreal's main problem is that Carey Price isn't very good anymore.

How many players that turn 34 this season are playing fairly well?
that's the risk of signing guys into their mid 30's.

Very few are still going well. From 2003, main guys are Bergeron, Weber, Suter, Burns (but he's signed until 40 yikes....). Keep going down the line from each draft. 2006 draft of EJ, J. Staal, Toews, Backstrom, Kessel, Giroux turn 33 in 2021. Only so many guys can last that long.

Hard for teams to let these guys go cause they know they take the hit in the next season or two, but the payoff is likely there down the line. Look at St. Louis and Backes. The finals between Bos/STL he was in year 3 of his 5 year deal and barely playing for Boston. Blues refused to match that term.
That was the ultimate situation of where it showed taking the short term hit ended up paying off.

 

[timw33]

Montreal's main problem is that Carey Price isn't very good anymore.

And their special teams have been a disaster under Muller/Julien. 20th in PP, 22nd in PK this year (22nd and 19th last year, 30th and 13th before that).

5 on 5 they've been one of the top teams in the league.

 

[supercanuck]

Playing the Canucks 5 times in their first 10 games probably didn't help. Created unrealistic expectations at the start of the season for them.

 

[MS]

And their special teams have been a disaster under Muller/Julien. 20th in PP, 22nd in PK this year (22nd and 19th last year, 30th and 13th before that).

5 on 5 they've been one of the top teams in the league.

They're outscoring the opposition 51-33 at ES and the coach got fired. It's bizarre.

To be fair, most of that ES scoring was against us, so does it count?

 

[canuckking1]

They're outscoring the opposition 51-33 at ES and the coach got fired. It's bizarre.

To be fair, most of that ES scoring was against us, so does it count?

Montreal simply doesn't have the talent to be dominant at 4on4 or on the PP. I mean Nick Suzuki's stats look okay but once you take Vancouver away he's .5 PPG centre. Then you have Gallagher and Danualt who aren't offensively creative and an ageing weber.

 

[m9]

I still think Montreal will be fine this year, but they're a mess long-term with their salary structure. It was discussed here before the season and nothing has changed.

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

Playing the Canucks 5 times in their first 10 games probably didn't help. Created unrealistic expectations at the start of the season for them.

Toffoli had the stretch of his life. I think he even surprised himself.

 

[Dab]

Suzuki vs PLD will be an interesting thing to watch in the coming years. Should Montreal have made that trade? I guess hindsight will tell us who was right ...

 

[canuckking1]

If Canucks hire a new coach I'd prefer Boudreau. His up tempo puck moving and scoring fits this team much better than a guy like Julien who likes to run 4 lines.

 

[MS]

Montreal simply doesn't have the talent to be dominant at 4on4 or on the PP. I mean Nick Suzuki's stats look okay but once you take Vancouver away he's .5 PPG centre. Then you have Gallagher and Danualt who aren't offensively creative and an ageing weber.

For sure.

They basically have 3 #2 centers. Julien has actually done an excellent job of creating a balanced squad that excels at ES.

But when you get to the PP or 3-on-3, there are no weapons there.

0-4 in OT. If they went 2-2 in those games, their record would be 11-5-2. This is up there with Gallant as a bizarre coach firing.

 

[WTG]

Suzuki vs PLD will be an interesting thing to watch in the coming years. Should Montreal have made that trade? I guess hindsight will tell us who was right ...

I'm 99% confident in saying that PLD is better and will continue to be better than Suzuki.

 

[I am toxic]

How many players that turn 34 this season are playing fairly well?
that's the risk of signing guys into their mid 30's.

Very few are still going well. From 2003, main guys are Bergeron, Weber, Suter, Burns (but he's signed until 40 yikes....). Keep going down the line from each draft. 2006 draft of EJ, J. Staal, Toews, Backstrom, Kessel, Giroux turn 33 in 2021. Only so many guys can last that long.

Hard for teams to let these guys go cause they know they take the hit in the next season or two, but the payoff is likely there down the line. Look at St. Louis and Backes. The finals between Bos/STL he was in year 3 of his 5 year deal and barely playing for Boston. Blues refused to match that term.
That was the ultimate situation of where it showed taking the short term hit ended up paying off.

I wonder if this is an escalating thing?

Most - virtually all? - athletes decline in their 30's, of course the truly exceptional ones can hang on and even perform at elite or near elite levels, but has it become even more pronounced as the decades march on?

Regular season is now 82 games (well, without a once in a lifetime pandemic), playoff rounds best of 7.

Kids these days are lacing up the skates while in the womb, spring hockey is a misnomer as it is year round.

Like, if a body only has so many miles in it, are we going to see in the coming decades younger players enter the league in greater numbers, and older players being unable to compete in their late 20's?

Anyway, just rambling.

 

[MS]

I wonder if this is an escalating thing?

Most - virtually all? - athletes decline in their 30's, of course the truly exceptional ones can hang on and even perform at elite or near elite levels, but has it become even more pronounced as the decades march on?

Regular season is now 82 games (well, without a once in a lifetime pandemic), playoff rounds best of 7.

Kids these days are lacing up the skates while in the womb, spring hockey is a misnomer as it is year round.

Like, if a body only has so many miles in it, are we going to see in the coming decades younger players enter the league in greater numbers, and older players being unable to compete in their late 20's?

Anyway, just rambling.

It goes in cycles.

Careers in the 1970s were long.

Careers in the 80s/early 90s were very short.

Careers in the DPE and early 2000s got longer again.

But in the last 10 years, careers are getting shorter and shorter. Almost nobody aside from former superstars is playing well past their early 30s.