Prospect Info: 2019 NHL Entry Draft Part II

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Alex NJD

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I would be furious, since if we wanted Byram THAT bad we could trade down and still get Byram and get an asset to boot.

Speaking of which, should we get the #1or 2, what would it take for us to trade down to #3 or 4? Would a young scoring C or RW do it? Someone like Larkin or DeBrincat? Maybe RNH or Rakell+? Or maybe a 1st pairing D man to move down even more?

Just curious what people would accept.
Larkin/Debrincat are probably worth a 3rd or 4th overall pick already, they're 100% untouchable. Doubt Edmonton trades up for another forward. Doubt Anaheim moves Rakell either. Unless a team is enamored with Hughes or Kakko it probably wouldn't make sense to trade down
 
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My3Sons

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There is a bit of a meme around here lately that any D prospect that puts up big points is basically Will Butcher and can’t play defense.

It comes up about Smith a lot.


I think if Butcher had better wheels he'd be great at every aspect of play except down low physicality. He can play defense, he's just small and slow. If he was big and strong or just fast he'd be looked at much differently most likely.
 

My3Sons

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I never said I would personally take Byram over Hughes/Kakko, but I said if the Devils took Byram 1st overall, I wouldn't be that mad because that's how highly I think of him. Would I be pissed they passed over Hughes/Kakko? Yes, but I also feel it is more difficult to acquire a superstar defenseman than a superstar forward. Superstar defensemen are much much more rare.



1. Larsson is not a dime a dozen player. Connor Carrick and Ben Lovejoy are dime a dozen players.

2. You can't say "well we thought Larsson was going to be the next Hedman and that didn't work out so it means Byram won't pan out either." Every situation and every player is different. Should teams not take Hughes or Kakko because Yakupov didn't work out?



I'd really love to bookmark this post and revisit it in 5 years because Byram 100% has the potential to be a Norris level defenseman year in year out. Doesn't mean he'll hit that potential, but every tool is there. I can't remember a defenseman dominating the WHL like this since Scott Niedermayer, who by the way, at the time, wasn't really considered in the same class as Lindros and Falloon. How'd that work out?

I agree with the Heiskanen comparison. I think Heiskanen has a case that he should have been the #1 overall pick in 2017.

And as I said above, I think it is so much more important to have a Hedman/Keith/Doughty/Karlsson type defenseman than a 1st line forward. I kind of like to compare it to Tavares vs Hedman. Both great players, but would you take Hedman 1st overall over Tavares looking back? I think I would.


So you dis Nico AND Lovejoy? I sir am offended and demand that we meet on the field of onion. My seconds will call on your seconds. If your seconds are out they will go directly to your thirds.

*takes off foppish 18th century glove and cyber slaps Bet the Over with it*
 
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Scooooooooooooot

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I think if Butcher had better wheels he'd be great at every aspect of play except down low physicality. He can play defense, he's just small and slow. If he was big and strong or just fast he'd be looked at much differently most likely.

His D IQ isn't high, it's about average at best. Also saying he can play defense with disclaimers means he really can't play defense.
 
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Kaako Kappo

Kaako Kappo
Oct 12, 2016
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Kaako Kappo

sick shot



He can score in many ways and is a double threat with his passing. The guy's a walking talking highlight reel whenever he gets the puck.

Someone on Detroit board said he reminds them of Sam Reinhart. I can see literally no similarities except they're both male and play ice-hockey.

E: Found a nice Vid with Kakko highlights where he's not scoring

 
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GameSeven

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Jan 11, 2008
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I actually never understood the Larsson love before the draft. He never really proved himself to have any major offensive ability, but people said they thought it would develop, which I thought was risky for such a high pick. I remember really hoping we'd be able to trade down and pick Dougie Hamilton and get a good additional asset. At least Larsson got us Hall though :)
I wanted Couturier because of his earlier forecast as a potential 1OA and because forwards seem much easier to project than D-men. A lot of Larsson hype I recall having to do with playing in a men's league at a young age. But with the composition of our D corps, having the consensus top defender fall to us seemed like great fortune at the time.

At least we were able to flip him for Hall, no small feat.
 

StevenToddIves

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What about defensemen that might be available selected with the Devils 2nd round picks? (or later in the first should they trade up).

Constantinou caught my eye in the Prospects Game, and from what I can tell he is similar to Jonny Tychonic from last year. I.E. he's pretty good with the puck in the O-Zone but needs work in just about every other aspect of the game. I saw him on the PK during the game, so maybe he shows some defensive acumen? I've seen Constantinou ranked / mocked anywhere from pick 40 to 88, is he that much of a wild card?

I see names like Kolyachonok, Heinola, Kniazev, Thomson, Korczak, Bjornfort, Kukkonen, and Bolduc ranked / mocked in this general vicinity and know nothing about them other than height, weight, and current team. If the Devils go defense with their 2nd pick, who does the board like here?

I posted a top 10 RD list on the thread for my mock draft 2.0. I agree with you on Constantinou, though I like Lassi Thomson a bit better at RD. I'd be thrilled with Alex Vlasic, Marshall Warren or Drew Helleson from the US-NTDP. Out of Sweden I really like Bjornfot.
 
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StevenToddIves

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I wanted Couturier because of his earlier forecast as a potential 1OA and because forwards seem much easier to project than D-men. A lot of Larsson hype I recall having to do with playing in a men's league at a young age. But with the composition of our D corps, having the consensus top defender fall to us seemed like great fortune at the time.

At least we were able to flip him for Hall, no small feat.

No Devils fan can complain about the Larsson pick due to the way it worked out.
 

beekay414

#FireEveryone
Jul 1, 2016
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If Byram grades as a plus at everything, what makes Dahlin so much better? Honest question.

I'm willing to bet a lot on the fact that Byram will be better than Dahlin. Is what it is.
 
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BurntToast

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I am honestly starting to think scouts are biased. Nothing against Hughes but Kaapo has stood out a lot more. He tied Barkov’s u18 record for goals and is 7th in the league for scoring. He also has multiple game winning goals including the U20 gold medal game. Hindsight, Nico was better but maybe one scout had him first. Patrick Sucks! Plus Hughes is not Kane. I can see him being more like young Scott Gomez (20ish goals and 50ish assists). Kane put up 60 something goals. Sadly the Devils’ chance to draft ether are slim. I won’t be mad with Byram but the Devils biggest issues are still offense. I guess it depends on how they feel about later rounds. (Which has been primarily used on defense and redrafts)
 

StevenToddIves

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If Byram grades as a plus at everything, what makes Dahlin so much better? Honest question.

I'm willing to bet a lot on the fact that Byram will be better than Dahlin. Is what it is.

Don't bet a lot.

Listen, I think everyone knows how high I am on Byram. But Dahlin is generational. He handles the puck like an elite forward, he has ideal size and jersey-flapping speed. His vision is on par with the elite centers in the league at the same age, and he's a defenseman. I wouldn't be shocked if he topped 60+ points next year with increased minutes as a 19/20 year old.

This is not to say that Byram is not an outstanding prospect. He is. I have him ranked #3 overall for a reason, and that in a draft with a very strong 4-9. But if Dahlin were in the draft this year? He'd be fighting with Hughes for #1 and Kakko would be the #3. It's just that simple.
 
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StevenToddIves

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I am honestly starting to think scouts are biased. Nothing against Hughes but Kaapo has stood out a lot more. He tied Barkov’s u18 record for goals and is 7th in the league for scoring. He also has multiple game winning goals including the U20 gold medal game. Hindsight, Nico was better but maybe one scout had him first. Patrick Sucks! Plus Hughes is not Kane. I can see him being more like young Scott Gomez (20ish goals and 50ish assists). Kane put up 60 something goals. Sadly the Devils’ chance to draft ether are slim. I won’t be mad with Byram but the Devils biggest issues are still offense. I guess it depends on how they feel about later rounds. (Which has been primarily used on defense and redrafts)

If you're comparing Hughes to Scott Gomez, you need to watch a lot more film on Hughes.

Hughes' hands and vision are comparable to Kane, and he is twice as fast, and he is a center. I have not seen a player able to make such plays at such high speeds since McDavid. The ability to skate at an ultra-elite speed alone makes a player a first round pick in today's NHL -- look at Liam Foudy last year, or Zack Senyshyn a few years ago. But what Hughes can do with the puck at full speed -- stickhandle with abandon, think three moves ahead as if he's slowing the game down when in fact he's speeding it up, make soft passes through the smallest of openings onto the tape of his teammates' sticks -- it's just unbelievably rare.

In addition to this, Hughes is a terrific shooter and scorer, plays at a high compete level, and is maybe the best at zone entries I've ever seen for a draft-eligible forward.

If there is one knock on Kakko, it's that his skating can be considered above-average at best. The wide gulf in their skating abilities is probably the top reason that Hughes is uncontested for the #1 overall pick.

So far as the Hischier/Patrick argument, in 2017 it was pretty much an even split at #1. Scouting bureaus which picked Nico #1 (you can look this up) included TSN's Bob McKenzie and Craig Button, McKeen's, Future Considerations, ESPN, Corey Pronman. These are some pretty huge names. This year, I have yet to see anyone list Kakko over Hughes. Not one reputable scouting service or draft writer. I have, however, seen Kakko listed at #3 behind Hughes and Podkolzin, which I strongly disagree with (Steve Kournianos). If you send me a link to a reputable writer (not a Finnish hockey fan on a message board) saying Kakko is the #1 pick this year, I'd love to read it.

Quite frankly, I love these debates among knowledgable and passionate Devils fans. If you want to ask who we would take if it came down to Cozens v Byram, many on these threads would write back with smart and savvy opinions, arguing either side. None would be wrong or right, that's the fun of it.

But these debates must be based on fact, otherwise they become hysterical, vitriolic and no fun to take part in. Fact: Hughes is the consensus #1 pick. Fact: Kakko is the consensus #2 pick. Fact: there is absolutely no scout or hockey writer or expert on earth who would think or write that Scott Gomez is a comparable for Jack Hughes.

There are some earlier posts on this very page in this very thread about Devils fans who really, really want Kakko. I mean, who wouldn't? I would be over the moon with joy if the Devils got the #2 pick. Kakko could have been our second line RW this year. If you think he would be a greater asset to the Devils than Hughes, I would love to hear your reasoning. All I'm asking is that we base these arguments in facts, not vitriol.
 

Cheddabombs

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If Byram grades as a plus at everything, what makes Dahlin so much better? Honest question.

I'm willing to bet a lot on the fact that Byram will be better than Dahlin. Is what it is.

Because Dahlin is exceptional in a lot of aspects of the game, not just great. He was doing things as a defenseman in the SHL that hadnt been done, like he was one of the best defenseman prospects ever.
 
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AfroThunder396

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Jan 8, 2006
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Yeah, Dahlin is doing things no 18 year old defenseman has done since Paul Coffeey.

He's going to be within spitting distance of Nico's point total from last year, which is pretty insane because Nico had one of the best D+1 seasons in recent memory and Dahlin will nearly match that as a defenseman.
 
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