Prospect Info: 2019 Draft: 1st Pick: Philip Broberg - Part 2

[Samus44]

No one is saying Nurse for scraps, they are saying you don't pay a 2nd pairing defensemen 7 mill a year and if that's the sticking point for him, then you trade him for something VALUABLE. Almost everyone is fine with Nurse being here, just not at a ridiculous 7mill.

Secondly, if a team sees Brobergs peak as Nurse as stated, that's extremely disappointing at his draft position especially with what was on the table. If he ends up as Nurse that's not a bad thing, but when you are looking at potential, a top 10 draft pick with the potential to be a second pairing defender, you wait till later in the draft for that.

Nurse was drafted to be a top pairing guy, he is settling in as a good solid second pairing guy. Absolutely nothing wrong with that, most draft picks don't reach the peak you hoped but they come close is the hope. You set your sights at top pairing and settle for 2nd. If you set your sights for 2nd pairing it means you will settle for 3rd. You don't pick a guy like that top 10.

Not saying if that will be Broberg will be like that, just that everything we have heard about the team and drafting Broberg feels extremely flawed for the organization and drafting period

1st and 2nd pairing don't really exist on the Oilers. For years San Jose used Vlasic as a shutdown guy and Burns as an offensive guy on different pairings. The Oilers have a clear cut top 4 and defined roles on special teams. Nurse's pairing and Klefbom's pairings are being used in tandem, Nurse-Bear saws off the elites and Klefbom-Larsson props up the weaker lines as Klefbom distributes the puck better than Nurse but is less punishing. The Oilers can't afford to lose good players, we need Nurse. He can fill the Vlasic role, and that's really hard to find. He's not quite as composed or elite defensively as Vlasic was but he is harder to play against and he produces more. Nurse is highly valuable. I'd say half of all the outstanding defenseman in the league don't become elite till 27 or so. Nurse is showing legit signs of becoming a true top flight shut down D at 24, let's not run him out of town when he likely has 10 years of prime hockey ahead of him.

May I ask where the 7 million figure is coming from? I really can't think of a comparable at that figure. 6.5 seems like the absolute limit for a guy who can't QB a PP and hasn't been succeeding in a shutdown role for years. That 7 million figure seems like a straw man argument to me. Klefbom already does a lot on special teams, he shouldn't be playing all the critical minutes at evens and Bear is still too green for the Oilers to expect him to lead a top 4 pairing. Nurse is undeniably an effective top 4 defenseman in a critical role who's improving every season and is an RFA. The Oilers have leverage in negotiations and a need for this player so i don't understand the stance you are making with these ridiculous figures being presented as fact.

As for the Broberg comparison use some common sense. No rational human being thinks another player is going to project exactly the same as another. The comparison is to say Broberg should be a player who can play in all roles with excellent defensive upside and offensive potential given his skating and size, not that he's going to literally be Darnell Nurse. Take things for what they are, the comparision is a generalization. If Broberg is Nurse at evens and the PK but manages to be say 20% better a PP player then he's going to be a 55 point dman anchoring a Top 4 pairing, key PKer, and a 2nd PP unit guy at 23-24. That would be a massive success and in the ball park of the comparison. Settle down Chicken Little.

 

[nexttothemoon]

A 55 point dman?

There were 10 dmen with 55 pts last season... and the year before there were 12 dmen that hit the 55 pt mark.

If Broberg becomes essentially a top 10 offensive dman... Oilers are laughing.

Does anyone seriously think that's his upside though? As a future top 10 offensive dman in the NHL?

Anything is possible of course.

 

[OilerTitanFan]

Says who? Nurse had a ton of talent in junior as well. We got duped by a fast prospect.

Every prospect had a ton of talent in junior. I mean, Don Cherry was calling Ryan Murphy the next Bobby Orr or something like that at coaches corner prior to him being drafted. Only people getting duped are fans coming up with their own projections.

 

[OilerTitanFan]

A 55 point dman?

There were 10 dmen with 55 pts last season... and the year before there were 12 dmen that hit the 55 pt mark.

If Broberg becomes essentially a top 10 offensive dman... Oilers are laughing.

Does anyone seriously think that's his upside though? As a future top 10 offensive dman in the NHL?

Anything is possible of course.

I think so. And yes it is possible.

 

[nexttothemoon]

If we're dreaming about Broberg being a 55 pt dman in the future... I'd have dreamt that Kaliyev is a 80 point forward in the future as well... which is the equivalent upside for a forward.

 

[Samus44]

A 55 point dman?

There were 10 dmen with 55 pts last season... and the year before there were 12 dmen that hit the 55 pt mark.

If Broberg becomes essentially a top 10 offensive dman... Oilers are laughing.

Does anyone seriously think that's his upside though? As a future top 10 offensive dman in the NHL?

Anything is possible of course.

You missed the point. The point is that if being compared to a 40 point dman in Nurse, which is apparently awful, only a little more offensive upside and Broberg is a 55 point guy despite being only a little better offensively. 55 points is far and above reasonable expectations but it's certainly not out of the question either. The way Broberg skates is exceptional, he's got legit offensive upside. SHL stats as an 18 year old mean very little, so there's still a ton of question marks in regards to offense.

 

[OilerTitanFan]

So much negativity here about Broberg. I remembered back then when this team was always tanking, there were so many positives about guys like Lander, Martindale, Pitlick, and Marincin. Marincin was like the second coming of Chara. Now that we finally have a legit D prospect that we have never seen in this franchise since Paul Coffey, everyone's pouring gasoline on him and sending him to the dumpster fire. What a joke.

This kid has all the tools to succeed in the NHL and there's almost zero excitement about him. When Yakupov was drafted, he was Pavel Bure 2.0 and everyone was pumping his tires.

 

[Beerfish]

So much negativity here about Broberg. I remembered back then when this team was always tanking, there were so many positives about guys like Lander, Martindale, Pitlick, and Marincin. Marincin was like the second coming of Chara. Now that we finally have a legit D prospect that we have never seen in this franchise since Paul Coffey, everyone's pouring gasoline on him and sending him to the dumpster fire. What a joke.

LOL, since coffey? for gods sakes, also you just listed a ton of prospects who were well thought of that failed and all of a sudden this guy is the 2nd coming.

So far he has shown nothing at all to suggest he is good let alone being really good. He is doing little over in sweden and did nothing the world juniors of note.

 

[OilerTitanFan]

LOL, since coffey? for gods sakes, also you just listed a ton of prospects who were well thought of that failed and all of a sudden this guy is the 2nd coming.

So far he has shown nothing at all to suggest he is good let alone being really good. He is doing little over in sweden and did nothing the world juniors of note.

Tell me when was the last time we've drafted a significant D of note aside from Nurse.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

I'm still happy with the pick.

Does that make me a bad fan?

 

[Rufus Aslegard]

So much negativity here about Broberg. I remembered back then when this team was always tanking, there were so many positives about guys like Lander, Martindale, Pitlick, and Marincin. Marincin was like the second coming of Chara. Now that we finally have a legit D prospect that we have never seen in this franchise since Paul Coffey, everyone's pouring gasoline on him and sending him to the dumpster fire. What a joke.

This kid has all the tools to succeed in the NHL and there's almost zero excitement about him. When Yakupov was drafted, he was Pavel Bure 2.0 and everyone was pumping his tires.

The Oilers front office is throwing water on expectations for Broberg. They are saying they expect he has upside to be as good as Darnell Nurse.

That is what started all this in the first place.

 

[Rufus Aslegard]

Tell me when was the last time we've drafted a significant D of note aside from Nurse.

Bouchard, Klefbom?

 

[OilerTitanFan]

Bouchard, Klefbom?

I would lump Bouchard in the same tier as Broberg. Klefbom at the time of the pick had too many question marks and was not seen as a top pair. Late first rounder was more like a prayer and hope rather than someone who can step in. It took Klefbom almost 5 years to finally show something after all those silly injuries. He was often seen as made of glass.

 

[OilerTitanFan]

The Oilers front office is throwing water on expectations for Broberg. They are saying they expect he has upside to be as good as Darnell Nurse.

That is what started all this in the first place.

And now this place is undergoing an earthquake over one comment.

 

[Staghorn]

The Oilers front office is throwing water on expectations for Broberg. They are saying they expect he has upside to be as good as Darnell Nurse.

That is what started all this in the first place.

Well I’d take being compared to Nurse as a compliment... great skating offensive DMan with an edge. I hate the Nurse hate on here, and think the Broberg hate is equally dumb... it’s getting old. Nurse is the best we’ve got, and Broberg is just a young kid. He will develop.... and be good.

 

[Aceboogie]

I would lump Bouchard in the same tier as Broberg. Klefbom at the time of the pick had too many question marks and was not seen as a top pair. Late first rounder was more like a prayer and hope rather than someone who can step in. It took Klefbom almost 5 years to finally show something after all those silly injuries. He was often seen as made of glass.

At the time of each respected draft, Bouchard was a tier above Broberg. Bouchard and Nurse were to legit top 10 picks. Brobergs average rank was 15 and his rankings varied widely, from 6 to 30. Klefbom was ranked in that same spot, and at the draft he was noted as having high upside but big question marks. Him and Broberg would bein the same tier. Which is fine, but Broberg was picked at 8 where the ?s shouldnt be as big

 

[Draiskull]

I would lump Bouchard in the same tier as Broberg. Klefbom at the time of the pick had too many question marks and was not seen as a top pair. Late first rounder was more like a prayer and hope rather than someone who can step in. It took Klefbom almost 5 years to finally show something after all those silly injuries. He was often seen as made of glass.

Broberg will probably take longer than Klefbom to become a good NHLer if he ever makes it. He was a reach pick in top 10. Hopefully he progresses faster than Juolevi.

 

[OilerTitanFan]

At the time of each respected draft, Bouchard was a tier above Broberg. Bouchard and Nurse were to legit top 10 picks. Brobergs average rank was 15 and his rankings varied widely, from 6 to 30. Klefbom was ranked in that same spot, and at the draft he was noted as having high upside but big question marks. Him and Broberg would bein the same tier. Which is fine, but Broberg was picked at 8 where the ?s shouldnt be as big

Well, how about that other D that Detroit reached out and grabbed out of nowhere? That was an even worse pick. Development is not linear. Scouts know better than us. Let this thing play out and see how Broberg pans out.

I still recalled when Nurse was selected, people were crucifying that dumb pick and everyone wanted Ristolainen. Even last season, everyone dumped on Nurse and wants Risto. I wonder what those people are thinking. Risto is the Nail Yakupov on D. Can't defend if his life depended on it.

 

[gordonhught]

Well, how about that other D that Detroit reached out and grabbed out of nowhere? That was an even worse pick. Development is not linear. Scouts know better than us. Let this thing play out and see how Broberg pans out.

I still recalled when Nurse was selected, people were crucifying that dumb pick and everyone wanted Ristolainen. Even last season, everyone dumped on Nurse and wants Risto. I wonder what those people are thinking. Risto is the Nail Yakupov on D. Can't defend if his life depended on it.

I have watched Seider play in the AHL. He is a monster who plays physical. Seider is about the same size as Broberg, but Seider has more of a physical edge.

If I had the option of switching Seider with Broberg right now (based on what I know now) I would make the switch and take Seider.

Seider is playing in the AHL the year after being drafted and he is at about 0.5 PPG (draft year +1). Seider is second highest scoring defenseman on his team in the AHL and is only second to a 23 year old.

By way of comparison, Bouchard is in his draft year +2 and is playing at about 0.6 PPG.

EDIT: Having said all that, I still hope that Broberg exceeds current expectations and does well.

EDIT: Grand Rapids and Bakersfield are about the same in the standings. Seider is -7 and Bouchard is -10 for those keeping track.

 

[Aerchon]

I have watched Seider play in the AHL. He is a monster who plays physical. Seider is about the same size as Broberg, but Seider has more of a physical edge.

If I had the option of switching Seider with Broberg right now (based on what I know now) I would make the switch and take Seider.

Seider is playing in the AHL the year after being drafted and he is at about 0.5 PPG (draft year +1). Seider is second highest scoring defenseman on his team in the AHL and is only second to a 23 year old.

By way of comparison, Bouchard is in his draft year +2 and is playing at about 0.6 PPG.

EDIT: Having said all that, I still hope that Broberg exceeds current expectations and does well.

I of course would have taken Zegras over either but even predraft i take Seider over Broberg. A case of seen him good plus he is a righty.

People have selective memories. When it was leaked Broberg was our pick there were very good reasons why the pick was rediculous, and that was assuming Zegras would be gone.

Not sure why this pick even gets a token defense. Its a wait and see for any prospect. Double for Broberg. I hope I, and most predraft scouting reports, are wrong and Broberg is a stud but until he shows something i think the pick deserves its critism.

 

[gordonhught]

Well I’d take being compared to Nurse as a compliment... great skating offensive DMan with an edge. I hate the Nurse hate on here, and think the Broberg hate is equally dumb... it’s getting old. Nurse is the best we’ve got, and Broberg is just a young kid. He will develop.... and be good.

Broberg has no edge. I think the comparison with Nurse is largely in relation to skating and mobility.

By my eye, Nurse is more physical and Broberg seems to have better defensive awareness.

According to the Oilers, both have similar offensive upside.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

Broberg has no edge. I think the comparison with Nurse is largely in relation to skating and mobility.

By my eye, Nurse is more physical and Broberg seems to have better defensive awareness.

According to the Oilers, both have similar offensive upside.

Broberg is a much better skater from what I have seen.

 

[Del Preston]

Broberg will never get a fair shot on here. Doesn't matter how good he ends up being.

 

[The Nuge]

I would lump Bouchard in the same tier as Broberg. Klefbom at the time of the pick had too many question marks and was not seen as a top pair. Late first rounder was more like a prayer and hope rather than someone who can step in. It took Klefbom almost 5 years to finally show something after all those silly injuries. He was often seen as made of glass.

Klefbom was a potential top 10 pick who fell to us, but he absolutely was seen as having top pairing upside. He just had more question marks. And Klefa came in and looked like a legit top 4 dman as a 20 year old, in his draft +3 season. Did you even watch the Oilers back then?

Bouchard meanwhile was a potential top 5 pick.

Both of them were seen as having much higher upside, and fell to us. Broberg meanwhile is seen as having lower upside, and was a reach. I don’t even hate the pick. Zegras has some big question marks imo, and I’m not sure how well his game will translate when you have to execute plays much faster. But that doesn’t mean Broberg is on the level of Klefa/Nurse/Bouchard as a prospect.

I still recalled when Nurse was selected, people were crucifying that dumb pick and everyone wanted Ristolainen. Even last season, everyone dumped on Nurse and wants Risto. I wonder what those people are thinking. Risto is the Nail Yakupov on D. Can't defend if his life depended on it.

What are you talking about? Basically nobody wanted Risto at the draft. It was Nurse vs Nuke.

People certainly didn’t want Risto over Nurse last year either. There was that debate a few years back, before Nurse made the NHL, and while Risto was putting up good numbers. But that was squashed pretty quickly once they were both in the NHL. You’re pushing a narrative that just isn’t true

 

[GOilers88]

LOL, since coffey? for gods sakes, also you just listed a ton of prospects who were well thought of that failed and all of a sudden this guy is the 2nd coming.

So far he has shown nothing at all to suggest he is good let alone being really good. He is doing little over in sweden and did nothing the world juniors of note.

Can we stop using the WJC as some sort of benchmark for how prospects are going to do?

It's a 7 game tournament that doesn't mean f*** all so let's quit bringing it up like it makes some sort of point.