2019/20 Roster Thread XXII

[Dumpster Flyers]

Voracek-Giroux was never an awful combo. The last time they were put together, they were part of the best line in the league. They were only split up to balance lines.

They were an even strength disaster throughout their career compared to how they performed apart. It's statistically proven.

 

[FLYguy3911]

Do you know how you stop being the best play driving team in hockey?

 

[baudib1]

https://www.nbcsports.com/philadelphia/flyers/flyers-breaking-top-line-monday-vs-calgary-flames

There’s been so much bad karma lately, that it’s come time to break up the one positive on this Flyers team.
Head coach Dave Hakstol has elected to split up his trio of Claude Giroux, Sean Couturier and Jakub Voracek, a line that has generated 43 percent of the team's offensive production at even strength, including an NHL-leading 25 goals between them.

All 3 of Giroux, Coots and Voracek were on pace for career years. Voracek had 7 goals and 26 assists in 27 games -- a 100-point pace. As noted, the line was leading the league in even-strength goals.

 

[baudib1]

2013-14 xGF
Giroux with Voracek 54.2%
Giroux without Voracek 39.9%

2014-15
Giroux with Voracek 53.7%
Giroux without Voracek 42.1%

2015-16
Giroux with Voracek 51.7%
Giroux without Voraek 46.3%

2016-17
Giroux with Voracek 39.0%
Giroux without Voracek 45.0%

2017-18
Giroux with Voracek 65.8%
Giroux without Voracek 61.7%

2018-19
Giroux with Voracek 53.1%
Giroux without Voracek 50.6%

In 5 out of 6 years, Giroux-Voracek are markedly better together than they are apart.

 

[Rebels57]

For the "Hagg has not been terrible crowd"

 

[Starat327]

2013-14 xGF
Giroux with Voracek 54.2%
Giroux without Voracek 39.9%

2014-15
Giroux with Voracek 53.7%
Giroux without Voracek 42.1%

2015-16
Giroux with Voracek 51.7%
Giroux without Voraek 46.3%

2016-17
Giroux with Voracek 39.0%
Giroux without Voracek 45.0%

2017-18
Giroux with Voracek 65.8%
Giroux without Voracek 61.7%

2018-19
Giroux with Voracek 53.1%
Giroux without Voracek 50.6%

In 5 out of 6 years, Giroux-Voracek are markedly better together than they are apart.

But this is just, like, one stat,..... man

 

[Rebels57]

Do you know how you stop being the best play driving team in hockey?

I said the same thing to him on twitter. Hes doing his usual appeal to authority though.

 

[Striiker]

Do you know how you stop being the best play driving team in hockey?

Such an insane mentality, as if when things are going well no complaints/concerns are valid.

Especially when what people want is for the team to improve further... or at least not get do something stupid to make them worse.

 

[baudib1]

Man they must really be trying to hard-sell Stewart to the writers. Bad sign.

 

[baudib1]

If Pat Maroon could play 14:10 a night for a Stanley Cup winning team, I'm sure Stewart could play in the NHL.
It would be a good question which player would win in a 20 yard sprint.
That being said, I'd rather him play for another team.

Maroon was actually a positive possession player for the Blues last year, and has been most of his career. Stewart hasn't been plus since 2011.

 

[baudib1]

That's a really bad take from Charlie, who should know better. Stewart playin ahead of like 14 kids is a disgrace.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Do you know how you stop being the best play driving team in hockey?

A three game sample is apparently enough for him to feel better about possibly making the roster worse.

I get they’re going to do what they’re going to do & it’s a league wide problem but a bad idea is a bad idea no matter what you have to tell yourself to justify it.

 

[BringBackHakstol]

Stewart is plain indefensible if it happens. Really don't feel great about it

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

My general problem with media members is when they feel the need to insert themselves in indefensible positions. I get they can’t be too critical nor do I expect them to be & possibly jeopardize their job/career. But there’s no shame in just sitting some things out.

 

[deadhead]

Who exactly is Stewart going to play over?

He's certainly not as good as Pitlick.
Twarynski outplayed him by a wide margin.
When Patrick comes back, Raffl goes back to LW and Bunnaman probably goes back to LHV.

So even if they sign him, it would be for a few cameos (a la Goul) and a lot of time collecting splinters.

"What, me worry?"

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Stewart will play ahead of Bunnaman. Big deal. He's better than Bunnaman. He'll be a scratch if the team is healthy and Farabee keeps banging down the door in the AHL and/or Patrick ever comes back.

Laughton is a guy who's in a tenuous position if Patrick comes back and Farabee keeps it up.

 

[Magua]

2013-14 xGF
Giroux with Voracek 54.2%
Giroux without Voracek 39.9%

2014-15
Giroux with Voracek 53.7%
Giroux without Voracek 42.1%

2015-16
Giroux with Voracek 51.7%
Giroux without Voraek 46.3%

2016-17
Giroux with Voracek 39.0%
Giroux without Voracek 45.0%

2017-18
Giroux with Voracek 65.8%
Giroux without Voracek 61.7%

2018-19
Giroux with Voracek 53.1%
Giroux without Voracek 50.6%

In 5 out of 6 years, Giroux-Voracek are markedly better together than they are apart.

I don’t think anyone is under the belief they’re bad together. I would mention that their time pre-17/18 was with Giroux at center, and they almost exclusively were together to affect the WOWY. Little different dynamic. Afterwards, their time was with Couturier, who is a straight analytical savage. Except for Giroux’s month at center which somewhat cratered his overall stats.

My point being: Couturier is awesome sauce and can make anything hum, but both at wing on the same line feels like too much overlap with Hayes, who is also incredibly pass first. Couturier is a much more natural scorer than him, which compliments better.

 

[baudib1]

I don’t think anyone is under the belief they’re bad together. I would mention that their time pre-17/18 was with Giroux at center, and they almost exclusively were together to affect the WOWY. Little different dynamic. Afterwards, their time was with Couturier, who is a straight analytical savage. Except for Giroux’s month at center which somewhat cratered his overall stats.

My point being: Couturier is awesome sauce and can make anything hum, but both at wing on the same line feels like too much overlap with Hayes, who is also incredibly pass first. Couturier is a much more natural scorer than him, which compliments better.

The post I was replying to definitely implies that they were bad together.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

I was a proponent of reuniting the Giroux-Couturier-Voracek line, which was arguably the best line in hockey when they were together to start the season a couple years ago.

The success of the Lindblom-Couturier-Konecny, line, though, makes me reconsider. I don't think you can mess with that right now.

But someone definitely said Giroux and Voracek have never worked well together, which is flat-out wrong.

 

[dats81]

I was a proponent of reuniting the Giroux-Couturier-Voracek line, which was arguably the best line in hockey when they were together to start the season a couple years ago.

The success of the Lindblom-Couturier-Konecny, line, though, makes me reconsider. I don't think you can mess with that right now.

But someone definitely said Giroux and Voracek have never worked well together, which is flat-out wrong.

I fully agree. That line combo is pure dynamite right now. Your ride it as long as they keep racking up the points and the team as a whole keeps a winning record.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

I fully agree. That line combo is pure dynamite right now. Your ride it as long as they keep racking up the points and the team as a whole keeps a winning record.

Yeah, you can't screw with that line. Couturier and TK are their two best forwards right now, and that line is absolutely dominant.

I'd give JVR a full game with Hayes and G, though I wouldn't be surprised if AV went back to Jak. And that's fine, too, if the benching lit a fire under his ass. Otherwise, Jak can play with Laughton and Twar until he rounds into better form.

 

[David St Hubbins]

Is it just me or are there any actual arguments in favor of Stewart? Seriously, all I see is "why not" and "it's not a big deal," but I have yet to see anyone make a case - forget compelling, just a case - that says "here is what he brings and how he makes the team better." It's all deflection and emotion, not a bit of rational thought being applied.

As for the writers, I strongly suspect this is yet another case of "hey I know this guy. He's cool and I'd like to see him have a job." And anyone who doesn't buy in is being mean to their friend.

 

[hatcher]

Yeah, you can't screw with that line. Couturier and TK are their two best forwards right now, and that line is absolutely dominant.

I'd give JVR a full game with Hayes and G, though I wouldn't be surprised if AV went back to Jak. And that's fine, too, if the benching lit a fire under his ass. Otherwise, Jak can play with Laughton and Twar until he rounds into better form.

Poor Hayes getting f***in over by the old slower players that have been here.

 

[BlackandOrange]

I love me some Jake, as he is a lock for 60+ points, and 75+ GP, but boy is he Alexei Kovalev. It is like some games he shows up as Ladislav Nagy and other games as unstoppable Jagr.

 

[Rebels57]

Is it just me or are there any actual arguments in favor of Stewart? Seriously, all I see is "why not" and "it's not a big deal," but I have yet to see anyone make a case - forget compelling, just a case - that says "here is what he brings and how he makes the team better." It's all deflection and emotion, not a bit of rational thought being applied.

As for the writers, I strongly suspect this is yet another case of "hey I know this guy. He's cool and I'd like to see him have a job." And anyone who doesn't buy in is being mean to their friend.

Stewart would immediately be a bottom 10 forward in the NHL if signed.