Pre-Game Talk: 2019-20 Playoff Watch Thread

[xtra]

I would be sweatin bullets if I was getting smug over maybe achieving mediocrity only to watch it begin to slip away.

i Lena you have noticed all those posters that were smug seemed to have disappeared.
But watch them come roaring back if the team squeaks out a wild card spot.

 

[Peter Griffin]

Canucks out of a playoff spot now after that Jets win. Who’d have thought that would happen back when they were leading the division?

After the 9-3 thumping of Boston I’m not anyone saw this happening.

 

[Orca Smash]

I think if you looked at it back then, all they needed to do was to play .500 hockey for the remainder of the season and they should make it. They've gone 5-9-2 in the past 16 games. If they didn't choke away the Arizona and Columbus games that could be 7-7-2 and they're sitting above Calgary with two games in hand. It really shouldn't have been hard in the position they put themselves in... but it's the Canucks we're talking about.

That also assumes though other teams dont get hot, and we dont run into injury trouble (which we finally did) also our underlying stats have not been very flattering and it was quite obvious we were relying heavily on one player (markstrom). Not a great recipe even if we did need to play 500 hockey. March also appears to have a tougher schedule for us then February.

 

[VanJack]

After tonight's action, Canucks are officially below the playoff bar in the West....odds of making it drop below 50 percent. And of all the teams they're chasing, they're probably playing their worst hockey right now.....just the way it is I guess.

 

[Intangibos]

After the 9-3 thumping of Boston I’m not anyone saw this happening.

Remember beating the Bruins in 2012?

 

[PuckMunchkin]

The best thing for this franchise would be to make the playoffs and burn off that first rounder. The best thing for tankers would be to pick 15th, give up the unprotected 2021 1st to NJ and have Benning fired. These are two very different things.

I cant see us winning a cup ever if we are completely handicapped at the GM position. Sorry.
I dont really care about being a bit better. I want a team that can realistically challenge for the cup.

Would be nice if we got rid if Jim before he did all the win-now moves that he has done to try to save his job. That didn't happen. Why would tankers get blamed for the stupid moves he did..?

 

[Hammer79]

I cant see us winning a cup ever if we are completely handicapped at the GM position. Sorry.
I dont really care about being a bit better. I want a team that can realistically challenge for the cup.

Would be nice if we got rid if Jim before he did all the win-now moves that he has done to try to save his job. That didn't happen. Why would tankers get blamed for the stupid moves he did..?

You see a GM that's 'completely handicapped', I see one that made some early mistakes but has improved at identifying certain players, is taking the advice of his staff reettersson. He still has to be a buffer between meddling ownership and the fans. Benning's job isn't to chase Detroit for #1 every year until our roster is absolutely brimming with talent, he's given a mandate to win. That's his job! Of course he's going to make moves to improve the line-up. FA signs the paychecks, he's just carrying out the no re-build rebuild plan.

I don't think many Canucks fans on either side of the argument are saying we are close to winning a cup by making the playoffs this year. It moves the needle with our new core and that first rounder is spent, might as well minimize the damage. Getting some playoff games for EP and QH would do wonders for their growth as star players.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

You see a GM that's 'completely handicapped', I see one that made some early mistakes but has improved at identifying certain players, is taking the advice of his staff reettersson. He still has to be a buffer between meddling ownership and the fans. Benning's job isn't to chase Detroit for #1 every year until our roster is absolutely brimming with talent, he's given a mandate to win. That's his job! Of course he's going to make moves to improve the line-up. FA signs the paychecks, he's just carrying out the no re-build rebuild plan.

I don't think many Canucks fans on either side of the argument are saying we are close to winning a cup by making the playoffs this year. It moves the needle with our new core and that first rounder is spent, might as well minimize the damage. Getting some playoff games for EP and QH would do wonders for their growth as star players.

That last line gets repeated.
Is it based on anything at all?

I dont see this learning process happening. He JUST signed Myers to an albatross contract, last summer.

Milller has been a much needed pro-scouting win for sure.
But do you really think Jim thought he was getting the Miller we now have, when he traded for him last summer? There wasn't much to indicate that he is actually secretly a point per game player.

 

[Grumbler]

Remember beating the Bruins in 2012?

And snapping the redwings 23 game home win streak.

I'd feel infinitely better had those wins meant anything (if we didn't later wet the bed on the most critical of games...). Team is like a kid who thinks he is stronger than the big bad bully after a successful sneak attack.

 

[Sneezy]

I am still not going to give up, regardless of the outcome there is a learning opportunity here for the players. JB will also see who is responding appropriately at all levels within the organization which includes TG, other management and of course the players. There were some guys brought in to provide that leadership and I have not seen that.

Of courses it pisses me off to see this team implode but you learn from mistakes.

 

[Love]

If we make the playoffs or make a run down the stretch here, it's clear to me that it'll have to be done in such a way where we are led by our offence. We basically need to play a run and gun, trade chances with the other team and hope for elite goaltending style of play. This is why I have such an issue with Eriksson with the Horvat line. We have one great line, we could use another good one. Putting Eriksson in the top 6 neuters our offence which is our bread and butter.

If we make the playoffs we should see something like:

Miller-Pettersson-Boeser
Pearson-Horvat-Toffoli
Roussel-Gaudette-Virtanen
Motte-Sutter-MacEwen

Try to trade chances, trust that if we get enough chances we will bury them, and trust that Markstrom can shut the door.

Basically, we need to play run and gun and trust that our offence can finish better than our opponents offence and that Markstom can shut the door better than our opponents goaltender.

 

[Sneezy]

If we make the playoffs or make a run down the stretch here, it's clear to me that it'll have to be done in such a way where we are led by our offence. We basically need to play a run and gun, trade chances with the other team and hope for elite goaltending style of play. This is why I have such an issue with Eriksson with the Horvat line. We have one great line, we could use another good one. Putting Eriksson in the top 6 neuters our offence which is our bread and butter.

If we make the playoffs we should see something like:

Miller-Pettersson-Boeser
Pearson-Horvat-Toffoli
Roussel-Gaudette-Virtanen
Motte-Sutter-MacEwen

Try to trade chances, trust that if we get enough chances we will bury them, and trust that Markstrom can shut the door.

Basically, we need to play run and gun and trust that our offence can finish better than our opponents offence and that Markstom can shut the door better than our opponents goaltender.

What no LE? How will Green survive?

 

[Addison Rae]

I still think we get in - but if we lose tonight I think I’ll change my mind.

 

[VanJack]

If we make the playoffs or make a run down the stretch here, it's clear to me that it'll have to be done in such a way where we are led by our offence. We basically need to play a run and gun, trade chances with the other team and hope for elite goaltending style of play. This is why I have such an issue with Eriksson with the Horvat line. We have one great line, we could use another good one. Putting Eriksson in the top 6 neuters our offence which is our bread and butter.

If we make the playoffs we should see something like:

Miller-Pettersson-Boeser
Pearson-Horvat-Toffoli
Roussel-Gaudette-Virtanen
Motte-Sutter-MacEwen

Try to trade chances, trust that if we get enough chances we will bury them, and trust that Markstrom can shut the door.

Basically, we need to play run and gun and trust that our offence can finish better than our opponents offence and that Markstom can shut the door better than our opponents goaltender.

'Run and gun' teams don't often make the playoffs, and if they do, don't go far. The reason the Canucks are on the outside looking in is that they can't keep the puck out of their own net. Their overall defensive record is down there with most of the other lottery teams.

Besides, at this time of the year the Canucks are ripe for being throttled like the were by Columbus in their last game, who play suffocating defense. The entire league turns the defensive screws. And if you can't match their defensive intensity, then you're going to lose.

Sorry to say it, but blown coverage by the d-men down low; neutral zone turnovers leading to odd-man rushes; and poor d-zone clearances have been the bane of this team all year long. The only reason we're still taking playoffs is that Markstrom basically stood on his head and stole games they should have lost. And I doubt he gets back in time to help them now.

 

[Love]

'Run and gun' teams don't often make the playoffs, and if they do, don't go far. The reason the Canucks are on the outside looking in is that they can't keep the puck out of their own net. Their overall defensive record is down there with most of the other lottery teams.

Besides, at this time of the year the Canucks are ripe for being throttled like the were by Columbus in their last game, who play suffocating defense. The entire league turns the defensive screws. And if you can't match their defensive intensity, then you're going to lose.

Sorry to say it, but blown coverage by the d-men down low; neutral zone turnovers leading to odd-man rushes; and poor d-zone clearances have been the bane of this team all year long. The only reason we're still taking playoffs is that Markstrom basically stood on his head and stole games they should have lost. And I doubt he gets back in time to help them now.

I agree that Run and Gun teams often aren't successful. But my point is that this is how the roster is constructed and we have a better chance of winning if we play to our strengths (offence and goaltending) rather than trying to play matchup hockey by giving Horvat a winger who's a blackhole offensively simply because he's marginally better defensively. Makes no sense.

 

[xtra]

I really wonder what the odds would have had to be for someone to put money down if you said tanev would be one of 6 players on our team to have played all 68 games this year.

he’s been a true warrior

 

[Hammer79]

That last line gets repeated.
Is it based on anything at all?

I dont see this learning process happening. He JUST signed Myers to an albatross contract, last summer.

Milller has been a much needed pro-scouting win for sure.
But do you really think Jim thought he was getting the Miller we now have, when he traded for him last summer? There wasn't much to indicate that he is actually secretly a point per game player.

You got to give credit where credit is due. They identified a guy that was buried down the line-up of a deep team. Tampa gave him $5.25M AAV a year before the trade, so obviously Tampa saw the upside and parted with him anyway because they were in a cap crunch. Tampa's GM was talking about how they regretted having to make the trade and being surprised by Canucks fans' reaction to the trade.

Myers is producing roughly on the same pace offensively as the past few years. He gets extra money because he shoots right and has a long reach. GM's have been clamouring for right handed shot D for the past few seasons now.

 

[ProstheticConscience]

You see a GM that's 'completely handicapped', I see one that made some early mistakes but has improved at identifying certain players, is taking the advice of his staff reettersson. He still has to be a buffer between meddling ownership and the fans. Benning's job isn't to chase Detroit for #1 every year until our roster is absolutely brimming with talent, he's given a mandate to win. That's his job! Of course he's going to make moves to improve the line-up. FA signs the paychecks, he's just carrying out the no re-build rebuild plan.

I don't think many Canucks fans on either side of the argument are saying we are close to winning a cup by making the playoffs this year. It moves the needle with our new core and that first rounder is spent, might as well minimize the damage. Getting some playoff games for EP and QH would do wonders for their growth as star players.

The more things change, the more they stay the same. I'm so sick and tired of people just deflecting blame year after year after year. Nope, it's all the owner's fault. Nope, there's no way the owner could have possibly been sold on a rebuild, Benning had absolutely no choice whatsoever but to spend 6 years chasing quick fixes. Just sick of it. Remember when Linden got canned? Linden said four more years to be a contender, Benning said two. That was two years ago. He's given a mandate to win? How's that worked out?

And seriously, building a hockey team isn't like leveling a World of Warcraft character here. I keep seeing people talking like somehow just making the playoffs is like edging out of the newbie starting area and cashing in the first tier of quest rewards. It's not. With the cap situation as crap as it is, the team will be weaker next season. Possibly without Markstrom and/or Tanev. Just squeaking into the playoffs this season (probably to get crushed in round one) really isn't going to do much if the team slides back down the standings as it could easily do, what with there now being pretty much zero flexibility in the roster. I mean, this is year two since the Sedins retired, and they're already slammed back up against the cap with both Pettersson and Hughes on ELCs. The window is slamming shut before it ever really opened.

 

[Canucks1096]

If we make the playoffs or make a run down the stretch here, it's clear to me that it'll have to be done in such a way where we are led by our offence. We basically need to play a run and gun, trade chances with the other team and hope for elite goaltending style of play. This is why I have such an issue with Eriksson with the Horvat line. We have one great line, we could use another good one. Putting Eriksson in the top 6 neuters our offence which is our bread and butter.

If we make the playoffs we should see something like:

Miller-Pettersson-Boeser
Pearson-Horvat-Toffoli
Roussel-Gaudette-Virtanen
Motte-Sutter-MacEwen

Try to trade chances, trust that if we get enough chances we will bury them, and trust that Markstrom can shut the door.

Basically, we need to play run and gun and trust that our offence can finish better than our opponents offence and that Markstom can shut the door better than our opponents goaltender.

Sutter takes a lot of the Dzone draws, you don't want Macewan out there against the tough Matchup. He needs to be sheltered like Gaudette. That is why as right now Macewan is playing with Gaudette and Virtanen is playing with Sutter. Btw Gaudette might be the third line center on paper by technically he is the 4th line center and Sutter is the third line center. If they are both playing center, Sutter will get more ice time that Gaudette

 

[racerjoe]

Sutter takes a lot of the Dzone draws, you don't want Macewan out there against the tough Matchup. He needs to be sheltered like Gaudette. That is why as right now Macewan is playing with Gaudette and Virtanen is playing with Sutter. Btw Gaudette might be the third line center on paper by technically he is the 4th line center and Sutter is the third line center. If they are both playing center, Sutter will get more ice time that Gaudette

i just want to make sure I have this right.

virtanen not good enough to play defensive matchup on Bos line has to be Eriksson, but has to play matchup with Sutter... ok.

 

[Canucks1096]

i just want to make sure I have this right.

virtanen not good enough to play defensive matchup on Bos line has to be Eriksson, but has to play matchup with Sutter... ok.

I think you taking things out a context. The numbers show a Horvat plays better with Eriksson than Virtanen. Sutter does gets the second toughest match up. These are the 4 RW? Toffoli, Boeser, Macewan and Virtanen. Toffoli and Boeser are on the top 2 lines. Third and forth line center you have Sutter and Gaudette. Sutter plays the harder mins than Gaudette, Gaudette plays the easier mins. It would make sense to put Macewan ( the player that has 20 nhl game experience with Gaudette ) and Virtanen with Sutter.

If you are going to have Macewan in the lineup. There is no other spot for Virtanen other than beside Sutter

 

[VanillaCoke]

That was a pivotal game, but more coming up against division opponents

 

[Hammer79]

The more things change, the more they stay the same. I'm so sick and tired of people just deflecting blame year after year after year. Nope, it's all the owner's fault. Nope, there's no way the owner could have possibly been sold on a rebuild, Benning had absolutely no choice whatsoever but to spend 6 years chasing quick fixes. Just sick of it. Remember when Linden got canned? Linden said four more years to be a contender, Benning said two. That was two years ago. He's given a mandate to win? How's that worked out?

And seriously, building a hockey team isn't like leveling a World of Warcraft character here. I keep seeing people talking like somehow just making the playoffs is like edging out of the newbie starting area and cashing in the first tier of quest rewards. It's not. With the cap situation as crap as it is, the team will be weaker next season. Possibly without Markstrom and/or Tanev. Just squeaking into the playoffs this season (probably to get crushed in round one) really isn't going to do much if the team slides back down the standings as it could easily do, what with there now being pretty much zero flexibility in the roster. I mean, this is year two since the Sedins retired, and they're already slammed back up against the cap with both Pettersson and Hughes on ELCs. The window is slamming shut before it ever really opened.

I would say it's more analogous to moving on from LFR to Mythics or Time Trials, or from random BG's to Arena. If your 3 vs 3 isn't communicating and working as a team, they will get stomped. You can't just throw a bunch of new players in vent and expect to get a 2600 rating. You wouldn't expect a random BG team to beat a pre-made.

When you are in a 7 game battle against a team, you have to quickly learn what the other team's weaknesses are and hope they don't exploit yours. The playoffs can be very illuminating too, it became clear that Lack wasn't an NHL starter after that tire fire of a series vs Calgary. Regular season success doesn't mean much if you can't bring it in a playoff series. This game may be getting younger in general, but there is a reason that vets usually get it done in the playoffs. They've been through these battles, these dissections of their team, of their own skills and have learned. You'll never get that from some random regular season game, you are in and out, off to the next destination.

As for the cap, we are compliant and contracts will be coming off the books. As for Tanev, if he's asking for more than $3.5M let him walk, the offense dies on his stick. There's a reason we were only offered mid round picks for him.

 

[ManoWarrior]

I would say it's more analogous to moving on from LFR to Mythics or Time Trials, or from random BG's to Arena. If your 3 vs 3 isn't communicating and working as a team, they will get stomped. You can't just throw a bunch of new players in vent and expect to get a 2600 rating. You wouldn't expect a random BG team to beat a pre-made.

When you are in a 7 game battle against a team, you have to quickly learn what the other team's weaknesses are and hope they don't exploit yours. The playoffs can be very illuminating too, it became clear that Lack wasn't an NHL starter after that tire fire of a series vs Calgary. Regular season success doesn't mean much if you can't bring it in a playoff series. This game may be getting younger in general, but there is a reason that vets usually get it done in the playoffs. They've been through these battles, these dissections of their team, of their own skills and have learned. You'll never get that from some random regular season game, you are in and out, off to the next destination.

As for the cap, we are compliant and contracts will be coming off the books. As for Tanev, if he's asking for more than $3.5M let him walk, the offense dies on his stick. There's a reason we were only offered mid round picks for him.

So Sbisa bucks for Tanev. Good luck with that...

 

[vanuck]

I would say it's more analogous to moving on from LFR to Mythics or Time Trials, or from random BG's to Arena. If your 3 vs 3 isn't communicating and working as a team, they will get stomped. You can't just throw a bunch of new players in vent and expect to get a 2600 rating. You wouldn't expect a random BG team to beat a pre-made.

When you are in a 7 game battle against a team, you have to quickly learn what the other team's weaknesses are and hope they don't exploit yours. The playoffs can be very illuminating too, it became clear that Lack wasn't an NHL starter after that tire fire of a series vs Calgary. Regular season success doesn't mean much if you can't bring it in a playoff series. This game may be getting younger in general, but there is a reason that vets usually get it done in the playoffs. They've been through these battles, these dissections of their team, of their own skills and have learned. You'll never get that from some random regular season game, you are in and out, off to the next destination.

As for the cap, we are compliant and contracts will be coming off the books. As for Tanev, if he's asking for more than $3.5M let him walk, the offense dies on his stick. There's a reason we were only offered mid round picks for him.

This is the same type of argument as when Bonino wasn't a good player because of how he looked in a 6-game sample against CGY, or that the Sedins weren't good because they looked poor against Boston.