2018-19 Roster Speculation Pt. 3: Started from the bottom now we're here

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Chainshot

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What's your take on Laaksonen and Sammuelssons long term projections?


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Long term, they are both likeable prospects. The timeline to arrive is what remains in question - by the time either are ready for prime time, the blueline could look very different.

Edit:

As for the projections comment - your point is?
 
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dkollidas

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projections

Well that’s what all of this is...

But the thing I have more faith in now is the management & coaches to properly bring along and develop the prospects.

We all thought the handling of Tage Thompson was ridiculous, that he should be playing in Rochester. They did it differently, and he has benefited.

Pilut Olofsson Nylander & Borgen are all looking very good in Rochester, along with others. Guhle might be the exception, but no one bats 1.000.
Obviously it remains to be seen how they play here. But I really do like the... “organic” method to development. Lots of slow-cooking. Obviously winning 10 straight & no injuries makes it easier to keep those players down, but it does seem like a conscious decision by management. They could’ve gotten rid of Beaulieu, Larsson & Girgensons and no one would’ve thought twice. Those 3 have been significant contributors though, and the players that replaced them, especially if they were those currently in Rochester, might not have been ready. It also might have not allowed the time they gave to Thompson.

That’s why I have faith in our management to help along in a positive manner with player development.
 

Chainshot

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Well that’s what all of this is...

But the thing I have more faith in now is the management & coaches to properly bring along and develop the prospects.

We all thought the handling of Tage Thompson was ridiculous, that he should be playing in Rochester. They did it differently, and he has benefited.

Pilut Olofsson Nylander & Borgen are all looking very good in Rochester, along with others. Guhle might be the exception, but no one bats 1.000.
Obviously it remains to be seen how they play here. But I really do like the... “organic” method to development. Lots of slow-cooking. Obviously winning 10 straight & no injuries makes it easier to keep those players down, but it does seem like a conscious decision by management. They could’ve gotten rid of Beaulieu, Larsson & Girgensons and no one would’ve thought twice. Those 3 have been significant contributors though, and the players that replaced them, especially if they were those currently in Rochester, might not have been ready. It also might have not allowed the time they gave to Thompson.

That’s why I have faith in our management to help along in a positive manner with player development.

While Guhle may be the victim of hype (PHam was man-crushing Guhle hard for a number of camps), he's in only his second pro season. He's got time to straighten out and sometimes overcoming adversity is good for a player's character and overall game. It wouldn't be the first time a young player has struggled, he has time to work through it.
 

Dingo44

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A friend of mine who is also a huge Sabres fan just threw this out - would you trade one of our firsts straight up for Jesse Puljujarvi if he was available?

It's a good question. I'm in favor of keeping those firsts, but he's a young guy who will be team controlled for a while and for some reason hasn't put it together in Edmonton (like so many others).
 

Push Dr Tracksuit

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A friend of mine who is also a huge Sabres fan just threw this out - would you trade one of our firsts straight up for Jesse Puljujarvi if he was available?

It's a good question. I'm in favor of keeping those firsts, but he's a young guy who will be team controlled for a while and for some reason hasn't put it together in Edmonton (like so many others).
i dont know, why is he available? is he busting? was he rushed? dropping a first on a reclamation project when we dont necessarily need to gamble with these assets, if we sit an do it right, where we are, things are fine
 

Chainshot

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A friend of mine who is also a huge Sabres fan just threw this out - would you trade one of our firsts straight up for Jesse Puljujarvi if he was available?

It's a good question. I'm in favor of keeping those firsts, but he's a young guy who will be team controlled for a while and for some reason hasn't put it together in Edmonton (like so many others).

Hitch's comments are that Poolparty is his project to turn into a top-6 winger in the next month. If that fails, maybe the Oil put him on the block then, but is Chiarelli really going to punt on that pick purely for futures?
 

Dingo44

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i dont know, why is he available? is he busting? was he rushed? dropping a first on a reclamation project when we dont necessarily need to gamble with these assets, if we sit an do it right, where we are, things are fine

Hitch's comments are that Poolparty is his project to turn into a top-6 winger in the next month. If that fails, maybe the Oil put him on the block then, but is Chiarelli really going to punt on that pick purely for futures?

I think at this point it's only my friend throwing this out as an idea because the Oilers keep losing and Chiarelli is going to Chiarelli. I'm not a fan of either trading firsts or grasping at reclamation projects with them especially, but Puljujarvi was considered the consensus #3 overall even if Columbus picked DuBois before him, and a year before the draft he was considered #2 with some thinking he could pass Matthews. That's all in the past, but there has to be something there - or maybe he's just Strome at this point.

All I know is if Botts pulled this trigger then I would trust his judgement.
 

Yatzhee

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Larsson is going to get a new contract from the Sabres with the way he's been playing.
Botterill is going to have to consider moves as the season heads for the half way to deadline mark given the contract situations with pressure from the pipeline yout's.

Here is my guess on in season moves...…
Girgensons, traded by deadline. While Girgs appears solidified on the 4th line, with the expected return of Wilson and his inability to find consistency in so far as play, he's expendable.
Rodriguez, traded by deadline. While ERod shows flashes of good to great game play, more often than not he disappears for long stretches, or worse, is actually a detriment to the team while on the ice. There are full on replacements in CJ Smith, A. Nylander and V. Olofsson waiting in the AHL for a chance to come up and take a spot on the team. Smith would be my guess as the one to fill in.

The albatross in the room is the Scandella/Pilut situation.
Scandella, I truly believe there is a hockey trade brewing where Botterill sends out Scandella for something of roster significance back. Be it a 1 for 1 or package deal.
I don't believe Scandella plays out in a Buffalo jersey past the deadline, regardless of where Buffalo is at in the standings. The emergence of Beaulieu and his coming off season contract as well as McCabe and his coming off season contract lead me to believe Buffalo will be moving on from Scandella with Pilut waiting in the wings.

There are issues to address with the 2nd scoring line for sure, specifically consistent contribution on the score sheets as well as chemistry. If we are building up Mitts as a line 2c, he'll need wingers better than he has now, and let's face it, Buffalo needs to have 2 sustainable, contributing scoring lines to gun with some of the Eastern Conference powerhouses longer term.

Girgs and ERod are marginally minimal moves off the roster given their respective roles. Scandella however, I would consider a larger move in an effort to further increase the Sabres scoring, while at the same time solving some of the D log jam they have going on in the organizational pipeline, top to bottom.
 
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Gabrielor

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I totally see a Scandella trade, but girgs and erod, I don’t see. They’re both talents that are cheap, and seem to have found their roles. Cheap talent will be something we need now.
 
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Tyler2829

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The albatross in the room is the Scandella/Pilut situation.
Scandella, I truly believe there is a hockey trade brewing where Botterill sends out Scandella for something of roster significance back. Be it a 1 for 1 or package deal.
I don't believe Scandella plays out in a Buffalo jersey past the deadline, regardless of where Buffalo is at in the standings. The emergence of Beaulieu and his coming off season contract as well as McCabe and his coming off season contract lead me to believe Buffalo will be moving on from Scandella with Pilut waiting in the wings.

Girgs and ERod are marginally minimal moves off the roster given their respective roles. Scandella however, I would consider a larger move in an effort to further increase the Sabres scoring, while at the same time solving some of the D log jam they have going on in the organizational pipeline, top to bottom.

Unless I missed some news, his non-injury absence from the game last night (after skating in the morning) is a little weird...
 

dkollidas

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Unless I missed some news, his non-injury absence from the game last night (after skating in the morning) is a little weird...

Could be anything. Family emergency or personal issue or who knows what else. It happens from time to time.
 

Weltschmerz

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Unless I missed some news, his non-injury absence from the game last night (after skating in the morning) is a little weird...

He was day to day like a week ago and there are many games to play. And his play wasn't that great either, so what's wrong with rotate the bottom pairing?
 

GrierIsGod123

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Good teams don't trade players like ERod.
Agreed. I'm not sure what other people are seeing in regards to ERod. Of course he's not going to be great every night, but generally makes his linemates better and actually makes plays on the ice. He passes the eye test (for me) and the Advanced Stats agree.

We should be much more concerned about a guy like Sobotka holding roster spots hostage, and the coaching staff's unwillingness to healthy scratch him.
 

haseoke39

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Some thoughts at the 25 game mark

1. Botterill/Housley are the frontrunners for Exec/Coach of the Year, and it's not close. We may have complaints about individual decisions, but the results are deafening. The system is sinking in, and the culture change is real. I think there are only two types of people at this point: people who think "culture" is an overblown concept and doesn't really mean anything, and people who think Botts nailed it (now, whether that's more from shipping out ROR, or swapping Lehner/Johnson for Hutton/Ullmark, or acquiring Skinner etc., I think we can all fairly speculate).

2. The roster was decided in August, and that may turn out to be a good thing. We saw substantially better forwards get sent down in camp than the ones who made it -- and, dare I say, Pilut might be the best defenseman in the Sabres organization this year. But accepting all that, look at the long-term cap situation. If we intend to sign Skinner, Reinhart, Mittelstadt, Dahlin to long-term deals, we're going to need cheaper bridge deals for some of the guys who are buried right now. What does burying a guy do? Makes him cheaper. Hell, look at Ullmark -- I think he could have had the starter's job, but we'll probably save $2M signing him as a backup next summer as opposed to giving him 50 games this year. With the team winning, it makes it fully justifiable to bury good players until you have to play them, because they're RFAs and you're really going to need them cheap down the line.

3. Sam Reinhart is the bellwether of Botterill's cap management strategy. Botts took cap dumps in order to build the roster this summer. He left himself inadequate money to sign Sam long-term. He will have to pay Sam a lot more on his next deal, but it could work out if he's smart enough with his money elsewhere (e.g., what's McCabe's next deal look like? Is he trade bait if he asks too much?). Especially if they sign Skinner, summer 2020 will be interesting.

4. First place feels a bit inflated. In terms of ranking teams based on their playoff chances, I prefer to count only 5-on-5 play, meaning everything tied at the end of regulation is basically a tie in terms of "real" hockey. In that world, the Sabres slip to 10-6-9 for 29 points, and the league leaders would the Preds at 15-7-3 for 33 points. Sabres would be fifth, behind the Preds, Lightning, Leafs and Avs. Still remarkable, just saying.

5. That said, this could be our year. I know it's not fashionable to say. But everybody was guarding their skepticism in November 2005, too. Hell, even the next season, we all thought 06-07 was the real peak. But in hindsight, 05-06 was the most complete team we put together in my lifetime. Now, I'm not saying go out and grab the biggest trade deadline name available, a top line/pairing talent who'll cost a fortune and leave in three months. But I am saying don't put us in the position of the 06 ECF Sabres. Identify our biggest weaknesses in terms of depth, and get something to help bolster the squad. Make sure you don't lose because you some targeted misfortune makes it impossible to win. Maybe this year, that ask is a responsible, mobile 3C, e.g. Take your chances seriously. Weirder shit has happened, and FFS, if Buffalo is ever going to win a championship, it has to be in the most unlikely fashion possible, right?

And enjoy the ride, everybody. We've soooooooooooo earned it.
 

GrierIsGod123

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Oct 22, 2009
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Some thoughts at the 25 game mark

1. Botterill/Housley are the frontrunners for Exec/Coach of the Year, and it's not close. We may have complaints about individual decisions, but the results are deafening. The system is sinking in, and the culture change is real. I think there are only two types of people at this point: people who think "culture" is an overblown concept and doesn't really mean anything, and people who think Botts nailed it (now, whether that's more from shipping out ROR, or swapping Lehner/Johnson for Hutton/Ullmark, or acquiring Skinner etc., I think we can all fairly speculate).

2. The roster was decided in August, and that may turn out to be a good thing. We saw substantially better forwards get sent down in camp than the ones who made it -- and, dare I say, Pilut might be the best defenseman in the Sabres organization this year. But accepting all that, look at the long-term cap situation. If we intend to sign Skinner, Reinhart, Mittelstadt, Dahlin to long-term deals, we're going to need cheaper bridge deals for some of the guys who are buried right now. What does burying a guy do? Makes him cheaper. Hell, look at Ullmark -- I think he could have had the starter's job, but we'll probably save $2M signing him as a backup next summer as opposed to giving him 50 games this year. With the team winning, it makes it fully justifiable to bury good players until you have to play them, because they're RFAs and you're really going to need them cheap down the line.

3. Sam Reinhart is the bellwether of Botterill's cap management strategy. Botts took cap dumps in order to build the roster this summer. He left himself inadequate money to sign Sam long-term. He will have to pay Sam a lot more on his next deal, but it could work out if he's smart enough with his money elsewhere (e.g., what's McCabe's next deal look like? Is he trade bait if he asks too much?). Especially if they sign Skinner, summer 2020 will be interesting.

4. First place feels a bit inflated. In terms of ranking teams based on their playoff chances, I prefer to count only 5-on-5 play, meaning everything tied at the end of regulation is basically a tie in terms of "real" hockey. In that world, the Sabres slip to 10-6-9 for 29 points, and the league leaders would the Preds at 15-7-3 for 33 points. Sabres would be fifth, behind the Preds, Lightning, Leafs and Avs. Still remarkable, just saying.

5. That said, this could be our year. I know it's not fashionable to say. But everybody was guarding their skepticism in November 2005, too. Hell, even the next season, we all thought 06-07 was the real peak. But in hindsight, 05-06 was the most complete team we put together in my lifetime. Now, I'm not saying go out and grab the biggest trade deadline name available, a top line/pairing talent who'll cost a fortune and leave in three months. But I am saying don't put us in the position of the 06 ECF Sabres. Identify our biggest weaknesses in terms of depth, and get something to help bolster the squad. Make sure you don't lose because you some targeted misfortune makes it impossible to win. Maybe this year, that ask is a responsible, mobile 3C, e.g. Take your chances seriously. Weirder **** has happened, and FFS, if Buffalo is ever going to win a championship, it has to be in the most unlikely fashion possible, right?

And enjoy the ride, everybody. We've soooooooooooo earned it.
Hell of a first post. Nail on the head.
 

Djp

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Jul 28, 2012
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I totally see a Scandella trade, but girgs and erod, I don’t see. They’re both talents that are cheap, and seem to have found their roles. Cheap talent will be something we need now.

U see Scandella trade in offseason
Girgs or Larsson traded in offseason and other signed. Larsson is ahead being ssweedish

At the deadline I see Beaulieu getting traded.
 

Tyler2829

Registered User
Jun 20, 2009
653
80
Rochester, NY
He was day to day like a week ago and there are many games to play. And his play wasn't that great either, so what's wrong with rotate the bottom pairing?

Nothing wrong with rotation. He deserved to sit anyways. I just thought it was odd that he took the morning skate lined up as if he was going to play, then he didn't, and it wasn't injury related.
 

Aavvaa

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Jul 2, 2018
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I totally see a Scandella trade, but girgs and erod, I don’t see. They’re both talents that are cheap, and seem to have found their roles. Cheap talent will be something we need now.
What kind of value can the Sabres get for Scandella? I think most would agree he's an average 2nd pairing D-man, and there are certainly some teams who could use upgrades on the back end, but if we're moving him, are we re-filling the Skinner picks or are we going after a legitimate player?

Tampa Bay only has three NHL D-men locked up for next year IIRC. I wonder if there's a fit there.
 
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