Speculation: 2017 Offseason Roster Discussion 3 - Langkow for a 1st Edition

[rt]

They've already got our 2nd and they don't have their own. Makes it tough.

 

[_Del_]

George is sort of artificially depressing the market for D. That's good news for us (and nearly everyone not trying to shed a dman). Methot just went for a G prospect and a 2020 pick.
If it's true that Tallon got the rumoured mandate to cut 10M (March, Smith and Demers is basically that), then we might be in a good spot to take advantage.

 

[rt]

Our 3rd in '18 and 2nd in '19?

 

[Matias Maccete]

Our 3rd in '18 and 2nd in '19?

Would it cost that much for Demers? Isn't Methot better? Hell even if they're equal Methot only for a' 20 2nd and a 7th round goalie, a 2nd and a 7th seems fair, no?

 

[Puck possession wins]

Our 3rd in '18 and 2nd in '19?

I'd rather give up a pick and somebody like Merkley for Demers. We're "low" on picks right now and I personally don't want to trade a 2nd or higher unless absolutely necessary. That said, RHD are at a premium

 

[_Del_]

We're getting an extra 2019 pick from the Flames. The problem with replacing a pick with Merkley is that Florida has to see something in Merkley (insert other project) that makes them more valuable to them than the pick. But sure, I'm all for it if they'd bite.

 

[_Del_]

I'm not seeing the need to move McGinn now that we've past the XDraft chance to deal him and had the purge. His value can only go up -- even if he stays bad, his contract is losing term. Not impossible that he gets a bump with the fresh start this year. Might rehab his value.

 

[XX]

Our 3rd in '18 and 2nd in '19?

Why are you overvaluing Demers? Most view him as a dump.

 

[_Del_]

Because even if Florida is trying to move him, he's still decent if not good value at 4.5M? I doubt the valuation provided by hfboards reflects his value among NHL GM's.

 

[rt]

Why are you overvaluing Demers? Most view him as a dump.

Good chance I'm wrong. It looks like we'll find out.

 

[Mosby]

George is sort of artificially depressing the market for D. That's good news for us (and nearly everyone not trying to shed a dman). Methot just went for a G prospect and a 2020 pick.
If it's true that Tallon got the rumoured mandate to cut 10M (March, Smith and Demers is basically that), then we might be in a good spot to take advantage.

Not sure if Vegas has any D left to trade at this point. Maybe Emelin, but the rest of the blueline is overpaid crap or young pieces they'd like to hold on to.

 

[rt]

Why are you overvaluing Demers? Most view him as a dump.

Good chance I'm wrong. It looks like we'll find out.

Okay. So I'm confused. Methot gets a 2020 2nd. But Brendan Smith who actually sucks at hockey and I wouldn't take over anyone on our blueline gets four and a half million per. Now Orlov, who's got warts that aren't much prettier than the ones Demers suffers from and gets five million per. So Demers I guess isn't actually overpaid but then also isn't worth much in trade? What in the world is going on? What is this market? Dollars mean nothing but draft picks are pure gold?

 

[Grimes]

Okay. So I'm confused. Methot gets a 2020 2nd. But Brendan Smith who actually sucks at hockey and I wouldn't take over anyone on our blueline gets four and a half million per. Now Orlov, who's got warts that aren't much prettier than the ones Demers suffers from and gets five million per. So Demers I guess isn't actually overpaid but then also isn't worth much in trade? What in the world is going on? What is this market? Dollars mean nothing but draft picks are pure gold?

The #4/5 defenseman seems to have significantly dropped in value this year. I think teams have overpaid time and time again (Washington just did with Orlov) in order to secure and stabilize their blueline with these type of players, only to find out that their 22 year old prospect that has been incubating for four years can step in and take over that position. Then when cap becomes an issue the team just needs to unload the contract for the best offer and have the younger players step in. The Scandella trade today seems to highlight this. The Stone trade, who may not even bring back the additional 5th because it is unclear if Calgary will even resign him, is another great example.

I also think we are seeing a shift in what a defense core needs. These borderline two-way/shutdown tweeners like Stone, Methot, Smith and Scandella are valuable to a degree. But having too many of these types of players in on core is a net negative. I think Washington's blueline has too many of these and it has hurt them in the playoffs; Alzner, Orlov, Oprik and Niskanen all brought something similar to the table, but don't lean heavily in one area of the game over the other. These are all fine players, but that's just it, they are just fine and nothing more.

The mobile, rangy defensive defenseman, ala Larsson, Vlasic and Hammer bring more to the core than the slower but heavier two-way guys. The speedy puck moving offensive dynamo does too. These in-between players can be peppered into any line up, but are often overpaid and aren't dynamic enough for the way the game is heading.

 

[IPreferPi]

Flames just bought out Ryan Murphy. Could be worth a look as a reclamation project.

 

[Ebb]

Flames just bought out Ryan Murphy. Could be worth a look as a reclamation project.

That was kind of an odd buyout, but we could have another (shrunken) Murphy on the roster if we signed him My only concern would be if he would better suited for 3rd or 2nd pairing duty.

Goligoski - Schenn
Chychrun - Murphy

Goligoski - Murphy
Chychrun - Schenn

For a year, that would be fine, but I'd still be looking elsewhere.

 

[rt]

Flames just bought out Ryan Murphy. Could be worth a look as a reclamation project.

I'm assuming he had strong PP production in the AHL over the last few years? Puts him sort of in that Pokka, Carrick, Postma category.

EDIT: did the math- last 4 AHLseasons:

86gp 64pts 33ppp

Very strong PP production in the AHL. I'd sign Murphy and Postma to give Wood some competition.

 

[XX]

Okay. So I'm confused. Methot gets a 2020 2nd. But Brendan Smith who actually sucks at hockey and I wouldn't take over anyone on our blueline gets four and a half million per. Now Orlov, who's got warts that aren't much prettier than the ones Demers suffers from and gets five million per. So Demers I guess isn't actually overpaid but then also isn't worth much in trade? What in the world is going on? What is this market? Dollars mean nothing but draft picks are pure gold?

I value Orlov a lot more than Demers. Him and Schmidt basically kept Washington's mediocre D looking good. Demers was also never super valuable to begin with but he had an awful year in Florida. How much of that is their organizational shenanigans, no one can say. But he seems to be on the outs with Tallon, who still needs to cut salary. They want wingers, the Coyotes have a couple of 'expensive' wingers in Martinook and Rieder.

Flames just bought out Ryan Murphy. Could be worth a look as a reclamation project.

You're funny

That was kind of an odd buyout, but we could have another (shrunken) Murphy on the roster if we signed him My only concern would be if he would better suited for 3rd or 2nd pairing duty.

Imagine a player half as good as DeAngelo; slower, scared, little fight in him.

 

[Ebb]

[on Ryan Murphy] You're funny

Well, we are pretty much looking for a 2nd or 3rd pairing RHD. He's only 24 and could improve. If no one else is found, he'd probably be worth a 1 year contract.

there ain't much out there...

 

[XX]

Well, we are pretty much looking for a 2nd or 3rd pairing RHD. He's only 24 and could improve. If no one else is found, he'd probably be worth a 1 year contract.

there ain't much out there...

I'd rather play K.Conn full time. On the wrong side.

 

[Ebb]

I'd rather play K.Conn full time. On the wrong side.

could easily happen if we signed him; it's not like Murphy would be expensive and we could easily waive him if another option opens up during the season.

 

[rt]

You bring Murphy to camp to challenge Wood. And then give him some AHL support.

 

[XX]

 

[RABBIT]

Promising. He doesn't feel we're complete yet, but doesn't sound like he wants to pay stupid costs. I can dig it.

 

[Puck possession wins]

In other news, Stone resigned with the Flames, so now we get an '18 5th rounder from them as part of that trade

 

[rt]

CGY sporting Hamilton, Hamonic, and Stone on RD. Does this make Rasmus Andersson available? Maybe for a forward prospect and/or some picks? Hometown boy Nick Merkley?