Proposal: 2016-17 Trade Rumours and Proposals Thread Part XIII

[IranCondraAffair]

If Vegas takes 4.9 mil , 1 year from UFA Methot over Wideman , or say Dzingel ... (we would protect Duchene)

Check out that Cap Friendly expansion tool. Its really not a gimme that we lose Methot.

Dzingel could be Smith or Pageau as well .. pick one

I think you have your contract lengths mixed up. Wideman is signed for one more season after this one. Methot will have two seasons left.

I do agree that that there are some strong arguments for taking Wideman or Dzingel. I don't know what other players will end up being available but there seems to be lots of LHD compared to RHD and lots of defense men compared to forwards.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I think you have your contract lengths mixed up. Wideman is signed for one more season after this one. Methot will have two seasons left.

I do agree that that there are some strong arguments for taking Wideman or Dzingel. I don't know what other players will end up being available but there seems to be lots of LHD compared to RHD and lots of defense men compared to forwards.

I stand corrected on Methot.. he does have 2 left.

I am not saying one or the other (Ceci + White + 1st) vs (Chabot + 1st) is a slam dunk by any means. Just throwing out the option.

I would be happy if we did neither and got some less high profile rental help but the market seems pretty expensive. I think we need to get an upgrade in the lineup somewhere.

 

[IlTerrifico]

I doubt Colorado would have any interest in that deal.

Tbh, if we're going after one of the big guns in Colorado, I'd much rather Landeskog, particularly if the price is a touch less.

I don't know about Landeskog - try to find examples of guys who dropped to a season as putrid as he's having and regained their touch. There aren't many. Often a sign that either the body is worn out or the passion is. Not anybody I can think of in the top 20-25 scorers who has rebounded from such a terrible ppg and become elite again.

 

[thehockeywatchinger]

Nantel and Greer in the trade for Duchene. They are not the bad. Give Chabot, Perron, +, +. I will be the fan.

 

[GWNR]

Nantel and Greer in the trade for Duchene. They are not the bad. Give Chabot, Perron, +, +. I will be the fan.

The fan?

As in the only fan that's happy? Interesting

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

So what about Chabot and a 1st for Duchene? This could possibly get it done or very close.

Less disruption to the current lineup but we lose our best prospect that happens to also be a D.

So the question is. .. to us who has more value Ceci + White or Chabot?

I really, really, really don't want to do that.

Chabot looks like his floor is a 2nd pairing D, with good 1st pairing potential. Plus he has good size and amazing skating ability and mobility that we desperately need right now. Erik is the only one on the blueline right now who can move the puck well and get things moving from the blueline on a consistent basis.

Duchene doesn't wow me enough to give that up. (And in all honesty, neither does Giroux, either....he isn't a kid anymore and it feels like his best days are behind him.) If we move Chabot, I want it to be in a package for a legitimate superstar.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

So what about Chabot and a 1st for Duchene? This could possibly get it done or very close.

Less disruption to the current lineup but we lose our best prospect that happens to also be a D.

So the question is. .. to us who has more value Ceci + White or Chabot?

I've been thinking about the Ceci+White+1st for Duchene a lot this week and I keep going back on fourth.

Pure speculation, but it is entirely possible that Phaneuf won't waive or he will but the Sens are too afraid of losing him to expose him in the draft. This would put the Sens in a situation where they'd be losing one of their top 4 regardless either via trade in the summer pre expansion draft to leverage their protection or via the expansion draft.

If they are floating the idea of trading a top 4 d in the summer it would make the most sense to trade Ceci because Ceci would have the most trade value on the market out of Phaneuf, Methot, and himself but he'd have the least immediate value to our lineup in the next few years as Phaneuf and Methot are likely to be better for the next 2.5 seasons.

The reason that is relevant to trading Ceci for Duchene now is that the only reason to wait until the summer to trade Ceci in anticipation of only being able to protect 3 defense is that it is easier to re-tool the roster in the summer and it wouldn't disrupt us on the way to the playoffs. But the problem is our lineup has already been heavily disrupted as a result of Stone/Hoff/Ryan going down. So if at any point they have been thinking about moving a top 4D to leverage against the expansion draft they might as well pull the trigger now. They disrupt the defense, but if Stone or Hoffman is out longer term they fix up the top 6. Ryan will be out a few weeks as it is, so that's at least two of them gone on the road to the playoffs.

They could wait until the summer and do the exact trade but then there's no guarantee Duchene is still available and no guarantee a better forward is on the market.

This is pure speculation on my part, there's been no reports they are trading one of their four top 4D. There were I think reports a few weeks ago about Phaneuf being asked to waive but it might have just been some analysts speculation misinterpreted as an actual rumour. So if they asked Phaneuf already he may have already said no.

 

[Liver King]

I think we'll see Ceci + Chalpik + 1st + Lazar for Duchene

fits the description (early 20's top 4, top prospect, 1st round pick, another piece) and is a lesser package than what people expect - which is usually the case.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Correct me if im wrong but wouldn't Ceci+1st+White+(insert prospect with a good chance of playing in nhl) be a package to get a borderline elite player? Not just a good first line center.

Guys these technicalities are giving me a headache. Borderline elite. Good first line center. Below average first liner. Average first liner.

Good first line center IS borderline elite. It's the same thing. He's a sixty point guy. 10 more points and he's near tops in the league.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

I think we'll see Ceci + Chalpik + 1st + Lazar for Duchene

fits the description (early 20's top 4, top prospect, 1st round pick, another piece) and is a lesser package than what people expect - which is usually the case.

I don't think that gets it done, but one more stinker of a game offensively and if the prognosis on Stone/Hoffman coming back soon doesn't take a positive spin I could see Dorion pulling the trigger if there is any truth to these rumours about Ceci+White+1st being the central package. The problem is that the timing of these injuries is terrible. Trade deadline is on Wednesday. We have two more games before then and not a lot of time to make the choice on whether to pull the trigger on a big trade.

Maybe it ends up being a much bigger trade.....

Ceci+White+Ryan+1st+Lazar for Duchene+Soderberg+bottom 6 forward or Iginla

Looking next year, that'd be almost exactly cap in/cap out. With nearly 11M going both ways in real money as well. Soderberg could bounce back with a change of scenery. It's 3 years left on Soderberg vs 5 on Ryan except Soderberg is a bit older. From an Ottawa perspective, they get Soderberg as an added forward rental even know they give up Ryan since Ryan is out anyways right now.

 

[bert]

I think we'll see Ceci + Chalpik + 1st + Lazar for Duchene

fits the description (early 20's top 4, top prospect, 1st round pick, another piece) and is a lesser package than what people expect - which is usually the case.

If thats the case sign me up but i dont think its happening.

They will want White ir Chabot.

As talented as Duchene is Ottawa cant move Chabot.

The deal that makes the most sense fo Ottawa is White, Ceci as the center pieces.

Duchene gives ottawa a legitimate first line player to go along with Stone. Load em up together and see what happens. This is an opportunity to get a game breaker in his prime i hope they can pull the trigger.

Its really too bad the Michael Stone deal is already done as he would have been a perfect fit for Cecis minutes.

Duchene Brassard Stone
Dzingel Turris Hoffman
Smith Pageau Ryan
Pyatt Kelly Lazar

 

[topshelf15]

Sakic is playing offers off one another,which is fine for a short while .But it could end up blowing up in his face if he isnt careful .

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Sakic is playing offers off one another,which is fine for a short while .But it could end up blowing up in his face if he isnt careful .

And in this case "blowing up in his face" means continuing to have Matt duchene on his team. The horror.

 

[Sens]

And in this case "blowing up in his face" means continuing to have Matt duchene on his team. The horror.

What a shame being stuck with a 60+ point center with blazing speed

 

[Cat Herder]

I keep seeing Ryan mentioned in people's trade scenarios.. I didnt think you could trade a person that was injured

 

[Micklebot]

What a shame being stuck with a 60+ point center with blazing speed

60+ pts center on pace for his 3rd consecutive season to miss 60 pts...

There's nothing wrong with Colorado sticking with Duchene. I don't expect them to have issues re-signing him in 2 years, so keeping him isn't blowing up in their faces, but they really need help on D, and I don't see much success for that team in it's current makeup.

 

[jason2020]

And in this case "blowing up in his face" means continuing to have Matt duchene on his team. The horror.

No it means you lose him for nothing in a couple years or he comes out and demands a trade which would lower his value big time.

 

[Sens]

No it means you lose him for nothing in a couple years or he comes out and demands a trade which would lower his value big time.

Worst case is they deal him for a 1st in 2018 or 2019 and a prospect... gain 6.0 in cap space to play with

He's still under contract for another two years

 

[Sens]

60+ pts center on pace for his 3rd consecutive season to miss 60 pts...

59Pts in 76GP last year... guess he could have gone pointless if he played the missed games

 

[Micklebot]

59Pts in 76GP last year... guess he could have gone pointless if he played the missed games

So he might have hit it 1 year out of 3 and that makes him a 60+ center?

Look, he's a great player, and maybe he rebounds into the player he was 4 seasons ago, but maybe he doesn't. Maybe he's another mid to high 50's producer from this point on in his career.

 

[Blotto71]

Erik Johnson - right shot. Tyson Barrie - right shot. Do either of those two play the left side? I don't know. But unless one of them does - and excels at it - I don't see Colorado taking Ceci so he can play 3rd pair minutes.

If the Sens are not willing to send Chabot (and I hope that remains the case), then the D going as part of a Duchene package would likely need to be Methot. Methot + White + pick (and I'd question if adding a pick wouldn't be an overpayment at that point). The Sens would then need a deal for a top-4 LHD...Brendan Smith?

Conclusion, chances of Duchene landing in Ottawa, unlikely.

 

[The Lewler]

Really curious to see if Dorion is going to fall for the shiny toy trap here.

Would forward depth be good? Absolutely.

But there is nary a team in the league that could sustain losing 3 of their top 6 forwards simultaneously , including their best forward, and just replace them with organizational depth.

You don't need to hollow out your D core to find another top 3 forward.

 

[Sens]

So he might have hit it 1 year out of 3 and that makes him a 60+ center?

Look, he's a great player, and maybe he rebounds into the player he was 4 seasons ago, but maybe he doesn't. Maybe he's another mid to high 50's producer from this point on in his career.

From 2012 to 2016 he put up
276GP 227Pts 0.822PPG

That's 67Pts per 82

If you want to knock him because the Avs suck this year with a coach who should not be in the NHL... that's your prerogative

 

[operasen]

......

Duchene Brassard Stone
Dzingel Turris Hoffman
Smith Pageau Ryan
Pyatt Kelly Lazar

Would you not keep him as the Centre and move Brassard to the Wing?

Dzingel - Duchene - Hoffman (that's a fast group)
Brassard - Turris - Stone
Smith - Pageau - Ryan
Pyatt - Kelly - Wingels
Neil, Lazar

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Erik Johnson - right shot. Tyson Barrie - right shot. Do either of those two play the left side? I don't know. But unless one of them does - and excels at it - I don't see Colorado taking Ceci so he can play 3rd pair minutes.

We already know the Avalanche were linked to other RDs as part of this trade. I originally would have said the same thing as you, but I think it is pretty evident that they are trying to rebuild their team by trading 2 or maybe 3 (if they decide to part with Barrie) players in order to try and get the biggest possible haul of young talent that will make them better down the line.

When your team is last in the league, you don't really have to worry about short term team building moves with trades like this. They are probably trying to get the most value and then over time they can make trades to balance things out. Similar to how NHL teams usually take the BPA in the draft regardless of team need that day.