2014 Free Agency Continues ...

[SprDaVE]

If Franson gets traded eventually, I think he could be a good fit as an offensive defender bottom pairing defender. We'll need a new partner for Rielly or Gardiner on that 2nd PP, and I don't think Robidas has much to give there.

You can never have too many NHL ready defenders and he could provide some pretty good depth, all though our young defenders probably deserve some minutes over him. If anything, he would be all right as a 6th-7th defender. Alternate between him and MacWilliam depending on who's playing well and the need of a different style of defender.

Gardiner - Phaneuf
Rielly - Robidas
MDZ - Granberg
MacWilliam - Holzer

With that said, it doesn't seem to fit our motto for this off-season. He's not a huge competitor and has struggled badly in his own end. I don't think the Leafs want to bring in players that have questionable work ethic.

 

[ACC1224]

Are there any real reports about what happened to this guy?

edit - Del Zotto

 

[SprDaVE]

Yes, so he says what he thinks, and what most people would think in this situation, and he should be burned at the cross. Milgram experiment …...

Burning at the cross? Hum, no.

He's still a cry baby though.

"Wwwwaaaahhhhh they don't want to give me my 8 year contract? That's not fair! What a slap in the face!"

So dramatic that Johansen. He can ask for whatever he wants but he doesn't have to whine about it. First world problems... Can you have imagine Kadri saying those things about his contract negotiations last season?

 

[SprDaVE]

Are there any real reports about what happened to this guy?

edit - Del Zotto

I don't think there's anything bad that happened off the ice... he just isn't that good on the ice, especially for the salary he was getting paid.

Carolina from what I've read will probably sign him though, for whatever it's worth. I just don't see the Leafs signing him because of his question marks.

 

[dubplatepressure]

I don't think there's anything bad that happened off the ice... he just isn't that good on the ice, especially for the salary he was getting paid.

Carolina from what I've read will probably sign him though, for whatever it's worth. I just don't see the Leafs signing him because of his question marks.

Seems like we're trying to get better defensively. Not to mention we have a handful of NHL ready or near ready kids that can benefit from sheltered minutes.

 

[ACC1224]

I don't think there's anything bad that happened off the ice... he just isn't that good on the ice, especially for the salary he was getting paid.

Carolina from what I've read will probably sign him though, for whatever it's worth. I just don't see the Leafs signing him because of his question marks.

Was he not looking at some point to be a career top 4 Defenseman?
Just seemed like he fell off the face of the earth(to me anyway).

 

[dubplatepressure]

Was he not looking at some point to be a career top 4 Defenseman?
Just seemed like he fell off the face of the earth(to me anyway).

He's always been an offensive defenseman. This is a snippet from his HF prospect page:

Excellent offensive instincts, as well as exceptional skating and passing skills, Del Zotto plays with an edge to his game. A character player, with some defensive issues, there were questions about Del Zotto's conditioning in the past. However, he has changed his conditioning regimen this season and is developing better gap control in his own zone.

So the book on him was out from the beginning. The particular year he hit 40 pts, he played most with Stralman at even strength, and with Brad Richards who had 66 pts and Gaborik who had 40 goals and 76 pts. He played 2nd pairing minutes and was one of the only OFDs on a defensive core with Staal, Girardi, Sauer, and McDonaugh. He would occasionally PK but his SHTOI/g was 5th behind Girardi, McDonaugh, Staal and Sauer. He was #1 in PPTOI/g though. 35% of his points came from PP.

OFDs that stake their claim on output offensively have to catch up and learn the game quick at an NHL level, or they just end up becoming Brennans, Bergerons (Marc Andre), etc. They're decent #4/#5 guys that can put up points, but you're wrong thinking they can handle a greater role than that. I think what happens is most players once they start producing tend to think they've elevated their game more than they actually have, and expect to play a top-3 role because of it.

 

[ACC1224]

He's always been an offensive defenseman. This is a snippet from his HF prospect page:



So the book on him was out from the beginning. The particular year he hit 40 pts, he played most with Stralman at even strength, and with Brad Richards who had 66 pts and Gaborik who had 40 goals and 76 pts. He played 2nd pairing minutes and was one of the only OFDs on a defensive core with Staal, Girardi, Sauer, and McDonaugh. He would occasionally PK but his SHTOI/g was 5th behind Girardi, McDonaugh, Staal and Sauer. He was #1 in PPTOI/g though. 35% of his points came from PP.

OFDs that stake their claim on output offensively have to catch up and learn the game quick at an NHL level, or they just end up becoming Brennans, Bergerons (Marc Andre), etc. They're decent #4/#5 guys that can put up points, but you're wrong thinking they can handle a greater role than that. I think what happens is most players once they start producing tend to think they've elevated their game more than they actually have, and expect to play a top-3 role because of it.

Thanks for that.
I knew he had offensive ability but always thought he was more capable defensively. I only ever saw him vs The Leafs or parts of the occassional Ranger game.

 

[calcal798]

I've always wanted Daley. Lupul would round out the Stars top six nicely...not sure how the Leafs would replace Lupul's 25 goals though.

The Stars top four consists of Goligoski, Daley, Dillon and Benn. I would think that if they were going to trade anyone in it, it would be for a different type of defenseman, or an upgrade, so I don't think a trade for Lupul would be their first choice.

 

[Joey Hoser]

The only reason I can see to bring it MDZ would be to make Gardiner expendable and traded for help elsewhere.

Our pro scouts are awful though, so I have no faith in their ability to evaluate MDZ's ability to get his game back.

 

[SprDaVE]

Sounds like a long shot... but wouldn't signing Kevin Hayes be a good free wallet signing? Sounds like the Flames or the Panthers have the inside track but perhaps we can entice him with playing time. He can't sign before August 15 though I think, so we'll see.

We have a need down the middle on the Marlies and if he plays well, he could even find himself with the Leafs in a years time.

 

[dubplatepressure]

Our pro scouts are awful though, so I have no faith in their ability to evaluate MDZ's ability to get his game back.

No offense, but I trust the evaluation of paid professionals employed by the richest NHL franchise in the world infinitely more than I trust your (or anyone here's) evaluation of our pro scouts.

Besides... can't see where you are coming from - there have been some great middle round picks blossoming of late.

 

[SprDaVE]

No offense, but I trust the evaluation of paid professionals employed by the richest NHL franchise in the world infinitely more than I trust your (or anyone here's) evaluation of our pro scouts.

Besides... can't see where you are coming from - there have been some great middle round picks blossoming of late.

He said pro scouts, not amateur scouts.

Our amateur scouts for the most part have been all right. The pro scouts, which evaluate the talent of the professional athletes from the NHL, AHL and Europe, have been very underwhelming.

 

[dubplatepressure]

He said pro scouts, not amateur scouts.

Our amateur scouts for the most part have been all right. The pro scouts, which evaluate the talent of the professional athletes from the NHL, AHL and Europe, have been very underwhelming.

Again, and how are we to determine such things with any degree of accuracy?

 

[SprDaVE]

Again, and how are we to determine such things with any degree of accuracy?

Take a look at our acquisitions and free agent signings in recent years? It's really simple.

A lot of duds, and I mean a lot of them, dusted with a couple good ones.

 

[dubplatepressure]

Take a look at our acquisitions and free agent signings in recent years? It's really simple.

A lot of duds, and I mean a lot of them, dusted with a couple good ones.

And a huge assumption of correlation to our pro scouts being poor?

 

[BreakingGood]

No offense, but I trust the evaluation of paid professionals employed by the richest NHL franchise in the world infinitely more than I trust your (or anyone here's) evaluation of our pro scouts.

Besides... can't see where you are coming from - there have been some great middle round picks blossoming of late.

You realize that this team has been garbage for nearly fifty years, right?

 

[SprDaVE]

And a huge assumption of correlation to our pro scouts being poor?

You think GM's do all of the work? There's a lot of insight from the pro scouts in there, just like the amateur scouts give the insight at the draft.

They are the ones that evaluate the players for our needs, where they would fit in our system and a crap load of other criteria's.

There's a huge correlation from the signings and acquisitions to our pro scouts. They identified a lot of players that simply sucked arse for the roles they were brought in to do. Why is this so difficult to understand?

 

[dubplatepressure]

You realize that this team has been garbage for nearly fifty years, right?

Amid a turnstile of pro scouts, amateur scouts, european scounts, junior and senior management, varying executive personalities, coaches, trainers, etc? And it's the pro scouts you say that cause our woes?

 

[dubplatepressure]

You think GM's do all of the work? There's a lot of insight from the pro scouts in there, just like the amateur scouts give the insight at the draft.

They are the ones that evaluate the players for our needs, where they would fit in our system and a crap load of other criteria's.

There's a huge correlation from the signings and acquisitions to our pro scouts. They identified a lot of players that simply sucked arse for the roles they were brought in to do. Why is this so difficult to understand?

Oh I get it - I just don't think we come close to seeing the whole picture so we aren't in a position to be making such unequivocal statements.

 

[timlap]

You realize that this team has been garbage for nearly fifty years, right?

Garbage? For the entire 50 years? Is every team garbage except the Cup winner, or can we be proud of the Quinn years, and the Burns years, and a decent portion of the Nielson years?

I think our big mistake in recent years was not rebuilding immediately as the Sundin era ended. We were an aging team and decline was inevitable. However I think we've been doing a decent job rebuilding since Burke came along, but the media is extremely impatient and so are many fans.

We have good list of talents but a bad mix. I can appreciate how Nonis/Shanahan are trying to shuffle the deck with a new mix. We'll see...

Meanwhile we continue to acquire some intriguing young talents.

 

[APV]

what are the chances we can get Kane out of winnipeg while still retaining kadri/lupul?

Holland, Franson, Reimer, Leivo, 2nd?

Too much? Too little?

JvR-Bozak-Kessel
Lupul-Kadri-Kane
Komarov-Kontiola-Clarkson
Bodie-Santorelli-Frattin

That would make me excited.

 

[dubplatepressure]

what are the chances we can get Kane out of winnipeg while still retaining kadri/lupul?

Holland, Franson, Reimer, Leivo, 2nd?

Too much? Too little?

JvR-Bozak-Kessel
Lupul-Kadri-Kane
Komarov-Kontiola-Clarkson
Bodie-Santorelli-Frattin

That would make me excited.

B level prospects and players... not enough to consider moving Kane IMO.

 

[ACC1224]

what are the chances we can get Kane out of winnipeg while still retaining kadri/lupul?

Holland, Franson, Reimer, Leivo, 2nd?

Too much? Too little?

JvR-Bozak-Kessel
Lupul-Kadri-Kane
Komarov-Kontiola-Clarkson
Bodie-Santorelli-Frattin

That would make me excited.

Not even close.

 

[pspot]

I know at one time he was thought to be a top pair defence and being only 24 I'm not sure what went wrong for him and why know one has picked him up? At 2.25 mill he seem like a bargain if he can get his grove back

if they moved someone like Gardiner in a trade for someone like ROR
I think picking up MDZ would be a great move