Salary Cap: 2014-15-Happy Thoughts

[Frk It]

I'd go with Marek Zidlicky in my opinion. Slightly younger, plays in that defense first system in New Jersey and does well. Cheaper, still puts up around 40 points a year.

Zidlicky would be a solid pick-up.

 

[Henkka]

Nope, I've never heard of injuries, here I thought the Red Wings were playing healthy all year.

I know you're the resident GM but you can't have your 13th presser box forward making $1.8 million. That's poor management. Just like you can't have millions of dollars playing in the AHL.

It's better than 3.0M at 14th forward position. Salary cap development.

Abdelkader was pretty good last night. Far from at 13th forward.

 

[mindfly]

Golden opportunity this off-season

Let's all be very rational here. The worst players on the team are all FA's at the end of the season (Cleary, Bertuzzi, Samuelsson, Quincey). Can Anyone give a rational explanation why anyone of these should get re-signed? They don't score, They don't bring energy, They get scored on all the time, What's POSITIVE about them... Good lockerrom guys? Leadership? Is that enough to bring them back?

If you were to give a % of how big of a chance anyone of these gets re-signed, what would that be?

I can't come up with one(1) real reason why they should re-sign them, but Ken Holland is the GM...

 

[Vladdy84]

Get rid of the trash and hire Blash.

Or just getting rid of the trash would suffice.

 

[jaster]

Who do you classify as mediocre in the lineup?

I see that as a significant upgrade over our current lineup (injuries or otherwise).

It could be a significant upgrade. Might not be. But that's not the point for me, the point is building the best roster you can next year, and with that much youth, you become a bit of a wild card. I want players like Cleary and Samuelsson off the roster as much as the next guy, but I don't want them all replaced by kids. That's the general theme on this board, but I think it's faulty. Surrounding your core players, you should have a good balance of vets and youth. Bring up the kids that are ready/no longer waiver exempt, but don't flood the roster with them. Too much damage can be done, to players, the team, and to organizational depth.

To answer your question though, maybe "mediocre" wasn't the right word to convey my point. I just mean that none of our prospects are blue chippers (some would argue Mantha, but I don't think so); guys who will step in and dominate right away. I really like our prospect pool and think some of these guys can be/will be special players, but they are not collectively good enough to sprinkle throughout the lineup and then expect the same results as a properly balanced roster.

 

[BamaWing]

Yes get rid of them. Give me youth and new blood for once. I'll take my growing pains with those but I'm getting tired of watching players getting slower and declining as the season goes.

 

[InjuredChoker]

one could add eaves to that list.

i don't see a need for him unless he plays like last night the rest of the year. then maybe. on a cheap deal.

 

[Kyleftlx]

Isn't this the same thread as the 2014/15 happy whatever thread lol?
I don't think Holland is bringing back any of these guys. I do think Holland will sign a free agent to a big contract, whether it's a guy we want, or a guy we think is too old, slow, whatever. I think he'll try to make a move to improve the defense, and my worry is that while he doesn't end up signing Cleary/Bert/etc. he may sign a veteran free agent forward that will basically end up being a reason a kid like Callahan or Ferraro will be sent down.
The problem really is that Holland has filled the roster, even into next year, with basically everything you already see on it this year. Detroit has a full roster with Tootoo as well as the current GR guys playing like Glendening, Jurco, Sheahen, etc. My hope for Detroit is that Holland doesn't just sign a ton of free agents, but also pulls off a really good trade that can move some of the assets Detroit may end up losing on waivers for someone really good that can boost the team up from wild card to division contenders. If Holland has a good offseason, Detroit CAN become contenders again.

 

[Frk It]

Cleary is on pace to end up with 12 pts and a -14

There's no way anyone could defend bringing him back

 

[RedWingzz]

Chances of each UFA returning:

-Daniel Alfredsson (60%)
-Jonas Gustavsson (50%)
-Patty Eaves (33%)
-Kyle Quincey (30%)
-Daniel Cleary (25%)
-Todd Bertuzzi (5%)
-Mikael Samuelsson (0%)

These figures represent my opinion on what management will do. If I'm in charge, see ya later Sammy, Bert, Cleary, KFQ. No contract offered to any. I'm still not sure about Alfie, if he can get healthy and play well down the stretch, and wants back, then I'd offer him 1 year at a maximum of 5 million, if that's not enough, see ya later. I'd offer Monster a 1 year deal in the 1.5-2 million range, no more than that. If he thinks he's worth more, see ya later. A couple weeks ago I was convinced Patty Eaves would be gone as well, but his play as of late may have me thinking otherwise. Keep this up, and maybe I'd offer him 1 year, at just over a million, or 2 years at just over 2. If that's not good enough, then see ya later.

 

[icKx]

If you were to give a % of how big of a chance anyone of these gets re-signed, what would that be?

100% that at least one of them is brought back -- my guess is Q

Despite what the homers will say we've been waiting for a 'different' offseason for three years now and it's only been business as usual: bury the kids, trade for losers and overpay vets.

Holland has one last summer to prove he's not a clueless has-been.

 

[RedWingzz]

Cleary is on pace to end up with 12 pts and a -14

There's no way anyone could defend bringing him back

Last season his numbers were terrible too, not as bad, but still horrible, and look what happened. I will be praying to the God's that I do not believe in that he does not come back. If Bertuzzi is resigned though in my opinion that would be a bigger disaster.

 

[jaster]

Seems to me like the most logical bottom 6 to start next year would be

Tatar-Helm-Abdelkader
Miller-Sheahan-Ferraro

Actually, I have a hard time seeing it being anything else.

Really? Want to make a bet on that? Not that I think you have grossly misplaced any of those 6 guys, but there are so many possibilities, that any single guess, including yours, is not probable.

With your guess in particular, I can easily see Abs staying in the top-6. Possibly Tatar too, if he keeps going the way he's going. I'm not convinced Ferraro will be on the team, or at least in the top-12, and Glendening is doing a fairly good job cementing himself in the lineup, at least in Babcock's eyes.

EDIT: I'm not convinced Andersson will be scrapped either.

Better than what we have right now, which is too many mediocre veterans, that just continue to decline more and more.

I'd like to see the best roster possible next year, not just one that is better than this year by flipping from too many mediocre veterans to too much mediocre youth. I want balance. Balance wins.

 

[Frk It]

Last season his numbers were terrible too, not as bad, but still horrible, and look what happened. I will be praying to the God's that I do not believe in that he does not come back. If Bertuzzi is resigned though in my opinion that would be a bigger disaster.

Exactly, your 25% should be 50% IMO

We watched Cleary be just as equally worthless, and still be rewarded with a contract.

Any time your head coach self proclaims that he is the biggest fan of a player there is, you have to figure there's a shot he'll be back.

 

[RedWingzz]

It could be a significant upgrade. Might not be. But that's not the point for me, the point is building the best roster you can next year, and with that much youth, you become a bit of a wild card. I want players like Cleary and Samuelsson off the roster as much as the next guy, but I don't want them all replaced by kids. That's the general theme on this board, but I think it's faulty. Surrounding your core players, you should have a good balance of vets and youth. Bring up the kids that are ready/no longer waiver exempt, but don't flood the roster with them. Too much damage can be done, to players, the team, and to organizational depth.

To answer your question though, maybe "mediocre" wasn't the right word to convey my point. I just mean that none of our prospects are blue chippers (some would argue Mantha, but I don't think so); guys who will step in and dominate right away. I really like our prospect pool and think some of these guys can be/will be special players, but they are not collectively good enough to sprinkle throughout the lineup and then expect the same results as a properly balanced roster.

I dunno, Tomas Jurco is looking pretty damn good (that shootout attempt aside, but I'll let it slide, he's younger than me, and extremely skilled) I think if we put Jurco in a top 6 position, playing with other skilled players, and getting significant PP minutes, he could already be a 50+ point NHL player. That being said, I don't even think he makes opening night roster next year, due to his ability to be sent down without waivers.

 

[RedWingzz]

In my opinion, Landon Ferraro has not shown enough to be given a spot next year. I would trade him for a late pick if there are any other takers. If not, then oh well, we waive him next year and he may or may not get claimed.

 

[Vladdy84]

Exactly, your 25% should be 50% IMO

We watched Cleary be just as equally worthless, and still be rewarded with a contract.

Any time your head coach self proclaims that he is the biggest fan of a player there is, you have to figure there's a shot he'll be back.

Clears does things that would make any other coach's head explode and relegate his ass to the bench and or press box. Yet Babcock just ignores it and keeps putting him out there in critical situations. I will give Babcock credit for curbing that as of late with the emergence of the youth players(Jurco, Sheahan) and not even thinking about putting Clears out in OT.

 

[Outl4w]

I really think playing Jurco, Sheahan, Gleanding, Tatar, and Nyquist will set up and make our future core forwards better hockey players. Not sure about Gleanding being part of the core, but he definitely outskates Cleary,Sammy, and Bert.

 

[Outl4w]

Dan Cleary doesn't make mistakes.He plays with passion and heart. He just falls down and loses the puck. He will be caught out of position just becuase the opposing team's skating ability is just better. His veteran presence is needed just ask Babcock and Holland.

 

[TheOtherOne]

I wouldn't mind Cleary being back if he's a cheap 4th liner who's scratched when everyone is healthy. Would we really miss the $1M? Is it that big a deal?

The other 3 I would dump in a heartbeat.

 

[RedWingsForPresident]

None of these should be re-signed. Cleary and Bert won't be traded. Quincey and Samuelsson are possibilities.

Samuelsson has a NTC, but with him being a healthy scratch all the time, I could see him waving it. Maybe get a late draft pick out of him.

Quincey could be moved, but I honestly don't know who'd take him

 

[jaster]

I think the chances of these guys coming back are.....

Alfredsson - 80%
Gustavsson - 50% (defaulting to 50/50 here because I really have no idea)
Cleary - 20%
Bertuzzi - 10%
Eaves - 5%
Quincey - 0%
Samuelsson - 0%

I think Alfie will be back, and maybe Monster, but that's it. I know the argument regarding Cleary and how much Babcock likes him, but he's just been so bad, worse than last year. Maybe I'm way off. Maybe for ~800k it's 100% that he comes back

 

[Henkka]

Golden opportunity or not, IT WILL HAPPEN at next season.

Our kids losing their waiver eligibility will push those old dogs out automatically.

1. Zeta --> Zeta
2. Dats --> Dats
3. Mule --> Mule
4. Alfie --> Alfie/high-priced UFA
5. Weiss --> Weiss
6. Helm --> Helm
7. Nyquist --> Nyquist
8. Tatar --> Tatar
9. Akader --> Akader
10. Bertuzzi --> Sheahan big body for young big body
11. Miller --> Miller
12. Andersson --> Andersson
13. Cleary --> Callahan young gritty and pesty guy with same PK and net-front abilities
14. Sammy --> Ferraro real energy line player.
---------------------------------------
15. Tootoo --> waivered Tootoo again, or maybe bought out with compliance buyout
16. Eaves --> let walk
17. Emmerton --> let walk
18. Glendening --> Glendening (waiver-free 1st callup for Bottom6)
19. Jurco --> Jurco (waiver-free 1st callup for TOP6)

These are no-brainers for me. And I also think they are same for Holland.

We don't have to keep that extra experince there anymore anyhow. There's enough experience on that current core. There would be six forwards at +30s (Zeta, Dats, Mule, Alfie, Weiss, Miller) + two guys (Helm and Abdelkader) in their prime age with SC Final experience and the rest of the guys are AHL Champions. Pretty nice building blocks who'll know how to play winning hockey.

 

[Corax]

Zidlicky would be a solid pick-up.

Defensively, the worse D I have seen in NHL. Compare his production and his +/-
Now the problem is not only that he is horrible on D, but he hooks and grabs as he is often behind the play.
He averages close to minute per game in penalty box.

 

[Frk It]

Really? Want to make a bet on that? Not that I think you have grossly misplaced any of those 6 guys, but there are so many possibilities, that any single guess, including yours, is not probable.

With your guess in particular, I can easily see Abs staying in the top-6. Possibly Tatar too, if he keeps going the way he's going. I'm not convinced Ferraro will be on the team, or at least in the top-12, and Glendening is doing a fairly good job cementing himself in the lineup, at least in Babcock's eyes.

EDIT: I'm not convinced Andersson will be scrapped either.

I think Babcock has wised up regarding Abdelkader. After the initial trial period, when Franzen has been healthy Abdelkader has been a mainstay in the bottom 6. He only goes back to the top 6 when Franzen is out, to be the replacement "big body winger".

Ferraro is the only guy I really see as the wild card.

I view the top 6 as most likely being: Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen, Alfredsson, Nyquist, Weiss

And 5/6 of the bottom 6 being solidly: Helm, Tatar, Abdelkader, Miller, Sheahan

Now that 12th forward could be any of Glendening, Ferraro, Cleary (god no), but I think the rest of the roster is somewhat set.

And you could swap Nyquist and Tatar in terms of top 6 or bottom 6, but seems to me Babcock has always thought higher of Nyquist, and has almost always put him higher on the depth chart.

I'd like to see the best roster possible next year, not just one that is better than this year by flipping from too many mediocre veterans to too much mediocre youth. I want balance. Balance wins.

I agree which is why I think guys like Jurco and Mantha won't start on the team next year.