GDT: #19 | FLYERS (A) vs. Penguins (H) | Tue., Mar. 2 | 7:00 pm ET|NBCSN, SNE, SNO, SNW, ATTSN-PT, NBCSP

[Canfly]

I think Hayes is best suited for a line where he is the most skilled player on that line. Obviously he isn't in that situation right now, but I'm not convinced that he is hampering the success of other players at the moment.

Hayes would have better numbers if he used his wingers more effectively.

 

[Striiker]

I think Hayes is best suited for a line where he is the most skilled player on that line. Obviously he isn't in that situation right now, but I'm not convinced that he is hampering the success of other players at the moment.

I think he could do just fine with lesser skilled players, but I also think he'd be mostly fine with skilled guys so long as he's not with guys who are primarily playmakers, like Giroux and Voracek.

Something like Lindblom-Hayes-TK maybe. See if that can help give those guys a boost, then put G with Couturier and Farabee so G has people to set up, and then JVR and Jake with Patrick.

 

[deadhead]

Hayes would have better numbers if he used his wingers more effectively.

He's on pace for 58 ES and 88 total points. What more do you want from a 2C?

 

[Canfly]

He's on pace for 58 ES and 88 total points. What more do you want from a 2C?

And his numbers could be even better if he used the wingers more efficiently. I'm not a Hayes hater because he does bring good qualities, PK and is a good second line center. He does not fit with Giroux is what most of us are saying.

 

[Striiker]

Just to clarify, it's not just Giroux that he's a problem with. Hayes puck hogging problem is something people have been pointing out his entire time here.

Giroux just happens to be the current guy being affected by it, which is an issue because he's been our best player this year and we don't want him being held back.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

What it boils down to is some people want a scapegoat for Giroux's mediocre ES point production thus far.

That scapegoat is Hayes.

I simply do not believe that Hayes is dragging down his linemates. His production has been excellent, so offensive chances are being created when he's on the ice. He's excellent at gaining the offensive zone with the puck and establishing possession, something Giroux struggles with in his 30s.

Playing with Hayes should not be a negative for Giroux. Not everyone gets to play with Couturier. And if you can get the type of production the JVR-Couturier-Farabee line is providing, while still having your two highest paid forwards and leading goal scorer from last season all still available for other lines, that should be a boon.

 

[Striiker]

Nobody needs to “scapegoat” anything. Giroux's been our best player so far and his “mediocre” scoring is bad luck more than anything else. There’s nothing that needs to be defended.

Changing the lines is about the always present need to improve wherever possible, no matter how big or small the improvement is, and this just happens to be somewhere the team can improve.

I want the team to win as much as possible a having the best possible lines is part of that.

 

[FlyTimmo]

Nobody needs to “scapegoat” anything. Giroux's been our best player so far and his “mediocre” scoring is bad luck more than anything else. There’s nothing that needs to be defended.

Changing the lines is about the always present need to improve wherever possible, no matter how big or small the improvement is, and this just happens to be somewhere the team can improve.

I want the team to win as much as possible a having the best possible lines is part of that.

Yeah I don't really think scapegoating has anything to do with it. Giroux has been very good.

 

[EXTRAS]

What do you guys see as bunnamans upside as he gets more experience and a bit older?

Could he really lock down a 4c spot as a full timer, or even possibly be a 3c? What do you assume he will be in a few years? Just an AHLer injury call up guy maybe?

 

[Striiker]

Yeah I don't really think scapegoating has anything to do with it. Giroux has been very good.

View attachment 402062

And that’s while on a team that’s been massively negative in possession and shot metrics.

Guys been a two-way beast even at the ripe old age of 83.

 

[Striiker]

What do you guys see as bunnamans upside as he gets more experience and a bit older?

Could he really lock down a 4c spot as a full timer, or even possibly be a 3c? What do you assume he will be in a few years? Just an AHLer injury call up guy maybe?

I think he’s just a placeholder for other players who will pass him in the near future.

I don’t dislike him but he has basically zero offensive ability at the NHL level, isn’t any special shutdown defensive player, and he doesn’t really stand out in any way.

Best praise I can give him is he’s invisible 99% of the time, which isn’t really a bad thing for a 4C, but I think we can do better.

 

[AdamParrot]

Guys, I think you're "overrating" that 1st line (because of Couturier). Yeah, they're great together, no doubt, but who isn't with Couturier?

Do you know that EVERYONE who plays with Couturier is at great shape automatically?

On another side, JVR + Farabee together are in big form and I think it would be better play them with another center (Hayes or Laughton) because of they will still producing like they did without Couturier before.

And do you remember that G-Coots-TK was the best line in 2017/18?

 

[AdamParrot]

Yeah I don't really think scapegoating has anything to do with it. Giroux has been very good.

View attachment 402062

Great all-around winger as always with great impact (look at Playdriving) on his teammates.

 

[FLYguy3911]

This feels like Bunnaman's ceiling - a low event 12th forward who doesn't completely drag down good wingers.

 

[Striiker]

Guys, I think you're "overrating" that 1st line (because of Couturier). Yeah, they're great together, no doubt, but who isn't with Couturier?

Do you know that EVERYONE who plays with Couturier is at great shape automatically?

On another side, JVR + Farabee together are in big form and I think it would be better play them with another center (Hayes or Laughton) because of they will still producing like they did without Couturier before.

And do you remember that G-Coots-TK was the best line in 2017/18?

gIrOuX sHoUlDnT nEeD tO pLaY wItH cOuTs

Yeah, and he doesn’t. Same as Pasternak and Marchand don’t need to play with Bergeron. Loading up a top line with your best players isnt uncommon and makes a lot of sense, especially when you have depth like we do. Especially when their styles match perfectly and they have a history of success.

 

[deadhead]

Giroux is having bad luck this year, but his scoring was inflated by puck luck for two years, 2017-18 and 2018-19, when he scored well above his xGF.
If you're going to make excuses for him this year, then you should admit his previous great numbers were partially a product of good luck.

 

[AdamParrot]

gIrOuX sHoUlDnT nEeD tO pLaY wItH cOuTs

Yeah, and he doesn’t. Same as Pasternak and Marchand don’t need to play with Bergeron. Loading up a top line with your best players isnt uncommon and makes a lot of sense, especially when you have depth like we do. Especially when their styles match perfectly and they have a history of success.

Absolutely agree, Striiker!

It's shame that G-Coots-TK were the best (or TOP3 for sure) line in the NHL in 2017/18 and we don't play them more just like the Bruins are playing Marchy-Bergy-Pasta since 1652.

 

[deadhead]

What do you guys see as bunnamans upside as he gets more experience and a bit older?

Could he really lock down a 4c spot as a full timer, or even possibly be a 3c? What do you assume he will be in a few years? Just an AHLer injury call up guy maybe?

It's hard to say, he's definitely shown improvement this season, his skating is better, his awareness is better.
Good forechecker, very good back checker, has a good shot, but isn't much of a play maker.
I can see him moving to LW with Patrick or Laczynski as the 4C and NAK as the 4RW - and that would be a heckuva 4th line.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Guys, I think you're "overrating" that 1st line (because of Couturier). Yeah, they're great together, no doubt, but who isn't with Couturier?

Do you know that EVERYONE who plays with Couturier is at great shape automatically?

On another side, JVR + Farabee together are in big form and I think it would be better play them with another center (Hayes or Laughton) because of they will still producing like they did without Couturier before.

And do you remember that G-Coots-TK was the best line in 2017/18?

If JVR & Farabee can produce like they are with Couturier, why mess with it?

In theory, Giroux & Voracek, as the two highest paid forwards, & TK as their leading goal scorer last year, should be less dependent on Couturier for offensive production.

It should be better for the team’s overall scoring depth to keep the JVR-Couturier-Farabee line together.

It might cost Giroux a couple ES points, but who cares? It’s about what’s best for the team, not constructing the team to maximize Giroux’s stats. I remember when people complained about moving Giroux to wing for the same reason, & it ended up being absolutely the right decision.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

What do you guys see as bunnamans upside as he gets more experience and a bit older?

Could he really lock down a 4c spot as a full timer, or even possibly be a 3c? What do you assume he will be in a few years? Just an AHLer injury call up guy maybe?

Ceiling is probably a 4th line winger who gets bumped to the 3rd line for short-term injury fill-ins.

But I doubt he’ll even hit that ceiling.

He’ll probably have a journeyman career as a fringe player / AHL callup, with a chance he sticks somewhere for a few seasons as a 4th liner.

 

[Tyler Durden]

Who will start the game tomorrow ? Hart or Elliott ?

I think it will be Hart. Elliot Thursday. Whoever plays better will get the nod on Saturday, and the other guy who doesn't play Saturday will go Sunday vs Capitals.

 

[Hanover Fist]

Bunny’s a fringe player because he rooms with Hayes

 

[Swic21]

Anyone else like the forward group and secretly concerned about TK coming back in...

Lol come on. Concerned about one of our best forwards coming back in the lineup?

 

[Tripod]

If JVR & Farabee can produce like they are with Couturier, why mess with it?

In theory, Giroux & Voracek, as the two highest paid forwards, & TK as their leading goal scorer last year, should be less dependent on Couturier for offensive production.

It should be better for the team’s overall scoring depth to keep the JVR-Couturier-Farabee line together.

It might cost Giroux a couple ES points, but who cares? It’s about what’s best for the team, not constructing the team to maximize Giroux’s stats. I remember when people complained about moving Giroux to wing for the same reason, & it ended up being absolutely the right decision.

Couts essentially played 1 game before getting hurt...1 game + 1 shift in game 2. He returned on Feb 7th.

On Feb 6th:

JVR 16 pts in 12 games
Farabee 9 pth in 12 games
Laughton 6 pts in 12 games

That line was producing with Laughton at C. So why not see if they can keep it going and free up Couts to play with other guys?

TK has seemed "off" and G has had poor luck. Why not see if those 3 can re-create their magic from before?

It's not like Hayes would play with trash. Hayes with Lindblom and Jake can be a great 2nd line.

It's about trying to maximize EVERYONES strengths while minimizing weaknesses. Giroux is by far our best passer. Having him with someone who doesn't pass the puck is stupid. Having him with someone like Lindblom doesn't matter much as Lindblom doesn't need the puck on his stick.

But you know all this. You just want to disagree because it's what you do.

 

[Rebels57]

Couts essentially played 1 game before getting hurt...1 game + 1 shift in game 2. He returned on Feb 7th.

On Feb 6th:

JVR 16 pts in 12 games
Farabee 9 pth in 12 games
Laughton 6 pts in 12 games

That line was producing with Laughton at C. So why not see if they can keep it going and free up Couts to play with other guys?

TK has seemed "off" and G has had poor luck. Why not see if those 3 can re-create their magic from before?

It's not like Hayes would play with trash. Hayes with Lindblom and Jake can be a great 2nd line.

It's about trying to maximize EVERYONES strengths while minimizing weaknesses. Giroux is by far our best passer. Having him with someone who doesn't pass the puck is stupid. Having him with someone like Lindblom doesn't matter much as Lindblom doesn't need the puck on his stick.

But you know all this. You just want to disagree because it's what you do.

They'll experiment with other line combinations when the time is right. There's little chance that the 1st line plus the Giroux-Hayes combo are together all season.

I dont know why everyone is so wound up over the lines the last 48 hours