Value of: What would it cost for a team to get 1st OA this draft?

[Yasuo]

I would not trade the first overall for Nylander+ Marner for exemple

 

[Heldig]

He was. The fact that he lived up to most of his ridiculous hype doesn't mean it wasn't overboard.

If you can't see that proclaiming that an 18 year old prospect's FLOOR, as in the worst he can possibly do, is the current best defenseman in the league is ridiculous hype, I don't know what to tell you.

Rasmus Dahlin is going to be an amazing player. You're just setting yourself up for disappointment if you expect him to come in and be the best defenseman in the league.

The Karlsson is his floor suggestion is obviously silly. I discount posts that extreme.

 

[Riptide]

Like would toronto ship marner+ liljegren for 1st OA 2018?

Would oilers give up drailsaitl + pulju
for 1st OA 2018?

Would jets do laine + picks for for 1st OA 2018?

Of course not. Why would any of those teams do that?

Teams no longer trade the 1OVA pick, because they know the advantage of having a young cost controlled talent for the next 7 years. And if they're getting that pick, odds are they have a bunch of other young cost controlled talent around the same age. They also know the value of getting a franchise player (assuming said pick gets near that level). And GMs will not offer anything close to the pieces suggested above. Edmonton wouldn't even offer Drai alone for that pick. Same with Winnipeg and Laine. And I doubt Toronto would either, but at least there's some case there for it based on their other forwards and their immediate needs - but even then I doubt they'd touch it.

 

[AZviaNJ]

Of course not. Why would any of those teams do that?

Toronto would offer Marner/Liljegren for 1st OA 2018 in a heart beat and it would be rejected. Drai/Pulju and Laine/picks are much closer in value.

 

[Riptide]

Why do people find it hard to believe that he’s already better than most NHLers?
Imo he definitely is

And this is based on what exactly... ?

 

[CycloneSweep]

What do you have to offer Edmonton?

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

what talent does he have?

His skating is incredible, he has fantastic hands and can make the highlight reel stuff. I don't watch him enough to know his game by game, minute by minute defensive acumen, but most of the guys who DO watch him wouldn't rave about him so much if there were red flags there.

 

[rent free]

His skating is incredible, he has fantastic hands and can make the highlight reel stuff. I don't watch him enough to know his game by game, minute by minute defensive acumen, but most of the guys who DO watch him wouldn't rave about him so much if there were red flags there.

but is he an overall good defender. like can he play defense as well?

 

[periferal]

Whatever the value of the #1 overall pick in 2018, the Oilers should be banned from obtaining it.

 

[LondonKendrick]

Last defenseman this hype was? Jones? Ekblad? Meh, even Hedman would was more hyped took five seasons to breakout. Leafs are overpaying for Dahlin, too big a gamble and even if he's the real deal he'll need to take his time to develop.

 

[Gabe Kupari]

Teams dont trade 1st overall picks....

Especially not when they have the ability to be a generational type of player.

 

[NoMessi]

I agree that the conditions are never identical. However Karlsson played for the same organization that had the same level of success back then as it has now (midtable), so they are as similar as one can reasonably expect. In any case Dahlin is not just carried by his teammates, as his Corsi is the 2nd best in the entire league.

Its not a midtable team. They have begun this season poorly but they have won the Champions Hockey League 2 years in a row, won the league in 2016 and got knocked out in the semi finals last year in game 7. If anything they have been a powerhouse team since Rönnberg took over.

When Karlsson were here we were a midtable team though.

 

[NoMessi]

How would those "Champions" do against teams in the AHL under NHL rules in your opinion?

This was your orgininal question:

How do you rank them since the other leagues don't play each other?
Many Euros (like Shipachyov) do great under the no hit rules but don't translate when it becomes "in your face" hockey. Compare Laine to his fellow Finns Julujarvi & Joulevi (both played unerage in the same league & were taken in the top 5) to see the difference.

And as someone told you, all the best leagues in Europe except KHL competes in the Champions Hockey League. Where coincidently Frölunda, the team Dahlin is playing on, have won 2 years in a row. (and another swedish team, Luleå, the only other year its been active).

SHL trumps AHL every day of the week.

 

[NoMessi]

He's basically saying that prime Karlsson would be scoring at a 0.5 PPG pace in the SHL

You know, the guy who has had seasons with a PPG superior to 1 in the much superior NHL.

Equal =/= Superior

 

[Flyerfan52]

This was your orgininal question:



And as someone told you, all the best leagues in Europe except KHL competes in the Champions Hockey League. Where coincidently Frölunda, the team Dahlin is playing on, have won 2 years in a row. (and another swedish team, Luleå, the only other year its been active).

SHL trumps AHL every day of the week.

SHL might well be the 2nd best league in Europe. That still doesn't make them better that the AHL (you know, the league the NHL uses to train players including those drafted from Europe that aren't NHL ready).
Some Euro hot shots that played vs men in Europe are still figuring out the harder NHL game in the AHL. Somehow the leagues that they were excelling in didn't prepare them for the real big league.
So that Champions Hockey League doesn't play the AHL. Again, under NHL rules do you really believe the winner in what you call the 3rd best could prove better? Or would they drop to 4th?

 

[NoMessi]

SHL might well be the 2nd best league in Europe. That still doesn't make them better that the AHL (you know, the league the NHL uses to train players including those drafted from Europe that aren't NHL ready).
Some Euro hot shots that played vs men in Europe are still figuring out the harder NHL game in the AHL. Somehow the leagues that they were excelling in didn't prepare them for the real big league.
So that Champions Hockey League doesn't play the AHL. Again, under NHL rules do you really believe the winner in what you call the 3rd best could prove better? Or would they drop to 4th?

Do you really think its the stars we send over to play in the AHL? Players that are considered top level player (or close) dont go there, and if they do its just for a very short adjustment period in which they learn how to play on small ice. For example Lias Andersson (even if hes overrated imo) didn't want to go there even if hes 18y just because he is already considered a top player in SHL.

And why is it necessarily so that small ice should be the standard when deciding which league is the best? IMO SHL would win both on small and big ice, but it wouldnt even be close in the latter.

 

[Flyerfan52]

Do you really think its the stars we send over to play in the AHL? Players that are considered top level player (or close) dont go there, and if they do its just for a very short adjustment period in which they learn how to play on small ice. For example Lias Andersson (even if hes overrated imo) didn't want to go there even if hes 18y just because he is already considered a top player in SHL.

And why is it necessarily so that small ice should be the standard when deciding which league is the best? IMO SHL would win both on small and big ice, but it wouldnt even be close in the latter.

Because on the smaller ice they'd be playing under the conditions the NHL (you know, the best league) uses. The same size the SHL players would have to get used to if ever drafted by the big league.
Even a lot of NA born that were excellent juniors couldn't adjust to playing with the big boys. Many of the 1s that flunked out of the NHL & AHL are stars in the various Euro leagues.

 

[BodaciousBeefBazooka]

Dahlin 1st overall bust like Yakupov

 

[LondonKendrick]

As long as Buffalo doesn't get him I'm happy

 

[WingsMJN2965]

Winning the lottery lol. It's not for sale, I'd imagine.

 

[Kudo Shinichi]

If I had the 1st overall pick, the only player I would trade it for in a 1-1 trade would be McDavid

 

[AppsSyl]

No. Dahlin is low risk, high reward, so there's no need to play it safe taking someone like Matthews instead.

No offense, but no D-man going 1st overall is low risk. Look at the history of D-men who have gone 1st. Dahlin is exceptional, but to say he is a lock to tear up the NHL is a bit much.

 

[Kcb12345]

Dahlin looks like he could be as fast as McDavid which is crazy

Have you seen him play? I'd say if anything his speed is something he could improve on. Isn't exactly the fastest guy on the ice he's just usually the smartest. Looks like a defensively better and a little bit faster version of John Klingberg (Just like Karlsson but I still think Karlsson will be better) What is with these Swedish dmen. I will say though, Dahlin also doesn't have that hard of a shot he just has incredible vision

 

[Kcb12345]

Dahlin 1st overall bust like Yakupov

I doubt he will be a bust, but may end up like Julius Honka. Takes a while to get to the NHL and then struggles a bit to stay there but may break through eventually and be really good. I think Dahlin will spend at least a year at the AHL level before coming up to the NHL. Would be the smart thing to do at least

 

[Albatros]

No offense, but no D-man going 1st overall is low risk. Look at the history of D-men who have gone 1st. Dahlin is exceptional, but to say he is a lock to tear up the NHL is a bit much.

Big guys with limited skill sets and no history of playing against men. Dahlin is good enough offensively to not to have to become a Pronger defensively in order to be a lock.