Player Discussion What to do with Phaneuf-Ceci pairing?

[sda]

Best d man? Errr I don't know.

No he was definitely not the best dman

 

[burf]

So what ,he isnt the only player on the team that has had a rough start .Defense isnt a one man show ,takes 5 guys that are working together.Its not as if the forwards have been excellent ,at two way hockey

Yes, it takes a 5-man unit, which explains why the Karlsson and Wideman pairings have also been getting killed in possession and goal dif - oh. nevermind.

Ceci's been bad for 3 years and is still bad now. He showed some flashes earlier in his career, especially when he was sheltered by Wiercioch (before Wiercioch turned into a pumpkin), but he's always been the worst player on his pairing.

 

[Micklebot]

Yes, it takes a 5-man unit, which explains why the Karlsson and Wideman pairings have also been getting killed in possession and goal dif - oh. nevermind.

Ceci's been bad for 3 years and is still bad now. He showed some flashes earlier in his career, especially when he was sheltered by Wiercioch (before Wiercioch turned into a pumpkin), but he's always been the worst player on his pairing.

Funny thing, Karlsson's CF last two games combined (42.25) is significantly worse than Phaneuf (48.44) and Ceci's (56.00). GA/60 isn't much better with Karlsson at 4.33/60, Phaneuf at 3.22, and Ceci at 1.52.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Yes, it takes a 5-man unit, which explains why the Karlsson and Wideman pairings have also been getting killed in possession and goal dif - oh. nevermind.

Ceci's been bad for 3 years and is still bad now. He showed some flashes earlier in his career, especially when he was sheltered by Wiercioch (before Wiercioch turned into a pumpkin), but he's always been the worst player on his pairing.

rofl....now Weir is the one 'sheltering' Ceci. Talk about revisionist history.

 

[Cosmix]

our top 4 was supposed to be as good as anyone else's in the league. that's what everyone kept saying. and not just on here.

Not me and therefore "not everyone"! The top 4 are better than the last few years but when you consider we had Cowen and Wiercioch in that top 4, it was easy to improve it. Phaneuf does lack footspeed and this has been a known and recognized fact for a few years now.

 

[Sens Rule]

Maybe try Phaneuf - EK and Methot - Ceci? If the 2nd pair can't get it together.

 

[LuckyPierre]

Maybe try Phaneuf - EK and Methot - Ceci? If the 2nd pair can't get it together.

Seems like a potential solution.

Ceci is in over his head trying to be the full time puck handler on his pairing. Methot can help bail him out by skating into open areas, and giving him another option when he's engineering a breakout, as opposed to standing still like Phaneuf often does.

EK can adjust to play with most players; and Phaneuf as another shooting option on the blue line, who's also comfortable switching sides if Karl wants to walk the line... it could work.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Maybe try Phaneuf - EK and Methot - Ceci? If the 2nd pair can't get it together.

It could be worth a try. I think it will help Ceci and hurt EK however... How much it helps vs how much it hurts ... have to try it to see.

 

[burf]

rofl....now Weir is the one 'sheltering' Ceci. Talk about revisionist history.

It's not revisionist history at all - and there were many debates on this board about the same thing at the time. The fact remains that for the duration of that season, Wier was a solid player that made his teammates better, while Ceci was a complete pumpkin whenever Wier was taken away from him.

(See: here)

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

It's not revisionist history at all - and there were many debates on this board about the same thing at the time. The fact remains that for the duration of that season, Wier was a solid player that made his teammates better, while Ceci was a complete pumpkin whenever Wier was taken away from him.

(See: here)

We all knew Weir was an advanced stats star, but completely failed the eye test. Outside of that 20-game miracle run stretch, he is not a good hockey player

 

[Burrowsaurus]

We all knew Weir was an advanced stats star, but completely failed the eye test. Outside of that 20-game miracle run stretch, he is not a good hockey player

Ceci is an advanced stats nightmare. Also fails the eye test.

I think if wiercioch was faster he would have passed a lot more eye tests.

 

[Zorf]

Ceci is an advanced stats nightmare. Also fails the eye test.

I think if wiercioch was faster he would have passed a lot more eye tests.

I'm not saying that Ceci hasn't been anything but a tire fire this season, but, I am liking how he's inserting himself into the play more. He's very aggressive in the neutral zone in jumping up to block passes, and when he carries the puck into the offensive zone he does it with speed and authority. I'd like to see him drop a shoulder and drive the net because he's a pretty powerful skater, but maybe Boucher wants them to establish possession a bit more and driving the net tends to give up possession if you don't corral the rebound.

Now, while he's been less than stellar so far, I would also say that in the last few games we have seen improvements in his game. Maybe he's a step behind others in adjusting to Boucher's systems? Either way, he's getting better, and if that keeps up, then in 15 games or so I like to think that we won't be harping on the 2nd pairing so much.


Just keep on improving Ceci. I don't care if it is by taking baby steps forward. Just keep moving forward.



Side note: Did Phaneuf dip his skates in cement? I don't recall him looking so sluggish last year. He also looks thicker. Maybe he put on some muscle mass over the summer? Taking a page from Neil's book and slimming down might help Phaneuf's game.

 

[Viletho]

I'm not saying that Ceci hasn't been anything but a tire fire this season, but, I am liking how he's inserting himself into the play more. He's very aggressive in the neutral zone in jumping up to block passes, and when he carries the puck into the offensive zone he does it with speed and authority. I'd like to see him drop a shoulder and drive the net because he's a pretty powerful skater, but maybe Boucher wants them to establish possession a bit more and driving the net tends to give up possession if you don't corral the rebound.

The one thing with Ceci that i dislike is that he will win the blue line with ease and than throw a shot on net, while he's still alone. I want him to go deep and try to retain the puck there.

Last game, he's done it once. Darnell Nurse got called for a penalty because he was able to protect the puck with his big body. He need to place his big body in the way. He will never be a big hitter, but use your body to gain space and time.

Very happy with Ceci's and Phaneuf game last night.

 

[Sensinitis]

Ceci is an advanced stats nightmare. Also fails the eye test.

I think if wiercioch was faster he would have passed a lot more eye tests.

That's like saying if Cowen wasn't boneheaded he would have passed a lot more eye tests.

Both are scenarios very far from reality.

 

[Hutz]

I thought they both looked better tonight. Steps in the right direction. I noticed that Phaneuf seemed to be out with Karlsson a lot in the second half of the game. Did Boucher try switching up the pairs there, or is it just coincidence that i happened to notice the few times they were on together?

 

[BonkTastic]

From Boucher's post-game presser last night (2-1 win vs Carolina):

Reporter: "What is the Ceci-Phaneuf pairing doing better now than they were (before)?"

Boucher: "Yeah, I had a few questions, you know, people look at stats and all that. The first thing is they've played against the top lines the majority of the games and at the beginning of the year. I think they're getting used to each other, playing against first lines - because it's not the same thing as 3rd pairings that play against 3rd lines and 4th lines. We're talking about guys who are challenged every shift of every game. It's a lot of ice time, it's a lot of things to manage. I think Phaneuf's done a great job with Ceci tonight. What I like with Ceci tonight, it was terrific, we gave him our "player of the game", along with our goaltender. I thought tonight it was one of his best games, and it was the same last game also, very good. What he's learning now as a young defenceman is how to manage the time of the game, how to manage the puck under pressure, know when to jump, know when not to jump. I think Dion did a great job of leadership with him, a tandem that's growing now, and you can see that we're benefiting from it. The tough start at the beginning was expected, for me, but we don't want to change it, and it's paying off right now."

Reporter: "Were you aware of Phaneuf's leadership qualities?"

Boucher: "Oh yeah. I had him at the World's (World Championships). in Finland, and right away I saw what kind of person, what kind of man he is. I still believe, more than ever, that's the perfect guy that was needed in this room here. You know, when you add on the Kelly's and the few other guys there, that's gigantic. The intangibles make the difference, and Dion has been a terrific help for the entire team - but I think also for Erik (Karlsson), because you know, once you get another leader on the back end like that, it just takes some pressure off your captain, and it just creates a terrific tandem between the two of them, they're always together now. You know there's a lot of chemistry relationships that are growing, and the leadership is growing at the same time. I'm quite impressed buy our leaders, including Phaneuf, but of course Karl(sson)'s been unbelievable since Day 1. There's a total buy-in about everything we so, and it has gigantic repercussions for our entire team."

Quotes taken from 4:30-6:40 in the video below.

 

[Viletho]

From Boucher's post-game presser last night (2-1 win vs Carolina):

Reporter: "What is the Ceci-Phaneuf pairing doing better now than they were (before)?"

Boucher: "Yeah, I had a few questions, you know, people look at stats and all that. The first thing is they've played against the top lines the majority of the games and at the beginning of the year. I think they're getting used to each other, playing against first lines - because it's not the same thing as 3rd pairings that play against 3rd lines and 4th lines. We're talking about guys who are challenged every shift of every game. It's a lot of ice time, it's a lot of things to manage. I think Phaneuf's done a great job with Ceci tonight. What I like with Ceci tonight, it was terrific, we gave him our "player of the game", along with our goaltender. I thought tonight it was one of his best games, and it was the same last game also, very good. What he's learning now as a young defenceman is how to manage the time of the game, how to manage the puck under pressure, know when to jump, know when not to jump. I think Dion did a great job of leadership with him, a tandem that's growing now, and you can see that we're benefiting from it. The tough start at the beginning was expected, for me, but we don't want to change it, and it's paying off right now."

Reporter: "Were you aware of Phaneuf's leadership qualities?"

Boucher: "Oh yeah. I had him at the World's (World Championships). in Finland, and right away I saw what kind of person, what kind of man he is. I still believe, more than ever, that's the perfect guy that was needed in this room here. You know, when you add on the Kelly's and the few other guys there, that's gigantic. The intangibles make the difference, and Dion has been a terrific help for the entire team - but I think also for Erik (Karlsson), because you know, once you get another leader on the back end like that, it just takes some pressure off your captain, and it just creates a terrific tandem between the two of them, they're always together now. You know there's a lot of chemistry relationships that are growing, and the leadership is growing at the same time. I'm quite impressed buy our leaders, including Phaneuf, but of course Karl(sson)'s been unbelievable since Day 1. There's a total buy-in about everything we so, and it has gigantic repercussions for our entire team."

Quotes taken from 4:30-6:40 in the video below.

I also liked Ceci's game yesterday. There is a few people here that are jumping on Ceci for every mitsake he's doing right now. Again last night in the 1st. But everybody were playing bad. What i liked about Ceci's game was that he was engaged physically. Exactly what i want from him.

 

[OgieO]

That was the most physically assertive I've ever seen Ceci in his own end. Very impressive. Thought he had a great game.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

They both were decent. I missed the first though.

The pairings two best games have been Vancouver and Carolina.

 

[Jorge Garcia]

Ceci is an advanced stats nightmare. Also fails the eye test.

I think if wiercioch was faster he would have passed a lot more eye tests.

Also stronger, tougher, smarter, more skilled and less prone to panic. But he wasn't.

 

[Wondercarrot]

last two games by Ceci have been really good.
he's starting to play like he did when his game took off last year.
it would be huge if he could maintain this level of play.

 

[Viletho]

last two games by Ceci have been really good.
he's starting to play like he did when his game took off last year.
it would be huge if he could maintain this level of play.

I would like a little bit more offence from the second pairing.. or any other pairing, which does not include EK. But i don't mind if they want to settle the defensive game and than try to add he offensive game.

 

[Baby Ryan]

The pair plays well when they play mean and rough. They have the weight to back it up too.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I would like a little bit more offence from the second pairing.. or any other pairing, which does not include EK. But i don't mind if they want to settle the defensive game and than try to add he offensive game.

It would be nice, but it's damned hard to really generate a lot of points as a defenseman. The majority of defensemen out there don't have the skill to go on an end-to-end rush and get a good scoring chance. They need to rely on the forwards doing something good with the passes you're giving them. You can make a ton of brilliant plays in your own zone, make a perfect pass to a guy flying up the ice...but if a goal isn't scored, all that work amounts to zero.

That's also what makes Erik so damned special. There's not a defenseman playing that can do what he does offensively. That's a tough act for our second pairing to live up to.

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDoo]

Ceci is an advanced stats nightmare. Also fails the eye test.

I think if wiercioch was faster he would have passed a lot more eye tests.

I think if wiercioch was faster he would have been a good player.