Player Discussion What to do with Maroon?

[Bryanbryoil]

Trade him even if we want him here long term. Pump n dump at deadline and go after him once he becomes UFA.

We could do that. Tell him that we'd like to bring him back but we really need to stock our cupboards. Tell him that we'll be in contact with him on July 1st and go from there. Even if we don't move him at the deadline there is no guarantee that he'll be back.

I don’t get this. He’s lived up to it so far. On pace for 50 some points again and top 10 in hits. Maroon has 1 40 point season to his name. Lucic has only scored less than 50 points once in his past 7 full seasons. You move Lucic your moving the only real proven top 6 winger we have.

Maroon has better hands but Looch adds a level of intimidation and respect that Maroon doesn't have. Another point is that Maroon is singled out by the reffing so that kind of sucks.

 

[MessierII]

We could do that. Tell him that we'd like to bring him back but we really need to stock our cupboards. Tell him that we'll be in contact with him on July 1st and go from there. Even if we don't move him at the deadline there is no guarantee that he'll be back.



Maroon has better hands but Looch adds a level of intimidation and respect that Maroon doesn't have. Another point is that Maroon is singled out by the reffing so that kind of sucks.

Forget about intimidation and respect Lucic is simply a much better hockey player than Maroon. The results don’t lie. Maroon is a 3rd liner who found chemistry with a superstar and strung together one season as a top 6 guy at age 29. Lucic is a proven top 6 guy with or without Mcdavid.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Forget about intimidation and respect Lucic is simply a much better hockey player than Maroon. The results don’t lie. Maroon is a 3rd liner who found chemistry with a superstar and strung together one season as a top 6 guy at age 29. Lucic is a proven top 6 guy with or without Mcdavid.

I would say that Maroon since he has come to the Oilers has been pretty damn good. Both big men struggle with consistency game to game. When was he last time that Looch had a really good game? I say this as a Looch fan, IMO he has to bring more more often. As far as I see it we have room for one of these guys due to salary and our teams dynamic. Khaira is another big body who isn't quite as tough as Maroon, but he can skate pretty well.

 

[VainGretzky]

I would rather offer Grabner 4 million in offseason than give it Maroon he would be a lock for 35 goals plus with McDavid and is a good penalty killer

 

[Todd from Leduc]

Trade and re-sign him (dangle the play with McD balogna on a stick).

 

[PaPaDee]

I'd still like Maroon back, but it has to be a cap friendly deal. If that's not possible, hopefully we can land a decent pick/prospect for him.

 

[Lacaar]

Trade him. Too late to salvage this year.

The problem with Maroon is he has to be at maximum motivation to be effective. Can't afford to have him come in here next year with a juicy comfortable 3-4 year deal.
He'll just get frustrated with his lack lustre play and do stupid things to try and make up for it.

We need players with a fire lit under their ass looking to prove themselves. Players signing their retirement contracts generally blow ass following it.

 

[backhandsauce]

3x3 take it or leave it.

Get his buddy Connor to subsidize another million per year.

 

[Stoneman89]

Article on him today he says he really wants to stay. I believe that to be true, but then we'll see what he and his agent have in store. If he doesn't realize that #97 is a huge reason for his production, the he's fooling himself. But someone will likely give him some big money. Only way he stays is if he takes a "hometown" and "reality" type of discount. 3.5 mill over 3 years is the absolute max.

 

[PaPaDee]

Article on him today he says he really wants to stay. I believe that to be true, but then we'll see what he and his agent have in store. If he doesn't realize that #97 is a huge reason for his production, the he's fooling himself. But someone will likely give him some big money. Only way he stays is if he takes a "hometown" and "reality" type of discount. 3.5 mill over 3 years is the absolute max.

I can't see him taking a discount to be honest. This is his one and only opportunity to cash-in on a nice contract.

 

[Draiskull]

What to do with Maroon.
ANA giving him to us was a great boon
If Chia was smart he would be working the phone
asking for the moon for this goon

 

[Drivesaitl]

Wouldn’t it be wonderful if the McDavid Effect meant that players would re-sign for their actual value instead of us having to outbid the highest potential suitor in order to retain our talent?

How about it, Patty? We love ya here. Might not work out as well at your next stop. That next “show me” contract right before that young euro steals your job. You’re 2LW with a bullet here. Stick around.

Yeah. what I mentioned earlier is his best chance at having a big role on a club is here. The chemistry with McD is undeniable. They work well off each other. Much better than McD=Lucic. So you sell Patty on whether he wants to continue to play a scoring role here or end up somewhere else where his body of work would be less understood. He could sign somewhere else for 4M and the team could end up shuffling him down the roster to where he's in bottomsix instead of topline.
The thing is do you want a few extra bucks playing elsewhere or a pleasurable role on the club here? He's really unlikely to see this type of usage if he leaves.

 

[Draiskull]

Yeah. what I mentioned earlier is his best chance at having a big role on a club is here. The chemistry with McD is undeniable. They work well off each other. Much better than McD=Lucic. So you sell Patty on whether he wants to continue to play a scoring role here or end up somewhere else where his body of work would be less understood. He could sign somewhere else for 4M and the team could end up shuffling him down the roster to where he's in bottomsix instead of topline.
The thing is do you want a few extra bucks playing elsewhere or a pleasurable role on the club here? He's really unlikely to see this type of usage if he leaves.

It comes down to what McDavid wants. Does he want to be stapled with Maroon\Lucic at his left side for the next 3 yrs or should we be looking for a faster shoot first player? Maroon is getting the points but is clearly dragging McD down as was Lucic.

Chia is in no place to promise him time on McDavid's line... That is not upto him.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Forget about intimidation and respect Lucic is simply a much better hockey player than Maroon. The results don’t lie. Maroon is a 3rd liner who found chemistry with a superstar and strung together one season as a top 6 guy at age 29. Lucic is a proven top 6 guy with or without Mcdavid.

Moving forward Lucic is not a better player than Maroon. He isn't right at the moment. Maroon has 50 goals here, Lucic 34, and Lucic has played only 16 less games as an Oiler. That's a quantum difference and both have had fairly comparable looks with McD considering Lucic gets him on the PP a lot as well as EV minutes at times. Lucic in EV play here has been very underwhelming. 11EV goals last season and only 5 this year. For a total of 16. Maroon has 37EV goals the past 2 seasons. What a huge difference, over twice as many. Sure McD influence but none of our wingers work nearly as well with McD.

The thing is McD wants Maroon here, has stated wanting him on his line and you do it for that reason if no other.

 

[Drivesaitl]

It comes down to what McDavid wants. Does he want to be stapled with Maroon\Lucic at his left side for the next 3 yrs or should we be looking for a faster shoot first player? Maroon is getting the points but is clearly dragging McD down as was Lucic.

Chia is in no place to promise him time on McDavid's line... That is not upto him.

McD has stated he loves playing with Maroon. To be clear during his tenure, I keep repeating this, Maroon has 50 goals here, same time frame McD has 52, Draisaitl has 50. Its not so clear a case of dragging down. When you find a situation where you can very good production out of a medium paid player you take it. We we're paying Pouliot 4m. Maroon here has been far better.

 

[Draiskull]

McD has stated he loves playing with Maroon. To be clear during his tenure, I keep repeating this, Maroon has 50 goals here, same time frame McD has 52, Draisaitl has 50. Its not so clear a case of dragging down. When you find a situation where you can very good production out of a medium paid player you take it. We we're paying Pouliot 4m. Maroon here has been far better.

McDavid will love playing with Pacioretty\Hoffman or even Puljujarvi once they start putting the puck in the net.
Maroon is a better fit than Lucic\Pouliot\Eberle at McDavid's wing for sure but he is still dragging McDavid down right now. Lucic was putting up points too while he was on McDavid's line but he clearly doesnt belong there.

Eye test > stats for me.

 

[guymez]

I don’t get this. He’s lived up to it so far. On pace for 50 some points again and top 10 in hits. Maroon has 1 40 point season to his name. Lucic has only scored less than 50 points once in his past 7 full seasons. You move Lucic your moving the only real proven top 6 winger we have.

I agree...Lucic has lived up to it so far. I think he has just managed to live up to it in the first 2 years. Next season might be fine as well.
The problem is the last 3 years....he is already a slow skater and quite slow at processing the play.
That isnt going to get better and big players tend to drop off quite quickly.
If you trade him now his value is maxed.

 

[MessierII]

Moving forward Lucic is not a better player than Maroon. He isn't right at the moment. Maroon has 50 goals here, Lucic 34, and Lucic has played only 16 less games as an Oiler. That's a quantum difference and both have had fairly comparable looks with McD considering Lucic gets him on the PP a lot as well as EV minutes at times. Lucic in EV play here has been very underwhelming. 11EV goals last season and only 5 this year. For a total of 16. Maroon has 37EV goals the past 2 seasons. What a huge difference, over twice as many. Sure McD influence but none of our wingers work nearly as well with McD.

The thing is McD wants Maroon here, has stated wanting him on his line and you do it for that reason if no other.

Maroon has found chemistry with mcdavid more consistently than anyone so far no doubt about it the difference is Lucic has a long history of producing at this level regardless of whether he’s with McDavid or not. Maroon has only produced at a 40 point 20 goal pace in one situation. Mcdavids left wing.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Actually Lucic hasn't produced much here. Thats the point He has 16EV goals in his entire duration here. Lucic has been exceedingly reliant on PP goals here. 18of them. He's not really a playmaker either so its a toss who has been better.

What I don't get either is how people say things like well Lucic is putting up 50pt seasons like that's great playing the type of minutes he has. Lucic gets primo minutes and primo feeds all season every game. In his select usage that he has only 9 goals this season is not very good. This team utilizes him around the net. he primarily has a Ryan Smyth around the net assignment. He's hopeless at it. Smyth in prime would be putting up 30-40 goals seasons with this type of help. That Lucic has only 9 goals, considering where the team puts him is a huge problem. he should be putting up Maroon scoring numbers.

Also, Maroon had 27 goals last season and on pace for around 24 this season. So not 20 goal pace. He's been better than that, always. Maroon his whole time here has 27.7 goals per season on prorated 82 GP. He hardly misses games either.

Lucic as an oiler scores goals at a .248 clip. Maroon way ahead of that at .338. That's a huge freaking difference in scoring. Especially considering Lucic gets a lot more first unit PP time, and PP minutes in general.

 

[Little Fury]

Maroon has found chemistry with mcdavid more consistently than anyone so far no doubt about it the difference is Lucic has a long history of producing at this level regardless of whether he’s with McDavid or not. Maroon has only produced at a 40 point 20 goal pace in one situation. Mcdavids left wing.

It's not like Lucic has been working with dregs though. His most common centres pre-Oilers were Krejci, Carter, Kopitar and Toffoli.

Maroon put up solid numbers with Getzlaf the one spell they spent together, otherwise he mostly bounced around the bottom of the Duck's lineup.

Historically they aren't close to the same player but if you look at their body of work as Oilers, Maroon's been better and at a much lower price tag to boot.

 

[MessierII]

Actually Lucic hasn't produced much here. Thats the point He has 16EV goals in his entire duration here. Lucic has been exceedingly reliant on PP goals here. 18of them. He's not really a playmaker either so its a toss who has been better.

What I don't get either is how people say things like well Lucic is putting up 50pt seasons like that's great playing the type of minutes he has. Lucic gets primo minutes and primo feeds all season every game. In his select usage that he has only 9 goals this season is not very good. This team utilizes him around the net. he primarily has a Ryan Smyth around the net assignment. He's hopeless at it. Smyth in prime would be putting up 30-40 goals seasons with this type of help. That Lucic has only 9 goals, considering where the team puts him is a huge problem. he should be putting up Maroon scoring numbers.

Also, Maroon had 27 goals last season and on pace for around 24 this season. So not 20 goal pace. He's been better than that, always. Maroon his whole time here has 27.7 goals per season on prorated 82 GP. He hardly misses games either.

Lucic as an oiler scores goals at a .248 clip. Maroon way ahead of that at .338. That's a huge freaking difference in scoring. Especially considering Lucic gets a lot more first unit PP time, and PP minutes in general.

Your just conviently ignoring assists though. Lucic has always been a better playmaker than goal scorer. He’s also a streaky goal scorer currently in a slump so it’s all very convenient timing. Lucic gets a lot more pp time well last year he was our best pp player but let’s punish him. Maroon is older and less proven than Lucic. The only thing better about him is his price tag.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Your just conviently ignoring assists though. Lucic has always been a better playmaker than goal scorer. He’s also a streaky goal scorer currently in a slump so it’s all very convenient timing. Lucic gets a lot more pp time well last year he was our best pp player but let’s punish him. Maroon is older and less proven than Lucic. The only thing better about him is his price tag.

What you're not thinking about is the only value of a player is what they are doing now or going forward. A good argument can be made that lucic has had quite an incredible decline in EV production and goal scoring. AS far as Maroon being older it sure doesn't look like it out there. Maroon so much better getting on the forcheck, working boards, and getting to the net on rushes. Lucic almost always behind the play.

Nobody cares what the player did before, or shouldn't. The only thing I care about is what Lucic is not delivering on this contract, already, and fear he's getting worse.

 

[Little Fury]

Here's a complete list of all the Oilers wingers not named Patrick Maroon who have scored since Christmas and how many goals they scored:

Jesse Puljujarvi: 1
Jujhar Khaira: 1
Drake Cagguila: 1

That's it.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Here's a complete list of all the Oilers wingers not named Patrick Maroon who have scored since Christmas and how many goals they scored:

Jesse Puljujarvi: 1
Jujhar Khaira: 1
Drake Cagguila: 1

That's it.

So what would you offer Maroon? IMO we REALLY need to add some speed and a sniper to the wings. If we could somehow add Grabner and Hoffman we'd be in good shape IMO. As far as I'm concerned I'd deal Maroon if we can add Hoffman via trade. IMO Maroon is kind of like Russell last year, a good/decent player but a placeholder until we can add someone better and in this case (McDavid's LW) we really need to do better. The only way that you keep Maroon is if you move out Lucic or Patty signs for $3 million or less.

 

[lakai17]

Maroon will bring back value today.