Speculation: The Isles Future On Defence, It looks good!

[dlawong]

Curious as who Isles will likely protect in the 2021 Expansion draft and who they may risk losing to Seattle for nothing? Keep it in mind expansion team will want players who can actually have impact on their team while not on cheap salary as they need to make the cap floor. They will take the best available player from each team (except Vegas) and likely will pick in the order of: G starter, top pairing D, Top 2 centres, Top line RW, Top line LW, back up G, 2nd pairing Ds, 2nd line LW, 2nd line RW, 3rd line centres & then bottom pairing D, and then the bottom 5 forwards.

Be interest to find out which team will end up with the most to lose. Personally I do not like the idea of giving up 2021 1st round pick to avoid losing roster player outside the core group unless it is packaged with a cap dump.

 

[Disgraced Cosmonaut]

Curious as who Isles will likely protect in the 2021 Expansion draft and who they may risk losing to Seattle for nothing? Keep it in mind expansion team will want players who can actually have impact on their team while not on cheap salary as they need to make the cap floor. They will take the best available player from each team (except Vegas) and likely will pick in the order of: G starter, top pairing D, Top 2 centres, Top line RW, Top line LW, back up G, 2nd pairing Ds, 2nd line LW, 2nd line RW, 3rd line centres & then bottom pairing D, and then the bottom 5 forwards.

Be interest to find out which team will end up with the most to lose. Personally I do not like the idea of giving up 2021 1st round pick to avoid losing roster player outside the core group unless it is packaged with a cap dump.

I’m pretty sure they won’t have to protect any of Leddy, Hickey and Boychuk.

 

[steveat]

We're a long way from the days of having Jurcina as our top 4 and Mark Eton, but I do miss Jurcina...he'd always break the other team's ankles with his shot.

Our defense is solid on depth...weak on top-end talent, which is why we shouldn't trade Leddy. We need his skating and speed, especially in this league. I just feel bad because there are at least 2 guys in the A that deserve to play now. I have a feeling Mayfield goes and we'll get something good for him too.

 

[Kevin27NYI]

We're a long way from the days of having Jurcina as our top 4 and Mark Eton, but I do miss Jurcina...he'd always break the other team's ankles with his shot.

Our defense is solid on depth...weak on top-end talent, which is why we shouldn't trade Leddy. We need his skating and speed, especially in this league. I just feel bad because there are at least 2 guys in the A that deserve to play now. I have a feeling Mayfield goes and we'll get something good for him too.

Defense was so weak then we were like 17-4-2 with Jurcina.

 

[JTToilinginToronto]

Hickey is best on a chair in the press box.

He is, but for a #7, there really aren't any better than Hickey.

I'd like to eventually get rid of him when we need the capspace, but judging by the off-season so far, we don't need it now, so might as well keep him around for another year. Injuries will happen.

 

[PWJunior]

He is, but for a #7, there really aren't any better than Hickey.

I'd like to eventually get rid of him when we need the capspace, but judging by the off-season so far, we don't need it now, so might as well keep him around for another year. Injuries will happen.

Hickey is a waste as the #7D when he has 3 years on his deal. If he were on a one year deal like Sbisa or even Seidenberg last year, then that's a completely different story. Hickey is just in the way at this point, I'd rather have his roster spot for flexibility. It makes it significantly easier to stash Dobson for half the season and then call up Aho or Wotherspoon or MVS or Hutton.

We have a defined top-6, having that #7D spot to be able to rotate all the AHL kids is infinitely better use than Hickey sitting on his ass all season.

 

[JTToilinginToronto]

Hickey is a waste as the #7D when he has 3 years on his deal. If he were on a one year deal like Sbisa or even Seidenberg last year, then that's a completely different story. Hickey is just in the way at this point, I'd rather have his roster spot for flexibility. It makes it significantly easier to stash Dobson for half the season and then call up Aho or Wotherspoon or MVS or Hutton.

We have a defined top-6, having that #7D spot to be able to rotate all the AHL kids is infinitely better use than Hickey sitting on his ass all season.

You can just trade him next off-season. It's very unlikely that Hickey's value will plummet from this point in time to next year.

There's really no point in trading him now as we don't need the immediate cap space. And as a peaked out veteran, he's better at sitting in the pressbox versus a young kid.

 

[PWJunior]

You can just trade him next off-season. It's very unlikely that Hickey's value will plummet from this point in time to next year.

There's really no point in trading him now as we don't need the immediate cap space. And as a peaked out veteran, he's better at sitting in the pressbox versus a young kid.

It's not about the cap space and it's not about his value. His roster spot is a complete waste with him occupying it.

We have a bunch of advanced d-man prospects in the pipeline that are all in their final ELC season, all of whom bring something a little different to the table. Hickey is what he is, there is no upside anymore. Rather than him filling in all over the lineup, we can call up the kid that best replaces whomever is injured.

If Boychuk gets hurt and we know he gets banged up, I don't want Hickey taking his spot and role. I'd much rather have Hutton in there. Aho is a PP specialist/3rd pairing type, I'd much rather have him subbing in for Leddy or Toews than Hickey. If Pelech isn't able to go, call up Wotherspoon. None of them are pimple faced teens and are waiver exempt. Take advantage of the flexibility that his open roster spot provides.

 

[JTToilinginToronto]

It's not about the cap space and it's not about his value. His roster spot is a complete waste with him occupying it.

We have a bunch of advanced d-man prospects in the pipeline that are all in their final ELC season, all of whom bring something a little different to the table. Hickey is what he is, there is no upside anymore. Rather than him filling in all over the lineup, we can call up the kid that best replaces whomever is injured.

If Boychuk gets hurt and we know he gets banged up, I don't want Hickey taking his spot and role. I'd much rather have Hutton in there. Aho is a PP specialist/3rd pairing type, I'd much rather have him subbing in for Leddy or Toews than Hickey. If Pelech isn't able to go, call up Wotherspoon. None of them are pimple faced teens and are waiver exempt. Take advantage of the flexibility that his open roster spot provides.

So you want Aho sitting 50 games in the press box?

You can have Hickey as the 7th, spotting guys, then if a LT injury happens, you can call up someone like Aho to play regularly.

 

[PWJunior]

So you want Aho sitting 50 games in the press box?

You can have Hickey as the 7th, spotting guys, then if a LT injury happens, you can call up someone like Aho to play regularly.

I give Dobson the #7D spot until December when he is sent to the WJC. He can spell Boychuk on B2B's and practice with the team until then. Any LT injury, call up one of the Bridgeport kids like you mentioned.

 

[crasherino]

I give Dobson the #7D spot until December when he is sent to the WJC. He can spell Boychuk on B2B's and practice with the team until then. Any LT injury, call up one of the Bridgeport kids like you mentioned.

I like this approach if we don’t end up moving Leddy. Dobson can get a taste of the big league, get some spot starts until the WJCs start.

The kid has played a TON of hockey the last two years. Slowing down for a month or two and taking it all in might not be the worst thing in the world. And injuries have a funny way of changing plans and time frames. He may well get more than 9 games even if that may be the initial plan.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

I think Leddy will be trade bait at the TDL. Let Dobson ease into the line up. If he progresses to the point of being a top 4D man by the new year. There is going to be an obvious glut on D for the Isles. Leddy would be ideal to a contending team. Isles may still get a Center after all.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

We're a long way from the days of having Jurcina as our top 4 and Mark Eton, but I do miss Jurcina...he'd always break the other team's ankles with his shot.

Ahhh, good ol' Milan!

Jurcina has played the past four seasons in Germany - and he was f***ing brutal (as in terrible) this past season.

Just imagine the weaknesses known during his NHL days times 5.

About the only time he touched a puck was to ice it or when it bounced off of him and into his own goal.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

We all know who the 7 NHL Dmen are right now.

I think the Isles rank the overall value of all U26 Dmen in the system as follows, on each side respectively:

Left D
Toews
Pelech
Aho
Bolduc
Salo
Vande Sompel
Wotherspoon
Mirageas
Krygier

Right D
Dobson
Pulock
Wilde
Mayfield
Hutton
Burroughs
Quenneville

Ironically, the two names in italics are IMHO the only ones that don't seem to have any real shot at an NHL job of some sort.

Of course, those I've bolded will probably have to be in the right place at the right time when opportunity knocks.

 

[Poliz24]

Having solid depth at D is a solid problem to have, don't move leddy, the league is all of about skating and that his best asset.

 

[steveat]

We have good depth in case of injuries...much better than before. I really hope Aho gets another shot. He's just too good to be stuck in the A.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

We have good depth in case of injuries...much better than before. I really hope Aho gets another shot. He's just too good to be stuck in the A.

Depending on what they decide with Dobson, Aho is the first on the list to come up in case of injuries. At the moment.

If one of the righty Dmen goes down, and Boychuk eventually will, they'll likely place Hickey in his spot initially. But the guy who could really cloud things up the most is Hutton.

If he comes out of the gates as strongly as he ended the season, the team may have to test him at the NHL level sooner rather than later.

Then again, Leddy (value) and Hickey (could help a number of teams at a reasonable price) remain pretty much the two most viable trading pieces we've got at the moment. And with respect to Aho's chances, I can't see him AND Hickey being on this team at the same time.

 

[crasherino]

Depending on what they decide with Dobson, Aho is the first on the list to come up in case of injuries. At the moment.

If one of the righty Dmen goes down, and Boychuk eventually will, they'll likely place Hickey in his spot initially. But the guy who could really cloud things up the most is Hutton.

If he comes out of the gates as strongly as he ended the season, the team may have to test him at the NHL level sooner rather than later.

Then again, Leddy (value) and Hickey (could help a number of teams at a reasonable price) remain pretty much the two most viable trading pieces we've got at the moment. And with respect to Aho's chances, I can't see him AND Hickey being on this team at the same time.

I think with Dobson, the team will just wait and see how he does in training camp. If he comes in and shows that he belongs in the NHL and is just too talented to send back, it complicates matters, but in a good way. Likewise, if Aho looks like he's Toews part Deux, maybe the team explores a trade with Leddy (or Hickey) - especially if a team has a Dman go down. For Leddy, I'd want at least a first round pick coming back. For Hickey, a 3rd rounder sounds about right.

MVS and PW, they seem to have some promise, but I can't see them even getting an opportunity with the big club over the next two years. A team with an empty prospect bin would be wise to offer up a mid round pick for those guys. Of course, if we have a rash of injuries, ya never know who gets to step up with a chance to shine.

Its always a good thing when your uncertain young(ish) guys step up and play better than expected (in this case Pelech, Toews and Mayfield). Would be nice if we saw the same thing with our forwards as well. If all of a sudden MDC, Bellows, JHS, Koivula and Wahlstrom were showing that they're deserving of play with the big club, another great problem to have. We'd be faced with the issue of what to do with Komarov and Ladd.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

I think with Dobson, the team will just wait and see how he does in training camp. If he comes in and shows that he belongs in the NHL and is just too talented to send back, it complicates matters, but in a good way. Likewise, if Aho looks like he's Toews part Deux, maybe the team explores a trade with Leddy (or Hickey) - especially if a team has a Dman go down. For Leddy, I'd want at least a first round pick coming back. For Hickey, a 3rd rounder sounds about right.

The question will be, where does Dobson play if he's NOT NHL-ready? And honestly, that is the likelihood. We just know he has next to nothing to prove at the junior level and the AHL is not an option.

Leddy and Hickey are very moveable Dmen, depending on the return. I would love for Aho to force management's hand by early December.

MVS and PW, they seem to have some promise, but I can't see them even getting an opportunity with the big club over the next two years. A team with an empty prospect bin would be wise to offer up a mid round pick for those guys. Of course, if we have a rash of injuries, ya never know who gets to step up with a chance to shine.

A rash of injuries... that's their only shot here, as I see it.

And yes, I have no idea if these two have NHL prospects. They're certainly in the picture and have been developing slowly, but surely, at the AHL level. You're right that they may be better served elsewhere.

Its always a good thing when your uncertain young(ish) guys step up and play better than expected (in this case Pelech, Toews and Mayfield). Would be nice if we saw the same thing with our forwards as well. If all of a sudden MDC, Bellows, JHS, Koivula and Wahlstrom were showing that they're deserving of play with the big club, another great problem to have. We'd be faced with the issue of what to do with Komarov and Ladd.

If these kids prove to be more valuable than the Ladd's and Komarov's of the world, Lou will find a way for them to stay. He may have to bite a bullet here or there, but it will be easy to do knowing they're fully replaced from within.

 

[crasherino]

The question will be, where does Dobson play if he's NOT NHL-ready? And honestly, that is the likelihood. We just know he has next to nothing to prove at the junior level and the AHL is not an option.

Leddy and Hickey are very moveable Dmen, depending on the return. I would love for Aho to force management's hand by early December.

If it plays out as you hypothesize, my guess is that he still stays with the team for October. Let him practice with the team, let him learn what its like to be a pro with travel, etc. Depending on what happens, give him a spot start he or there. But ultimately, after getting that taste of the big leagues, I'm OK with sending him back to Juniors. I think everyone will agree that he has nothing left to prove there and he will be veritable men amongst boys. But, the reality is is that he has to play somewhere. And if he's not quite ready for the NHL (and we really don't have a spot for him), send him back to Juniors with the directive to work on certain specific things that he can improve upon - whatever they may be. Just because he's too good for the league, doesn't mean he can't get work on things in his game to improve and become more equipped to handle the NHL the following year. He'll get some good exposure playing in the WJCs - hopefully he'll be the #1 Dman and play in all highly leveraged situations.

Again, good problem to have. Lets hope our forward prospects create the same issues.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

If it plays out as you hypothesize, my guess is that he still stays with the team for October. Let him practice with the team, let him learn what its like to be a pro with travel, etc. Depending on what happens, give him a spot start he or there. But ultimately, after getting that taste of the big leagues, I'm OK with sending him back to Juniors. I think everyone will agree that he has nothing left to prove there and he will be veritable men amongst boys. But, the reality is is that he has to play somewhere. And if he's not quite ready for the NHL (and we really don't have a spot for him), send him back to Juniors with the directive to work on certain specific things that he can improve upon - whatever they may be. Just because he's too good for the league, doesn't mean he can't get work on things in his game to improve and become more equipped to handle the NHL the following year. He'll get some good exposure playing in the WJCs - hopefully he'll be the #1 Dman and play in all highly leveraged situations.

Again, good problem to have. Lets hope our forward prospects create the same issues.

Don't forget that you can only have a certain amount of players who hang around "sitting in the stands".

And with forwards Kuhnhackl, Johnston, Fritz, MDC, JHS, and one of the Dmen (likely Hickey) all waiver-eligible, there's really no space to have Dobson just hanging around. In fact, I believe you can't have more than 3 non-injured players hanging around. Heck, it could even be two.

PS) This is another reason why guys like Wahlstrom, Bellows, Koivula, etc. aren't likely to be taken into consideration whatsoever at this point. About every body that can be in Bridgeport without going through waivers basically needs to be there.

 

[crasherino]

Don't forget that you can only have a certain amount of players who hang around "sitting in the stands".

And with forwards Kuhnhackl, Johnston, Fritz, MDC, JHS, and one of the Dmen (likely Hickey) all waiver-eligible, there's really no space to have Dobson just hanging around. In fact, I believe you can't have more than 3 non-injured players hanging around. Heck, it could even be two.

PS) This is another reason why guys like Wahlstrom, Bellows, Koivula, etc. aren't likely to be taken into consideration whatsoever at this point. About every body that can be in Bridgeport without going through waivers basically needs to be there.

Yeah - in order for that even to be a possibility, we'd need two IR candidates, minimum. Especially if we want to carry 14 forwards, which considering JHS no longer being exempt, is a distinct probability.

We know that Ladd tore his ACL so he will likely start on IR - even if his recovery has gone smoothly, there's no reason to rush him - but Cal's status is all conjecture on our part. We know he had back surgery but we have no idea how serious it was. There were reports that he was skating but that doesn't mean he'll be in game shape any time soon. If both of those guys are on IR to start, the roster management gets a little easier. Otherwise, there will be a log jam if Dobson pushes for a roster spot.

 

[Merrrlin]

We're a long way from the days of having Jurcina as our top 4 and Mark Eton, but I do miss Jurcina...he'd always break the other team's ankles with his shot.

Our defense is solid on depth...weak on top-end talent, which is why we shouldn't trade Leddy. We need his skating and speed, especially in this league. I just feel bad because there are at least 2 guys in the A that deserve to play now. I have a feeling Mayfield goes and we'll get something good for him too.

I think this is a better analysis than @The Winter Soldier 's OP. Love our depth, but I am not 100% sure have a true #1D in the system. Dobson would need to hit his ceiling, which I believe he can do, but I would prefer to have at least 1 or 2 more guys with that ceiling.

Long term, I think we have an abundance of 2nd pairing guys, but we could use 1 or 2 more top pairing types in the system. Our depth is top of the league but our group (prospects and current players) as a whole is only in the "healthy" range. Nothing special as of now.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

I think this is better analysis than the Winter soldier. You had to add that for no other reason than to get a reaction.

Really you have got to up your troll game @Treebeard

Your fascination with me is cute though. You don't like my analysis, no one is stopping you from making your own thread here.

 

[Merrrlin]

I think this is better analysis than the Winter soldier. You had to add that for no other reason than to get a reaction. Really you have got to up your troll game @Treebeard

Your fascination with me is cute though. You don't like my analysis, no one is stopping you from making your own thread here.

Why would I make a thread about the same topic?

Listen, we're all just discussing the topic here. I don't think you should feel violated just because some of us disagree. My point is mainly that I am not willing to pat ourselves on the back just yet, the top pairing is going to need some buffetting long term. However, I agree with you that we have an impressive group of "top 4" types.