NHL Entry Draft The 2023-24 Tank Command Thread

[JungleBeat]

How is anyone managing to manufacture any sort of excitement for yet another tank thread I do not know. It's beyond depressing that this is where we find ourselves yet again in 2024.

I’ll tune in on the draft lottery day, no idea about this draft class. I just want some meaningful hockey damnit

 

[Super Cake]

My excitement for this season went down the drain.

With this team once again at the bottom of the standings and the other team i follow looking like they are on their way to collapsing right out of a playoff spot, i just don't know if i really want to watch hockey anymore.

 

[Alf Silfversson]

Tank means your team is pulling moves to weaken the roster to lose games while providing some experience to the prospects.

We are not tanking We just have a roster where the players we need to be going to have success are giving us half hearted efforts.

Young players adored their coach and could not accept the coaching change as something to help them be better.

Honestly it's kind of the reverse of what usually happens.

Usually tanking teams see their management stripping them down to bare bones from February on, while the players continue to battle hard. Meanwhile we have management who seem willing to add and our players are out for a walk in the park every night.

Bizzaro world tank!

 

[Cosmix]

Honestly it's kind of the reverse of what usually happens.

Usually tanking teams see their management stripping them down to bare bones from February on, while the players continue to battle hard. Meanwhile we have management who seem willing to add and our players are out for a walk in the park every night.

Bizzaro world tank!

I don't see management starting to dismantle this team to get better draft picks, so technically, it is not a tanking strategy. However, given the way this season has gone, starting with great expectations and quickly dropping to the agony of defeat, I am hoping the team can get a high top 5 draft pick to improve our prospects.

Having the team play great for the rest of this season, as it did last season, will likely not make the team better next season. It did not work last season. Changes are needed and have already begun with a new owner, POHO/GM and interim coaching staff. Getting a top 5 draft pick would be a nice compensation for this disaster of a season.

 

[h2]

If we end up drafting at or near the top of this draft, I'll be more optimistic about the team going forward. I believe that Dorion's evaluation was incorrect in that he thought the team was ready to exit the rebuild and acquire impact players to the core we had drafted upto that point. I think we were still 1-2 drafts away from being at that point from when we really started to switch to win now mode (Debrincat trade). Getting a top pick this year will help steer the team in the right direction and hopefully get us back on track.

Combined with the above, we still need to address the soft backend and the lack of two-way players up front. Dorion certainly left the team in hard mode for Staios to takeover with no prospects, no cap space, last place team, the team filled with max term contracts with clauses, and a 1st to be forfeited. The next year will be very interesting.

 

[Hale The Villain]

Honestly it's kind of the reverse of what usually happens.

Usually tanking teams see their management stripping them down to bare bones from February on, while the players continue to battle hard. Meanwhile we have management who seem willing to add and our players are out for a walk in the park every night.

Bizzaro world tank!

We did that so many times under Murray when we were at the bottom of the league.

2009 he trades a 1st for Campoli and Comrie
2011 he trades Elliott for Anderson
2014 he trades picks for Hemsky
2016 he trades a bunch of spare parts for Phaneuf

End result each time was a late season push that hurt our top draft pick.

No other team does this, just us for some reason.

 

[Tragedy]

We did that so many times under Murray when we were at the bottom of the league.

2009 he trades a 1st for Campoli and Comrie
2011 he trades Elliott for Anderson
2014 he trades picks for Hemsky
2016 he trades a bunch of spare parts for Phaneuf

End result each time was a late season push that hurt our top draft pick.

No other team does this, just us for some reason.

2011 gave us one of the best goalies we've ever had as a Franchise and Phaneuf was a part of the 2017 run

 

[Hale The Villain]

2011 gave us one of the best goalies we've ever had as a Franchise and Phaneuf was a part of the 2017 run

Sure, but that doesn't mean they weren't acquired when the season was lost and we should have been tanking.

Murray never could stomach bottoming out in a lost season, and it cost the team dearly on draft day.

 

[Micklebot]

Sure, but that doesn't mean they weren't acquired when the season was lost and we should have been tanking.

Murray never could stomach bottoming out in a lost season, and it cost the team dearly on draft day.

I'd rather Zibanejad and Anderson than one of Landeskog, Huberdeau Strome or Larsson, whether the "right" decision was to fully embrace the tank or not, the outcome of the choice we did make in 2011 was the likely the best possible one, unless you think Anderson would have signed here anyways, which is a bit of a gamble.

 

[JungleBeat]

2011 gave us one of the best goalies we've ever had as a Franchise and Phaneuf was a part of the 2017 run

Phanuef was garbage as a Senator. Unnecessary trade.

 

[h2]

I'd rather Zibanejad and Anderson than one of Landeskog, Huberdeau Strome or Larsson, whether the "right" decision was to fully embrace the tank or not, the outcome of the choice we did make in 2011 was the likely the best possible one, unless you think Anderson would have signed here anyways, which is a bit of a gamble.

I agree with you that the 2011 situation worked out best in hindsight with Zib/Anderson.

With Karlsson/Alfredsson we were never going to go full rebuild in 2011. The retool was largely successful as well when you factor in our ECF appearance in 2017. The roster at the time was actually pretty good, and could have been even better had Dorion not butchered his initial moves.

 

[Big Muddy]

How is anyone managing to manufacture any sort of excitement for yet another tank thread I do not know. It's beyond depressing that this is where we find ourselves yet again in 2024.

It's part of the grieving process.

 

[Big Muddy]

Tank means your team is pulling moves to weaken the roster to lose games while providing some experience to the prospects.

We are not tanking We just have a roster where the players we need to be going to have success are giving us half hearted efforts.

Young players adored their coach and could not accept the coaching change as something to help them be better.

I think it's more about having some fun and making light (or the best) of the situation. People are just hoping we get a really good draft pick. Not sure what cute, concise term you use for that, so maybe in its absence, they call it tanking?

 

[Hale The Villain]

I'd rather Zibanejad and Anderson than one of Landeskog, Huberdeau Strome or Larsson, whether the "right" decision was to fully embrace the tank or not, the outcome of the choice we did make in 2011 was the likely the best possible one, unless you think Anderson would have signed here anyways, which is a bit of a gamble.

Yeah it ended up working out well, but I just like to point out that trading Tank Commander Elliott for Anderson basically made us switch draft spots with the Avs - we went from 2nd worst to 5th worst (then dropped in the lottery) and they went from 7th worst to 2nd worst.

And then on draft day we were rumoured to be offering the 21st pick, which we got from the Preds by trading Fisher, with the 6th pick to Florida for 3rd overall to draft Huberdeau/Landeskog, so fixing our goalie position when the season was lost cost us at least a 1st in value because of the hit to our draft pick.

Goes to show that adding talent late in the year when the season is lost often carries costs beyond just what assets are given up in the trade.

 

[Micklebot]

Yeah it ended up working out well, but I just like to point out that trading Tank Commander Elliott for Anderson basically made us switch draft spots with the Avs - we went from 2nd worst to 5th worst (then dropped in the lottery) and they went from 7th worst to 2nd worst.

And then on draft day we were rumoured to be offering the 21st pick, which we got from the Preds by trading Fisher, with the 6th pick to Florida for 3rd overall to draft Huberdeau/Landeskog, so fixing our goalie position when the season was lost cost us at least a 1st in value because of the hit to our draft pick.

Goes to show that adding talent late in the year when the season is lost often carries costs beyond just what assets are given up in the trade.

So what you're saying is we could have landed Anderson, one of Huberdeau or Landeskog, it only would have cost us Noesen? Still sounds like a successful decision

 

[Hale The Villain]

So what you're saying is we could have landed Anderson, one of Huberdeau or Landeskog, it only would have cost us Noesen? Still sounds like a successful decision

Well obviously not because Florida didn't think the 21st overall pick was enough to move down 3 spots.

My point is that it ended up costing us more than just Elliott to add Anderson. The cost is better thought of as Elliott + a 1st.

Given how good Anderson was for us it ended up being worth it, but making a late season acquisition to fix a hole in the roster came at a big cost on draft day.

It's a big reason why teams far out of the playoff race almost always wait until the offseason to fix holes in their roster, and it should be factored in by Staios in determining the value of making a veteran acquisition prior to the end of the season.

 

[WORLDSTARHIPHOP]

How is anyone managing to manufacture any sort of excitement for yet another tank thread I do not know. It's beyond depressing that this is where we find ourselves yet again in 2024.

1. Denial – The first reaction is denial. In this stage, individuals believe the diagnosis is somehow mistaken, and cling to a false, preferable reality. Some may also isolate themselves, avoiding others who may have accepted what is happening.[4] This stage is usually a temporary defense, so long as the person has adequate time to move amongst the stages as they contemplate death.[4] In her book, Kübler-Ross states that technological advancements have caused people to become fearful of violent, painful deaths; therefore, in order to protect the psychological mind, they deny the reality of their own inevitable death. [4]
2. Anger – When the individual recognizes that denial cannot continue, they become frustrated, especially at proximate individuals. Certain psychological responses of a person undergoing this phase would be: "Why me? It's not fair!"; "How can this happen to me?"; "Who is to blame?"; "Why would this happen?". Some may lash out at loved ones, medical staff, and other family.[4] In Kübler-Ross's other book, Questions and Answers on Death and Dying, she emphasizes the need for people to do their best to let those who are in this stage feel their feelings and try not to take the anger personally. [12]
3. Bargaining – The third stage involves the hope that the individual can avoid a cause of grief. Usually, the negotiation for an extended life is made in exchange for a reformed lifestyle. People facing less serious trauma can bargain or seek compromise. Examples include the terminally ill person who "negotiates with God" to attend a daughter's wedding, an attempt to bargain for more time to live in exchange for a reformed lifestyle or a phrase such as "If I could trade their life for mine".
4. Depression – "I'm so sad, why bother with anything?"; "I'm going to die soon, so what's the point?"; "I miss my loved one; why go on?"
   During the fourth stage, the individual despairs at the recognition of their mortality. In this state, the individual may become silent, refuse visitors and spend much of the time mournful and sullen.
5. Acceptance – "It's going to be okay."; "I can't fight it; I may as well prepare for it."
   In this last stage, individuals embrace mortality or inevitable future, or that of a loved one, or other tragic event. People dying may precede the survivors in this state, which typically comes with a calm, retrospective view for the individual, and a stable condition of emotions.

We are at #5

 

[Big Muddy]

If we finish in the 5-10 range, I think there's a good chance we'd opt for one of the big D.

I expect Dickinson to go top 5 but guys like Levshunov, Yakemchuk and Silayev seem like potential Sens targets. All are big toolsy D.

Don't give up hope on finishing even lower. We still have a few "losses-at-hand" games to play yet.

 

[Sun God Nika]

I was on the tank more than most the last few seasons. However I have seen this team bottom out multiple times to fall back 3 places. Ill keep rooting for wins this year but wont hate anyone actively rooting for them to lose.

As long as Stutzle, Sanderson and Tkachuk are still committed here we can build a winner regardless of what happens i really believe that.

 

[Dan Patrick]

 

[Boud]

Tbh trading for Debrincat wasn't ideal. I could see trading for Chychrun but until we are a playoff team consistently ala Boston we do not trade our 1st round picks.

Yep this is what worries me about this rebuild. We wasted two long-term pieces that would've been great adds for long term success of this team.

If we had traded for these players knowing they would be here long term - that's fine.

But...

Debrincat obviously didn't stay and all we have left is a 27-32 OA pick and Kubalik.

Chychrun had a 2 year deal when the trade was made and who knows if he wants to re-sign here the way this team is playing. Who knows what we could get for him.

 

[Tuna99]

Big success of the rebuild is we don’t have any $11 million players on the payroll - we really showed Toronto how it’s done!!

 

[Tuna99]

If we finish in the 5-10 range, I think there's a good chance we'd opt for one of the big D.

I expect Dickinson to go top 5 but guys like Levshunov, Yakemchuk and Silayev seem like potential Sens targets. All are big toolsy D.

You’re optimistic. To draft between 8-10 and have a minimum .500% points percentage Ottawa would finish the season 27-18 in the next 45 games.

Ottawa most likely to finish 6 or below.

 

[bicboi64]

We're gon end up picking 6-10. Gimme Zayne Parekh in the draft please!

 

[Big Muddy]

We're gon end up picking 6-10. Gimme Zayne Parekh in the draft please!

I'd say we finish bottom six. I really doubt if we are better than seven other teams, let alone 9 other teams.

Just curious which teams that are currently above us in the standings do you see us passing? Its just for fun btw - doesn't matter much one way or another.

I'll use an example. We are 30th in the standings (using TSN site), while Columbus is 28th. We have 5 games in hand over the CBJ. CBJ has 35 points while the Senators have 28. I suppose the thinking is that the games-in-hand could result in us getting past CBJ. But, is it "games-at-hand" versus "losses-at-hand"? You could apply this principle or question to other teams ahead of us as well.