Equipment: SKATES - Buying Guide and Advice III

[Slugworth]

I skip the top for every skate I wear. Also, please do a search for 'lacebite' and/or 'lacebite pads' around these threads; lots of good insight.

The tounge is super stiff on these Tack's too.

 

[AIREAYE]

The tounge is super stiff on these Tack's too.

You could also engineer a bit of tongue 'flop' combined with your lacing experiment as well. You could apply a bit of gentle, even heat either through a normal skate re-bake (and manually 'flop' out the tongue) or through a hair dryer/heat gun on low along the tongue.

 

[Elias Pettersson]

ok having played in the CCM RBZ skates now I can say it's an amazing skate. What blows me away is how light it is and although this might be placebo, I felt noticeably faster on the ice. The hyperglide blades feel super smooth across the ice.

Although, coming from Eastons and getting used to the +4mm SB runners was way more of an adjustment than I expected.

 

[Fremitus Borealis]

ok having played in the CCM RBZ skates now I can say it's an amazing skate. What blows me away is how light it is and although this might be placebo, I felt noticeably faster on the ice. The hyperglide blades feel super smooth across the ice.

Although, coming from Eastons and getting used to the +4mm SB runners was way more of an adjustment than I expected.

Oh man, yeah it took me a little while to get used to the extra height when I switched to CCM Jetspeeds, and I think that was only an extra +2mm You really don't think it'll be that big of a difference, then you absentmindedly do something you've done a thousand times, and end up on your ass because you didn't lift your foot up high enough

 

[rh71]

I'm on the x4.0 Vapors (told equivalent to X600) and was wondering if there's a big enough step up with the 1X in terms of transferring energy. I know it's stiffer, the outsole is different, it's lighter by about 150 grams (.33lbs), the steel is an upgrade, and it comes with the speed plate. I'm not sure if there's a 3mm height difference too. But what's most important - is this going to translate to a little more energy transfer or being less tired, etc.?

It's just beer league but I would like to splurge at some point (when new Vapors are out and these are cheaper) if it's worth it.

 

[AIREAYE]

I'm on the x4.0 Vapors (told equivalent to X600) and was wondering if there's a big enough step up with the 1X in terms of transferring energy. I know it's stiffer, the outsole is different, it's lighter by about 150 grams (.33lbs), the steel is an upgrade, and it comes with the speed plate. I'm not sure if there's a 3mm height difference too. But what's most important - is this going to translate to a little more energy transfer or being less tired, etc.?

It's just beer league but I would like to splurge at some point (when new Vapors are out and these are cheaper) if it's worth it.

Very significant difference; but obviously it will also be significantly stiffer. This isn't always beneficial.

 

[Winky]

Very significant difference; but obviously it will also be significantly stiffer. This isn't always beneficial.

Can you please explain the practical drawback to having a stiffer boot when upgrading from low-mid tier skate to elite level? I'm in the same boat as OP. Thanks.

 

[AIREAYE]

Can you please explain the practical drawback to having a stiffer boot when upgrading from low-mid tier skate to elite level? I'm in the same boat as OP. Thanks.

It's essentially the restriction of movement; particularly ankle bend which would allow for a better forward lean. While it's generally not recommended, plenty of adult rec players use high end skates just fine. The performance benefit, the individual's skating skill, other preferences etc. could all be factors that would allow for someone to get the most out of a high end skate.

For example, I consider myself a slightly above average skater that doesn't play often enough (~once a week) and isn't particularly heavy. I use high end skates because the performance benefit is significant over low end models that would technically 'fit' my profile. However, to deal with the stiffness, I skip the top lace and lace the 2nd-from-top eyelet loosely to allow for optimum ankle movement.

 

[Winky]

Thanks AIREAYE. That resonates with about where I'm at (I usually play 2-3 times/week though). I

I read it somewhere before, but I can't remember ... will new Vapors be hitting stores sometime between March and May this year?

 

[AIREAYE]

Thanks AIREAYE. That resonates with about where I'm at (I usually play 2-3 times/week though). I

I read it somewhere before, but I can't remember ... will new Vapors be hitting stores sometime between March and May this year?

That's the pattern. I haven't seen details about it yet.

 

[Winky]

Hearing that Bauer sent price recommendations earlier today for discounts on Vapor skates, Supreme sticks, and Supreme gear ahead of the new releases later this year.

Side question ... went to my LHS last week. Got fitted a few years back for 7.5D Vapors. Tried on Vapor 1XLE, X800, and X700. Also tried a Supreme 1S and CCM Jetspeeds.

When running the ruler down the boot with the tongue flopped, had some contact when I flexed my big toe. Makes sense, as I started having some minor lace bite on my X60LEs after 1.5 yrs of use. The odd thing to me was that the Supremes didn't do any better ... had the same amount (maybe more) contact with the ruler. I didn't have contact in the Jetspeeds, but the inside of the boot at the sole felt too high ... like they'd fit a very high-arched sole (not me). They weren't as comfortable as the Vapors.

Any other recommended skates to try out? Didn't go Nexus or Ribcor, as the sales guy pretty much recommended I just go with the Vapors. And the 1XLE does feel good, the best of what I tried on, and what I've been skating in for the past 2 years. Just would rather not have to deal with lace bite ... especially if I'm dropping ~$900 on top tier skates. Thanks.

 

[Elias Pettersson]

Hearing that Bauer sent price recommendations earlier today for discounts on Vapor skates, Supreme sticks, and Supreme gear ahead of the new releases later this year.

Side question ... went to my LHS last week. Got fitted a few years back for 7.5D Vapors. Tried on Vapor 1XLE, X800, and X700. Also tried a Supreme 1S and CCM Jetspeeds.

When running the ruler down the boot with the tongue flopped, had some contact when I flexed my big toe. Makes sense, as I started having some minor lace bite on my X60LEs after 1.5 yrs of use. The odd thing to me was that the Supremes didn't do any better ... had the same amount (maybe more) contact with the ruler. I didn't have contact in the Jetspeeds, but the inside of the boot at the sole felt too high ... like they'd fit a very high-arched sole (not me). They weren't as comfortable as the Vapors.

Any other recommended skates to try out? Didn't go Nexus or Ribcor, as the sales guy pretty much recommended I just go with the Vapors. And the 1XLE does feel good, the best of what I tried on, and what I've been skating in for the past 2 years. Just would rather not have to deal with lace bite ... especially if I'm dropping ~$900 on top tier skates. Thanks.

Why don't you look at clearance top end skates from a few years back? They'll be way way cheaper and the technology will be basically the same. Best deal imo.

 

[AIREAYE]

Hearing that Bauer sent price recommendations earlier today for discounts on Vapor skates, Supreme sticks, and Supreme gear ahead of the new releases later this year.

Side question ... went to my LHS last week. Got fitted a few years back for 7.5D Vapors. Tried on Vapor 1XLE, X800, and X700. Also tried a Supreme 1S and CCM Jetspeeds.

When running the ruler down the boot with the tongue flopped, had some contact when I flexed my big toe. Makes sense, as I started having some minor lace bite on my X60LEs after 1.5 yrs of use. The odd thing to me was that the Supremes didn't do any better ... had the same amount (maybe more) contact with the ruler. I didn't have contact in the Jetspeeds, but the inside of the boot at the sole felt too high ... like they'd fit a very high-arched sole (not me). They weren't as comfortable as the Vapors.

Any other recommended skates to try out? Didn't go Nexus or Ribcor, as the sales guy pretty much recommended I just go with the Vapors. And the 1XLE does feel good, the best of what I tried on, and what I've been skating in for the past 2 years. Just would rather not have to deal with lace bite ... especially if I'm dropping ~$900 on top tier skates. Thanks.

Minor lacebite on a mid low end skate (with a thin tongue) that fit you well? Not sure why you're concerned about switching haha. Upgrade to a tongue with better lacebite protection.

 

[Winky]

Why don't you look at clearance top end skates from a few years back? They'll be way way cheaper and the technology will be basically the same. Best deal imo.

I looked a little and didn't see any top tier skates in my size, but I'll look some more to be sure.

Minor lacebite on a mid low end skate (with a thin tongue) that fit you well? Not sure why you're concerned about switching haha. Upgrade to a tongue with better lacebite protection.

No, I agree. I just wasn't sure if upgrading to top-tier would have any difference or not. Good to know it will. Yeah, I'm completely happy staying with Vapors if that's the case.

 

[Winky]

Can someone please clarify the differences between the Vapor 1X, 1XPro, and 1XLE skates?

I got different answers from three different retailers today, and none of them seemed very confident in the answers they were giving.

Here's the Ice Warehouse page showing descriptions of all three ...

http://www.icewarehouse.com/Bauer_Ice_Hockey_Skates_Senior/catpage-SKMIBAUER09.html

Seems like the quarter package differs on all three, but is that true? I was able to compare the 1XPro and the 1XLE today, and there is clearly a difference in the stitching pattern on the tongues between the two (cross pattern on Pros).

Thanks.

 

[AIREAYE]

Can someone please clarify the differences between the Vapor 1X, 1XPro, and 1XLE skates?

I got different answers from three different retailers today, and none of them seemed very confident in the answers they were giving.

Here's the Ice Warehouse page showing descriptions of all three ...

http://www.icewarehouse.com/Bauer_Ice_Hockey_Skates_Senior/catpage-SKMIBAUER09.html

Seems like the quarter package differs on all three, but is that true? I was able to compare the 1XPro and the 1XLE today, and there is clearly a difference in the stitching pattern on the tongues between the two (cross pattern on Pros).

Thanks.

Have you read the descriptions? It's all there.

1XLE = 1X, it's just the LE is a different color pattern.

1X Pro is a bit stiffer, has a different tongue (more traditional 3pc felt) and a different pair of retail footbeds.

 

[Winky]

Have you read the descriptions? It's all there.

1XLE = 1X, it's just the LE is a different color pattern.

1X Pro is a bit stiffer, has a different tongue (more traditional 3pc felt) and a different pair of retail footbeds.

Definitely read it, but the descriptions don't always convey the practical information.

For example, The 1X Pro has the "Form-Fit 3 52 oz. 3 piece pro felt tongue", while the 1XLE has "Form-Fit Lite with Curv Composite".

There's a little bit more info provided, but it doesn't really say which one provides greater protection, or what any of that really means in practical terms. Or, if any of these differences would even be noticeable to anyone wearing the boot. I don't know, I guess it just comes across as the same old typical gear marketing lingo they use for everything else.

Thanks though.

 

[AIREAYE]

Definitely read it, but the descriptions don't always convey the practical information.

For example, The 1X Pro has the "Form-Fit 3 52 oz. 3 piece pro felt tongue", while the 1XLE has "Form-Fit Lite with Curv Composite".

There's a little bit more info provided, but it doesn't really say which one provides greater protection, or what any of that really means in practical terms. Or, if any of these differences would even be noticeable to anyone wearing the boot. I don't know, I guess it just comes across as the same old typical gear marketing lingo they use for everything else.

Thanks though.

Protection-wise, I'd say they're about the same, the difference practically would be that the felt would take up more volume in the skate, since it's thicker. Thus, comfort may be affected. Hard to say how that'll impact you without you trying both of them on. I would say that the felt tongue would be more durable in the long run however, compared to the composite.

 

[TheLokNesMonster]

So...here's my rub.

I'm looking to get a new pair of top of the line skates that aren't named Vapor. I've had the X600's for about a year and a half and the tendon guard started to rip off - so I got a new pair of x600's back in early December via warranty. I developed the bauer bump/haglunds from the get go on the right heel only. Now I've developed a blister the size of a coffee k-cup on the inner side of my left foot above the arch.

Both sets of skates have been and were baked. The reason for top of the line is that I spend, at times, 5 hours a day in skates, possibly 4 times a week. I need something that is light, comfortable, and durable.

Are there any suggestions on 1) what would help with the haglunds and the blister, 2) any suggestion on brand/model that would be suitable to the fit with haglunds.

Thanks.

Had the exact same problem with the exact same skates. I did buy some bungas, and they do work for me but...I ended up trading in the Vapor X600's after 2 months, and bought some Supreme S160 Ignite, which is an SMU. (upgraded liner, footbed, outsole, runner)

Here's the story if you care...it's been a saga.

I wanted new skates last fall. I made the mistake of just going to the Vapor because I had been skating in the Vapor XXX from 2005. Now this is an awesome skate. So awesome that I used them for 11 years before finally committing to buying something else. In fact, I'm having a hard time believing there has ever been a better skate made.

They are actually still in great shape, but not as comfortable side to side as they used to be, and I have since discovered that my foot is no longer a Vapor foot. Either I have changed, or Vapors have. I am still wearing them as my primary game skate because I have been trying to break in all these other pairs, and they are still comfortable enough. Eventually I will retire them though.

I had first bought the X800 last November, and after 3 skates, the tongue was digging into by ankle tendon (lace bite feeling), but that tongue is so thick and unyielding, that I am certain it was the tongue and that hard metatarsal guard that was the culprit, and not the lack of a tongue, which is usually the primary cause of lace bite, along with the boot being being too shallow. The X800's, as it turned out, were slightly lower volume from top to bottom than my XXX's, and even a little bit made a huge difference in fit.

Tried everything from lacing to gel pads, flop, no flop, and just brought them back to the store. They took mercy on me and gave me a full refund. Then I went to the X600's which were a fail as mentioned.

So far, six hard skates in, the Supreme Ignites are making it. I also have some Nexus N7000 Freeze (bought at the same time as the Ignites...also an SMU with the same uprades as the Ignite) which are roomier and extremely comfortable, and were bought for outdoor hockey when I am playing for hours on end, and am wearing thick socks to keep the feet warm. I love those skates.

Also : The Nexus Freeze are the same weight as the X600, and the Ignites are about 30 grams lighter. I don't have to wear the bungas on either of these skates as well. BTW: My Vapor XXX weigh in at 730 grams, about 40 grams lighter than the Ignites. They really are the lightest, most awesome and responsive skates I've ever owned. I have my doubts whether anybody will ever make a skate that good again.

 

[rh71]

It's essentially the restriction of movement; particularly ankle bend which would allow for a better forward lean. While it's generally not recommended, plenty of adult rec players use high end skates just fine. The performance benefit, the individual's skating skill, other preferences etc. could all be factors that would allow for someone to get the most out of a high end skate.

For example, I consider myself a slightly above average skater that doesn't play often enough (~once a week) and isn't particularly heavy. I use high end skates because the performance benefit is significant over low end models that would technically 'fit' my profile. However, to deal with the stiffness, I skip the top lace and lace the 2nd-from-top eyelet loosely to allow for optimum ankle movement.

I just realized that the bunion on my right foot (bone that sticks out leftward on the big toe) is likely a result of my Vapor skates. It's not going to go away save for surgery but it doesn't hurt too bad at this point. So the question is - will a bigger toe box of ie. a Supreme/Nexus skate affect the energy transfer gain that comes with upgrading from a mid-tier to top-tier skate? I figure the foot being completely snug in the boot is what maximizes the energy transfer. Maybe even an EE (currently D) could work.

 

[AIREAYE]

I just realized that the bunion on my right foot (bone that sticks out leftward on the big toe) is likely a result of my Vapor skates. It's not going to go away save for surgery but it doesn't hurt too bad at this point. So the question is - will a bigger toe box of ie. a Supreme/Nexus skate affect the energy transfer gain that comes with upgrading from a mid-tier to top-tier skate? I figure the foot being completely snug in the boot is what maximizes the energy transfer. Maybe even an EE (currently D) could work.

They both factor in, but you should focus on getting the proper fit/comfort first before upgrading. You're absolutely right about the snug fit.

 

[LarryO]

I just realized that the bunion on my right foot (bone that sticks out leftward on the big toe) is likely a result of my Vapor skates. It's not going to go away save for surgery but it doesn't hurt too bad at this point. So the question is - will a bigger toe box of ie. a Supreme/Nexus skate affect the energy transfer gain that comes with upgrading from a mid-tier to top-tier skate? I figure the foot being completely snug in the boot is what maximizes the energy transfer. Maybe even an EE (currently D) could work.

That's a real dilemma. I had the same problem. I have big toes that fan outward instead of tapering toward the center like most normal feet, and typical toecaps cater to normal feet so I developed bumps on the outside of my big toes. My ultimate solution ended up being custom VH skates where they built the toecap to accommodate those bumps.

 

[puckpilot]

I just realized that the bunion on my right foot (bone that sticks out leftward on the big toe) is likely a result of my Vapor skates.

I found that, for me, a lot of skates have a pressure/rub point on the side of my right big toe right where the toe box connects with the rest of the skate, regardless of toe box width. One gave me a tiny bump before I realised what was happening. I found the simplest way to deal with it was to just add a little padding over that spot.

Just something for you to keep in mind and maybe try if the problem persists.

 

[Danko]

Narrowed down between Bauer Supreme 160 or ccm tacks 4052'S. Coming from Bauer Supreme 80


I could get Bauer Supreme S160's for $199...
With a coupon i can get CCM Tack 4052's for $150 from totalhockey....

Anyone have insight on either of these skates to help influence my decision?

I play 2-3 times a week on mens league teams.

 

[puckpilot]

Narrowed down between Bauer Supreme 160 or ccm tacks 4052'S. Coming from Bauer Supreme 80


I could get Bauer Supreme S160's for $199...
With a coupon i can get CCM Tack 4052's for $150 from totalhockey....

Anyone have insight on either of these skates to help influence my decision?

I play 2-3 times a week on mens league teams.

I don't have experience with those exact models but I did recently try on Ultra Tacks and a pair of Supreme S190s. I found that the Tacks had a higher arch. It was quite noticeable for me because I have low arches. I didn't even have to tie the Tacks up to know the arches were way to high for my foot.

I don't have an opinion on the other aspects comparing the two skates.