Should Holland be replaced as GM? (and moved to front office)

[Bench]

For the record, Q and Richards have not signed anywhere yet. It is still very possible that they come back.

I doubt Richards would even want to come back, but I can definitely see Q getting another shot after Holland fails to trade for anyone.

I remember saying Quincey would have a hard time finding a job around the league.

Well, let me put it this way... who is going to pay him what he got from the Wings?

 

[sarcastro]

I remember saying Quincey would have a hard time finding a job around the league.

Well, let me put it this way... who is going to pay him what he got from the Wings?

I was more referring to Henkka's comments about how hey, at least Holland let those guys walk, so maybe there's hope after all.

They're not truly gone until they sign somewhere else...

 

[KJoe88]

No. Maybe with a proper replacement.

 

[Vatican Roulette]

I think Holland made his bed. Overload on forwards and hope it makes up for the garbage blue line.

Or maybe he signed the depth in anticipation of trading a forward for defense?

One can dream...

 

[Vyacheslav]

People don't even understand sarcasm anymore.

Thanks Holland.

I am of the laughing out loud, so gratz. Poe's law in effect.

 

[Bench]

I was more referring to Henkka's comments about how hey, at least Holland let those guys walk, so maybe there's hope after all.

They're not truly gone until they sign somewhere else...

Yeah, of course. Just snowballing your comment that the Wings probably paid Quincey more than anybody else ever will, which I think is kind of the Wings thing with guys they draft.

If Quincey wants work he'll take $2 million or less and try to claw his way into a bigger role again.

 

[Frk It]

I remember saying Quincey would have a hard time finding a job around the league.

Well, let me put it this way... who is going to pay him what he got from the Wings?

The sad thing is, re-signing Quincey would have made more sense than re-signing Helm... In my opinion. Obviously I would have preferred to do neither.

 

[Retire91]

I could see Holland signing both those guys back then waving whoever he needs to wave to make room, then at some point down the road trading a first to get them back. I know its hyper bull but this is the exact type of asset mis-management that got us where we are today.

 

[HockeyinHD]

Yeah, of course. Just snowballing your comment that the Wings probably paid Quincey more than anybody else ever will, which I think is kind of the Wings thing with guys they draft.

Did they pay Fil and Hudler more than they ever made elsewhere?

Fedorov? Brunner? Leino? Kopecky?

When Holland does something obviously it was something nobody else would have done, which is unknowable because Holland did it first and subsequent actions taken by other GMs are done with new conditions.

Beyond the basic inaccuracy of the above claim, there is actually a value in having a roster of knowable and known players as opposed to a PS4'd amalgamation.

If Quincey wants work he'll take $2 million or less and try to claw his way into a bigger role again.

For example, in the comment above Quincey is now a 30 year old dman, obviously and of course his career opportunities are going to be more limited now than when he was a 26 year old dman the Wings acquired with a late #1.

That it is unlikely anyone will give Quincey a ~4 mil deal in current cap dollars now is not de facto proof he shouldn't have had one in the time between 2011 and 2016.

 

[Retire91]

For example, in the comment above Quincey is now a 30 year old dman, obviously and of course his career opportunities are going to be more limited now than when he was a 26 year old dman the Wings acquired with a late #1.

That it is unlikely anyone will give Quincey a ~4 mil deal in current cap dollars now is not de facto proof he shouldn't have had one in the time between 2011 and 2016.

Given Holland's track record you also can't rule out Holland re-signing him at 4 million and creating an even worse cap situation then he just traded down to get out of.

Wow I can't beleive Holland's approval rating is under 20% :O

 

[HockeyinHD]

thats because he flat our LIED to every single fan

If someone is expecting honesty and forthrightness out of pretty much anyone involved with a multi-billion dollar business... I mean, oof.

It's pretty much Ken Holland's job to not tell you the truth.
It's pretty much Jeff Blashill's job to not tell you the truth.

Oh, they'll tell you the truth sometimes, at least a bit, usually sprinkled in with a bunch of evasions and amorphous flim-flammery... but the actual, unvarnished truth?

Get the bleep out of here with that. You will only get 'truth' when it serves the organization's interests to give it, and even in that situation you'll only get the most self-serving version of it.

 

[HockeyinHD]

Given Holland's track record you also can't rule out Holland re-signing him at 4 million and creating an even worse cap situation then he just traded down to get out of.

Sure I can.

There, see? I just did it.

 

[Retire91]

Sure I can.

There, see? I just did it.

Just saying if you follow trends he is more likely to do this then trade for a defenseman.

 

[MrTaterSalad]

Yeah, of course. Just snowballing your comment that the Wings probably paid Quincey more than anybody else ever will, which I think is kind of the Wings thing with guys they draft.

If Quincey wants work he'll take $2 million or less and try to claw his way into a bigger role again.

Qunicey will take the $3.85 million hometown discount just like Helm did. There is no market out that for Quincey, no team clamoring to sign him, which is all the more reason Kenny will both bring him back and do it at a deal way above Quincey's paygrade. $3.5 million/2 years sounds about right from Kenny.

 

[HockeyinHD]

Just saying if you follow trends he is more likely to do this then trade for a defenseman.

Oh, that I agree with... but we're talking about the difference between a 10% chance (that he trades for a dman) and a 0% chance (that he re-ups with Quincey.

 

[Henkka]

Qunicey will take the $3.85 million hometown discount just like Helm did. There is no market out that for Quincey, no team clamoring to sign him, which is all the more reason Kenny will both bring him back and do it at a deal way above Quincey's paygrade. $3.5 million/2 years sounds about right from Kenny.

Nice joke, but there's no cap room.

 

[Bench]

Nice joke, but there's no cap room.

I think the real joke is this roster is going to struggle to be under the cap.

 

[The Zermanator]

http://nhl.nbcsports.com/2016/07/11/vegas-gm-search-down-to-two-tallon-maciver-not-among-them/

On Las Vegas' GM search:

And while we don’t know who’s in in the mix, we do know two rumored candidates that are out.

Those would be current Florida Panthers president Dale Tallon and current Blackhawks assistant GM Norm Maciver. Tallon, who was “promoted” from the GM role in Florida this offseason, was allowed to speak with the Vegas group after Foley was granted permission by Panthers owner Vincent Viola.

But Foley never reached out.

Didn't realize Tallon would even be considered a possibility with his position in Florida. If he could be had, I'd take him as GM. I think he did a very good job in Florida the past several years.

 

[Retire91]

I think the real joke is this roster is going to struggle to be under the cap.

Even after he shed 7.5 million of it.

Thank goodness Doan re-signed

More than a 0 percent chance quincy is re-signed for sure

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

I think the real joke is this roster is going to struggle to be under the cap.

good lord that is depressing.

 

[SirloinUB]

I could see Holland signing both those guys back then waving whoever he needs to wave to make room, then at some point down the road trading a first to get them back. I know its hyper bull but this is the exact type of asset mis-management that got us where we are today.

Ahh.. So now we have reached the point where we make up hypothetical situations to trash Holland even further.

Lovely

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

Ahh.. So now we have reached the point where we make up hypothetical situations to trash Holland even further.

Lovely

its in the exact same realm of hypothetical as KH trading for a dman, is it not?

 

[Datsyukian Deke]

Yes!

Just before Yzerman left, Holland refused to be moved to the Front Office, which led Yzerman to go to Tampa. The Ilitch family should have not given Holland the option and flat out told him, this is how it's going to be.

But of course, that didn't happen, and for the last 6 seasons and since Scotty & Nill left, Holland has been exposed as what he is, an average and out of touch GM, who had others around him to make him look good.

Enough is enough, screw the playoff streak, return us to some sense of normalcy already.

 

[waltdetroit]

Here is an interesting article from The Hockey News on "How much confidence does each NHL fan base have in their front office? A ranking of all 30 teams"

Detroit # 21
Chicago # 12
Stevie Y # 1



http://www.thehockeynews.com/blog/h...their-front-office-a-ranking-of-all-30-teams/

 

[SirloinUB]

its in the exact same realm of hypothetical as KH trading for a dman, is it not?

Absolutely, but you don't see poster praising Holland based on those hypotheticals.

Which is exactly what I am getting at. Its absurd to critique (good or bad) an individual based on a hypothetical situation. The poster I quoted was using a made up situation to push his agenda.