Value of: Shea Weber to TOR

[Philadelphia Ducks]

Wow...there is no way they hold Nashville to that. How would you even manage it? Just trade away 1/3 of your team for picks/prospects/cheap nhlers?

League will let them get away with it. NHL doesn't have much back bone enforcing penalties, they always cave in situations like this.

 

[sansabri]

League will let them get away with it. NHL doesn't have much back bone enforcing penalties, they always cave in situations like this.

As well they should in this particular case.

 

[Philadelphia Ducks]

As well they should in this particular case.

I don't see why they should in this case, once you make one exception people will be expecting others. There was always the risk of them matching the offer going into the final year of a CBA when everyone knew the league hated these front loaded long contracts.

 

[rent free]

Just to answer because we've discussed Weber's contract a ton over the years so I think I have a decent handle on it ( although won't say I'm 100% accurate).

Once Weber retires Nashville will be on the hook for most of his recapture. Any team that pays him more actual dollars than what his cap hit was will also get hit with a portion of it ( although nothing like Nashville will). If I remember right, basically if he retires at 38 we would be on the hook for something like 24-25 million in recapture penalties per season for 2 years.

Now here is where it fuzzy. There is a possibility that the recapture mess gets dealt with in the next labor agreement, or Nashville trades for him and sticks him on LTIR until his contract runs out. There has also been the thought that the NHL may not hold us too it, or may work with us on it because we technically didn't negotiate the deal. It was an offersheet done by Philly, so the only say we had was matching or losing him. Also it has been argued that we might be able to get them to work with us as well because in only one of his seasons with us did it actually keep us from going over the Salary Cap, so technically there was no actual cap savings gained.

It's gonna be messy, and something we will be forced to deal with when that time comes.

this is the last season that his salary is greater than his aav, so mtl won't be hit with the penalty right?

 

[sansabri]

I don't see why they should in this case, once you make one exception people will be expecting others. There was always the risk of them matching the offer going into the final year of a CBA when everyone knew the league hated these front loaded long contracts.

Preds' hands were tied. They weren't the ones who tried to cheat the CBA (that would be the Flyers).

 

[Philadelphia Ducks]

Preds' hands were tied. They weren't the ones who tried to cheat the CBA (that would be the Flyers).

How were they tied? No one forced them to match the sheet, they could have took the 4 1sts. So should franchises who match offer sheets be exempt from contract rules? Or is this the one case and no one else is allowed special treatment?

I should clarify that the recapture rule is lame and I don't think it should be a thing, but since it is it should be enforced.

 

[sansabri]

How were they tied? No one forced them to match the sheet, they could have took the 4 1sts. So should franchises who match offer sheets be exempt from contract rules? Or is this the one case and no one else is allowed special treatment?

I should clarify that the recapture rule is lame and I don't think it should be a thing, but since it is it should be enforced.

I mean, really? You blame the Preds for keeping their stud player over a bunch of picks? Yes, this is ONE case. Are there others you're familiar with? Hossa didn't get an offer-sheet. Nor did Luongo. Nor did Kovalchuk. All those cases are different.

 

[firstemperor]

Preds' hands were tied. They weren't the ones who tried to cheat the CBA (that would be the Flyers).

It's complicated to discuss whether the league will shrivel up and not hold them to the penalty. Especially since they ended up ditching the deal anyways.

They will either give the Preds a slap in the wrist of some sort.....maybe a smaller penalty equal to a smaller cap hit, losing a pick, losing an amnesty that might introduced in the new CBA, or other alternative/combination thereof.

Or maybe no penalty happens and they argue he should be on LTIR for those last few years.

 

[ole ole]

He's not an elite defenceman anymore, and he isn't worth one of Marner or Nylander in my eyes. Try selling him elsewhere. He's not a good skater and won't age well. I want nothing to do with that contract, he is getting paid on prior production. Unlike your gm, hopefully our's isn't stupid enough to trade a player entering his prime from one exiting his.

So now Weber isn't even worth a 4th line forward. What a joke.

 

[Igor Shestyorkin]

So now Weber isn't even worth a 4th line forward. What a joke.

But he never listed a 4th line forward in his post?

 

[ole ole]

But he never listed a 4th line forward in his post?

1. Toronto Maple Leafs

Record: 5-1-0
Week 1 ranking: No. 1

No need to worry about a sophomore slump for Auston Matthews. But the Leafs were so young last season, someone was bound to regress. Right now it's Mitch Marner, who was demoted to the FOURTH LINEafter posting a minus-6 through his first five games.

 

[Liferleafer]

So now Weber isn't even worth a 4th line forward. What a joke.

Dude....his contract is shit....it would prevent us from signing one of the kids. So, tbe deal for Toronto becomes Weber in....whatever insane package Habs fans think he's worth AND one of the kids out....you still wonder why we say no?

 

[Liferleafer]

1. Toronto Maple Leafs

Record: 5-1-0
Week 1 ranking: No. 1

No need to worry about a sophomore slump for Auston Matthews. But the Leafs were so young last season, someone was bound to regress. Right now it's Mitch Marner, who was demoted to the FOURTH LINEafter posting a minus-6 through his first five games.

Excellent! By this logic Hainsey's play and icetime means he's a top pair D....no need for Weber!

 

[Philadelphia Ducks]

I mean, really? You blame the Preds for keeping their stud player over a bunch of picks? Yes, this is ONE case. Are there others you're familiar with? Hossa didn't get an offer-sheet. Nor did Luongo. Nor did Kovalchuk. All those cases are different.

I'm just saying they willing kept a player that signed an offer sheet in the last year of a CBA, they shouldn't get special treatment just because it was an offer sheet. They were at equal risk of being screwed as Philly was for offering it to them.

 

[Philadelphia Ducks]

So now Weber isn't even worth a 4th line forward. What a joke.

Marner is as much a 4th liner as Galchenyuk is. And everyone knows neither of them are.

 

[Armourboy]

My

It's complicated to discuss whether the league will shrivel up and not hold them to the penalty. Especially since they ended up ditching the deal anyways.

They will either give the Preds a slap in the wrist of some sort.....maybe a smaller penalty equal to a smaller cap hit, losing a pick, losing an amnesty that might introduced in the new CBA, or other alternative/combination thereof.

Or maybe no penalty happens and they argue he should be on LTIR for those last few years.

My guess is they either allow us to put him on LTIR, come out and say that we will only pay on the one year it kept us from exceeding the cap, or work out a deal where it is broken up over a longer period.

The reasoning will basically be that it was an offer sheet, not a contract negotiated by the Preds, and it only saved us from going over the cap one season. The real reason will probably be that the last thing Betteman is going to do is watch one of his success stories of expansion into non-traditional market go down the tubes due to one contract.

Could be wrong, but I don't think so.

 

[lifelonghockeyfan]

So now Weber isn't even worth a 4th line forward. What a joke.

Sorry if you don't understand the salary cap and why the Leafs just can't handle a 7m addition to their cap this year and next year.

 

[McVespa99]

I disagree about him not being a top 20 anymore. Also, Babcock clearly stated he would take him on his team, hence the thread!

Ask Babs the same question in 2 or 3 years

 

[bleuetbio]

Knowing the dman market, Im pretty sure Weber can reach a someone valuable like Marner and even better. Im not sure if somes here want to troll or they are realy serious.

 

[kb]

As a Leaf fan, I would give Bracco, JVR, Carrick and a pick if you included McCarron and 1 million was retained.

 

[sansabri]

As a Leaf fan, I would give Bracco, JVR, Carrick and a pick if you included McCarron and 1 million was retained.

Take out Bracco, JVR, Carrick and that pick and we'll keep both our guys.

 

[jasonleaffan]

Habs don't need a full rebuild. They need a retool.

The Leafs wouldn't be able to afford him, anyway.

If the Habs were willing to retain a decent amount I'd be interested.

As to the first part, I like Montreal just the way they are.

 

[jasonleaffan]

If Montreal is seriously looking to rebuild, I'd rather we trade our assets and one of Marner/Nylander on Price. By the time Montreal is ready to compete again, he'll probably be around 35 years old.

 

[sansabri]

If the Habs were willing to retain a decent amount I'd be interested.

As to the first part, I like Montreal just the way they are.

Not trading Weber within the division unless the Leafs are offering the moon.

 

[96]

1. Toronto Maple Leafs

Record: 5-1-0
Week 1 ranking: No. 1

No need to worry about a sophomore slump for Auston Matthews. But the Leafs were so young last season, someone was bound to regress. Right now it's Mitch Marner, who was demoted to the FOURTH LINEafter posting a minus-6 through his first five games.

You go to every thread and say Marner is a fourth liner. He would be your team's best player.