SEMIN: Unjust victim of a systematic process of intimidation, manipulation, and scape

[Sens1Canes2]

I don't understand the question Sens......

An example of someone who the media coddles because the player is good natured, friendly with the media, etc., despite horrible play.

WTF, Jay Harrison doesn't count. He's a 6/7 d-man. Semin makes $7 mil and is supposed to be a star. If Harrison isn't healthy scratched it's a miracle. He's supposed to suck (in the way that an NHL player can actually "suck").

 

[What the Faulk]

Justin Faulk.

 

[Sens1Canes2]

Justin Faulk.

I tried to tell anyone who would listen that Faulk wasn't even close to deserving a Team USA spot last year, and then got yelled at when he only played one (I think one?) game and I said that was one too many.

I've never been too enamoured with him. A good #3 I think. Which is fine. But he played well in stretches early on and all of the sudden, people went crazy for him.

As far as "coddling" - I don't see it? But obviously you disagree.

 

[bluedevil58*]

gifs are nice and sometimes funny but injustices, particularly carried out against quiet undeserving people tend to rub good people in the wrong way and angers some. especially when that person is unable to defend themselves. it's a cowardly, self serving thing to do IME. just flat out wrong.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Right or wrong, younger guys tend to get a longer leash for the most part with the media and fans (across the league, not just here). Almost like they expect them to have ups and downs, inconsistencies as it's assumed it's all part of the learning and development process.

Veterans and guys who have been in the league for 10+ years don't get the same rope. Is it fair? I can see both sides of it. Young or not, you deserve to be critiqued for your on ice performance, plain and simple. On the flipside, it's easier to forgive mistakes by a 22 year old and chalk it up to development than for a 30 year old vet who has 10+ years in the league.

 

[Joe McGrath]

Right now I'm picturing Khudobin translating Twitter comments from those who shall not be named to Semin in a modernized version of the newspaper scene in the bar in Slap Shot with Denis Lemiuex and Jean-Guy Drouin. Because what is Hurricanes hockey if not a slightly satirical but mostly true to life comedy?

 

[My Special Purpose]

An example of someone who the media coddles because the player is good natured, friendly with the media, etc., despite horrible play.

WTF, Jay Harrison doesn't count. He's a 6/7 d-man. Semin makes $7 mil and is supposed to be a star. If Harrison isn't healthy scratched it's a miracle. He's supposed to suck (in the way that an NHL player can actually "suck").

CAM WARD, for heaven's sake. The guy has sucked for years and *nobody* has ever questioned his work ethic publicly, despite the fact that it's pretty obviously a factor.

Granted, Cam is basically the reason we're "The Whalers Who Lucked Into a Cup" and not "The Whalers," but that was eight years ago. What has he done since then to justify $6.5 million per season? Why isn't he the whipping boy he so clearly should be (and *would* be if he played anywhere else)?

 

[What the Faulk]

Jordan Staal is a 6M player that has built his Carolina career on advanced stats.

 

[Joe McGrath]

Jordan Staal is a 6M player that has built his Carolina career on advanced stats.

Semin is a 7M player that has built his Carolina career on advanced stats?

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

eric staal is an $8 million a year player.

 

[Sens1Canes2]

eric staal is an $8 million a year player.

Thought it was $9?

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Jordan Staal is a 6M player that has built his Carolina career on advanced stats.

Wouldn't you say expectations (right or wrong) come into play? Realistically, Jordan is expected to score ~50 points and play a strong 2-way game. If he scores 40, it's disappointing, but not that far out of peoples expectations because they know he doesn't have the hands/scoring skill to be a 70+ point player (no matter what JR said).

Guys like Semin, Eric, etc... have shown they can score 80 points and dominate a game, so when they don't come close, intangibles get questioned because people have a tough time grasping why a guy that talented can't score or dominate games on a more regular basis. For Staal, it's effort and leadership that people (mainly fans) constantly question. For Semin, it's character and effort that people question, etc...

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

Thought it was $9?

$10million

 

[Joe McGrath]

CAM WARD, for heaven's sake. The guy has sucked for years and *nobody* has ever questioned his work ethic publicly, despite the fact that it's pretty obviously a factor.

Granted, Cam is basically the reason we're "The Whalers Who Lucked Into a Cup" and not "The Whalers," but that was eight years ago. What has he done since then to justify $6.5 million per season? Why isn't he the whipping boy he so clearly should be (and *would* be if he played anywhere else)?

Curious what makes it obvious work ethic is Cam's issue? He's horrifically bad, don't get me wrong.

 

[the halleJOKEL]

the main issue was the fact that the team is bad and has been getting continuously worse since 2006

you cant "i put the team on my back dude" in hockey like you can in other sports, at least, not at the nhl level. you do need some support or to be sidney crosby

 

[nobuddy]

$10million

30 million

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Yes..and when the team is bad / without talent, every single error on the ice gets magnified and over analyzed.

 

[What the Faulk]

Semin is a 7M player that has built his Carolina career on advanced stats?

Wouldn't you say expectations (right or wrong) come into play? Realistically, Jordan is expected to score ~50 points and play a strong 2-way game. If he scores 40, it's disappointing, but not that far out of peoples expectations because they know he doesn't have the hands/scoring skill to be a 70+ point player (no matter what JR said).

Guys like Semin, Eric, etc... have shown they can score 80 points and dominate a game, so when they don't come close, intangibles get questioned because people have a tough time grasping why a guy that talented can't score or dominate games on a more regular basis. For Staal, it's effort and leadership that people (mainly fans) constantly question. For Semin, it's character and effort that people question, etc...

Justin Williams had been a 30-goal scorer at one time too. Now he makes his living as a strong two-way player. Expectations change as players get older. Those who can't adapt have an abrupt end to their careers in their early 30s.

Jordan Staal has barely reached 40 points in a season here while yielding slightly fewer 5v5 attempts against/60 and goals against/60 than Semin. Is he really earning that 1 million difference? Has it been enough to basically shield Staal from criticism while constantly harping on Semin on/off the ice? I don't think so.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Justin Williams had been a 30-goal scorer at one time too. Now he makes his living as a strong two-way player. Expectations change as players get older. Those who can't adapt have an abrupt end to their careers in their early 30s.

Yes, expectations can change, but that's not really relevant here. Regardless of what he was in Carolina, Justin Williams wasn't signed to be a 30G scorer in LA, nor was it expected of him. If he was, they would have paid him more than the $3.5M contract he is on.

Again, right or wrong, Semin was brought in here and paid $7M to be a first line scoring threat, and that set expectations (fans and media). To now say that he's older so we are going to get 40-50 points and strong 2-way game is very inconsistent with why he was brought in.

 

[What the Faulk]

Okay, but Semin hasn't scored more than 30 since 2009-10, before Jeff Skinner was even drafted. Hell, Skinner has done it almost as much as Semin has in their respective careers. Meanwhile, Carolina Semin is assisting on more goals per 60 minutes than Washington Semin was.

You're not allowed to arbitrarily set your own high expectations then get upset when someone fails to meet them.

 

[Joe McGrath]

Anyone know if insurance is going to kick in for Jordan? I was reading something on Horton that says his contract for games missed gets covered by insurance once he misses 21 games. Just kind of wondering. Would make up some of the losses for the tea when they have 6k fans on a Tuesday in January.

 

[What the Faulk]

Oh, by the way, here's Semin compared to every other 7M+ cap hit forward in the NHL in various categories since 2012. He's very middle of the road.

 

[Joe McGrath]

Oh, by the way, here's Semin compared to every other 7M+ cap hit forward in the NHL in various categories since 2012. He's very middle of the road.

What does that show? I honestly just have no idea. Is the Y axis showing he misses the net more than anyone not named Ovechkin?

 

[What the Faulk]

Just compare the different attributes on their own. He misses the net a lot but his goal total is still average. Decently high number of first assists, and is on the ice for an above average number of goals for.

Like I said, his production is not out of line for his salary bracket.

 

[Joe McGrath]

These are the players whose salary this season is within .5 mil of Semin.

Kopitar
Bergeron
Zetterberg
Sedin x2
Marleau
Thornton
Stasny
Backstrom
Toews
Kane

That's his pay grade. That's where expectations come from.