Proposal: Rumours and Proposals Thread III: Insert clever title here
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McShogun99
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That's a huge or price to pay but I doubt Toronto trades the pick. They haven't picked 1st OA in years and Matthews will be the poster boy for the city and new regime.-
McDrai
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- Mar 29, 2009
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Well they supposedly really like Tkachuk who is Marner's linemate and they have the need for a #1 C
Aceboogie
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- Aug 25, 2012
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No by me. I dont see OEL as being a franchise #1 D. The only deal id do 4th overall + Drasaitl for is like Karlsson or Doughty. Drasaitl is looking like a future Kopitar/Thornton clone. I dont want to overvalue 4th overall, because its not a guarantee, but 4th overall could be a dominant 1st liner or even just good 1st line player
Thats a lot to give up for OEL
TBH id want Rielly coming back from Toronto and have Arizona give Toronto something very nice.
But that trade would never happen. Thats 3 franchises trading 3 near untouchable pieces
Stud Muffin
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CaptainSexyPants
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- Sep 27, 2012
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Kind of an interesting one just for the sake of shootin' the ****..
If I were playing GM of all 3 teams, I'd accept as Toronto and decline as the other two.
They would be getting Draisaitl+Tkachuk for Matthews in this scenario. Quite frankly, the Oilers are giving up the most value here.
OEL is the best player by far but only has 3 years left on his deal and the difference between Matthews and Draisaitl is most certainly not Tkachuk, not even close really. Still don't see Toronto doing the deal though.
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Aceboogie
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I think there is probably only ever 1 or 2 times in recent history where junior linemates have brought together in first 3 years after draft to play together in NHL. Its a very, very, very rare occurrence and more of a GM pipe dream and HF fantasy then anything. I honestly cant even think of an example but ive seen a thread around this idea and its very rare
Toronto is not parting ways with a top 3 prospect since Crosby to unite linemates. Matthews is that dominant 1c ala Kopitar/Toews.
If anything theyd unite Dvorak and Marner as Dvorak would probably only go for Gardiner or something
Toronto is not parting ways with a top 3 prospect since Crosby to unite linemates. Matthews is that dominant 1c ala Kopitar/Toews.
If anything theyd unite Dvorak and Marner as Dvorak would probably only go for Gardiner or something
Raab
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- Oct 6, 2007
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Except that Davidson isn't close to the same value as Murphy right now. As players I could see the argument being made that Davidson might be better then Murphy. But as far as trade value Murphy undoubtedly has a lot more then Davidson. Honestly I'd be surprised if we could get a 3rd for Davidson given what he's shown and his age. Connor Murphy I think easily fetches a mid 1st rounder in this years draft. A top 10 pick is a stretch I think so Coyotes fans were overvaluing him a bit.
If Davidson can some out next season and play great the whole season then his value will go up. Right now he really has only maybe 30 games where he's looked like a good top 4 dman. His first 20 or so were kind of an adventure. You could see why the Oilers didn't want to send him through waivers but he was still trying to put it together.
A closer example from our team would be someone like Klefbom. I think as a player he has much higher upside then Murphy, but once you take his injuries into account it lessens his value. Would you deal him for the 7th overall?
ChaoticOrange
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^Murphy is not even close to the defenceman that Klefbom is. Murphy looked okay (still put up trash possession numbers) next to a top 10 defenceman for a short stretch. He's closer to Davidson than he is Klefbom.
Arguing this Murphy vs Klef/Davidson stuff is silly. Klefbom and Davidson both have really small samples of what they can do. I'm not even convinced yet that Davidson is a permanent fixture on this team. Murphy definitely isn't worth the #4 though.
Aceboogie
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Klefbom is less games has shown considerable more upside in both offense and defense. I wouldnt say this example works because Klefbom has shown elite potential, Murphy has been good by nothing exceptional. Over 180 games he looks like a career #4 D. Klefboms numbers (albeit small sample size) are comparable to some elite D, his possession numbers and ES scoring rates are tremendous. I would compare him to say Seth Jones, like id compare Davidson to Murphy. Klefbom has better metrics than Jones, but in less games. So hell have to play more at that level to pass him. And same argument for Davidson. Played better for 51 games, but small sample size
A almost perfect example for Murphy would be Smid of the past. Smid was similar pick, similar style and similar numbers first 180 games in league. By year 4 or mid way through he was playing a ton of minutes on Oilers, similar to Murphy on Arizona. There is no way Smid in his 4th year would be worth a top 10 pick. I would Murphy firmly between Davidson and Klefbom and right on par with what Smid was
Murphy has well below average offense and defensively he is good, but not exceptional. These type of D flatline around a good #4 or #3. Guys like Vlasic or Hjmarlsson are exception because of tremendous defensive ability, something Murphy hasnt shown.
Klefbom is made of glass, and Davidson has played 20 good games. Lets not get crazy in our values.
That said the main boards are getting ridiculous with the overvaluing of defenseman
Michael Stone or Connor Murphy > 4th OA
Seth Jones > RNH + 4th OA
That said the main boards are getting ridiculous with the overvaluing of defenseman
Michael Stone or Connor Murphy > 4th OA
Seth Jones > RNH + 4th OA
This nonsense needs to be called out every time.
Klefbom has no reoccuring injuries. He got a broken finger and then developed a staff infection. Nobody is predisposed to these injuries.
Draiskull
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- Oct 26, 2005
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"Sept 2/11: Swedish Oil: Klefbom was unlucky enough to get cut on his thigh by an ice skate, the wound was sewn with ten stitches, and when the stitches were removed there was an infection. Now Klefbom is on penicillin which also prohibits him from playing.
Nov 14/11: Sami Hoffrén: Klefbom was hit to the head by a Russian forward and he had to leave the game. Didn’t play in the tournament after that hit. I assume Klefbom suffered a concussion.
Oct 9/12: he lost his season to a shoulder injury. Oscar Klefbom: “It happened on Oct. 9 playing against Vaxjo,†Klefbom said. “I dumped the puck in the offensive zone and I got a small hit from behind and I lost my balance and I flew into the boards. I had to catch myself with my left arm. Afterwards, I couldn’t feel my arm, it was like a dead arm. I didn’t know what happened.â€
Sept 12/13: Oilers announce they are following concussion protocol after Klefbom is injured in the U of A game.
2013-14: He spent various portions of the season out of the lineup with injury. "
http://thehockeywriters.com/what-should-the-edmonton-oilers-do-with-oscar-klefbom/
Some people are just injury prone. 10 stitches turning into infection, cut on foot turns into staph infection. A small hit turns into shoulder injury. so on and so forth.
A couple concussions already as well.
Aceboogie
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Andrei Markov was made of glass in 2011. he played 45,7,13,48 games from 2009-2013. Since then hes played 81, 81, 82 games. How did that magic happen?
The "injury prone" narrative needs to die and be buried 20 feet under the deepest part of the ocean. Unless a player as a recurring injury like a degenerative back, concussion, or other injury, a player is not any more injury prone than another. They may have a unlucky span of 3 years, but itll all normalize after that
Taylor Hall had injury prone label, seems like after being the only full time healthy forward this year that narrative got removed and applied to Klefbom. Maybe Klefbom will find the Fountain of Health that Hall, Markov and every other player found
Brouwer interested in signing with Canucks:
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/...-louis-blues-sign-hometown-vancouver-canucks/
Friedman also reporting that Backes wants more than $6 mil per year
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/...-louis-blues-sign-hometown-vancouver-canucks/
Friedman also reporting that Backes wants more than $6 mil per year
Aceboogie
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Perfect, perfect, perfect
30 year old career 3rd line player coming off a super hot playoffs. Sounds like Bickell 2.0 Even if hes added for 3 mil hes still a relative non factor as a ok 3rd line guy. Just so much risk to signing him, limited upside
Benning may be our hero this offseason by jumping infront of potential Lucic and Brouwer bullets. Much like Nonis did with Clarkson for MacT
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Faelko
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- Aug 11, 2002
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Boo!!!
I wondered if the Oilers would think about bringing him in to replace a guy like Yak should he get moved.
Edit. After seeing his salary, I changed my mind.
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joestevens29
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- Apr 30, 2009
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Not sure how much stock I put into what a player says about his hometown city on local radio. Finishes up with an out
"[It would] definitely be a great experience to play for the hometown team and see what it's like, but I don't know what the Canucks' plans are."
As for Backes, it's not going to be horrid unless you give him max term. Not going to be great in 3-4 years, but by then who knows what could happen.
Jumptheshark
Rebooting myself
as the head of the Klefbom fan club--he keeps getting injured and it is never the same injury twice in a row
He missed 52 games this year
something like 16 games last year
20+ games the year before
and he was injured nearly his entire last year in Sweden
Jet Walters
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- May 15, 2013
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Brouwer would be an excellent 3rd wheel with Hall/Drai or on McDavid or RNH's wing. Him being open to Vancouver most likely means he'd consider Edmonton as well.
The new arena is going to have an effect on the UFA market this summer. I think it might have played a part in Caggiula's decision to sign here already.
On a side note, if the Canucks add a Lucic/Brouwer/Eriksson and draft Dubois, I'm a little concerned down the line for the Oilers if they meet them in the playoffs. Guys like Horvat/Dubois/Virtanen are built for the postseason and they may prove to be a handful for a skilled team. Although I'm sure we'll be Chiarellinized by that point anyways.
Aceboogie
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I know people were discussing Chiasson before and saying how his numbers compared to Korpioski, but I want to circle back around to him
He is 25, has size, and super cheap. He is a 35-40 point depth winger. But I have interest in him because his underlying numbers were WAY down this year
If you do not like analytics, stop reading here
Chiasson had IPP of 40 this year, which is disgustingly low. That ranks him lowest on Sens team for forwards and 347 out of 352 for regular NHL forwards. 6th worse in NHL, thats crazy. His IPP in years past was 64 and 77, so around NHL average.
Basically what that is saying is 40% of time a goal is scored with him on ice, he gets a point. 75% is NHL average. IPP bounces around like shooting % and can really impact how many points you get. It is as much luck as shooting % is
Chaisson also shot a career low 5%.
Hes been around a career 48% possession player, that took a hit this year too. Although that is more indication play slipped, vs bad luck
If I was looking to bring in a depth winger for dirt cheap, Chiasson looks like a good candidate. His numbers look alot like Maroons on the Ducks this year, had down years in shooting %, IPP, Possession and came dirt cheap. Saw his numbers rebound here
TBH id rather have Chiasson at 1.5 mil (traded for a 7th round pick) vs Brouwer at 4.5 mill
He is 25, has size, and super cheap. He is a 35-40 point depth winger. But I have interest in him because his underlying numbers were WAY down this year
If you do not like analytics, stop reading here
Chiasson had IPP of 40 this year, which is disgustingly low. That ranks him lowest on Sens team for forwards and 347 out of 352 for regular NHL forwards. 6th worse in NHL, thats crazy. His IPP in years past was 64 and 77, so around NHL average.
Basically what that is saying is 40% of time a goal is scored with him on ice, he gets a point. 75% is NHL average. IPP bounces around like shooting % and can really impact how many points you get. It is as much luck as shooting % is
Chaisson also shot a career low 5%.
Hes been around a career 48% possession player, that took a hit this year too. Although that is more indication play slipped, vs bad luck
If I was looking to bring in a depth winger for dirt cheap, Chiasson looks like a good candidate. His numbers look alot like Maroons on the Ducks this year, had down years in shooting %, IPP, Possession and came dirt cheap. Saw his numbers rebound here
TBH id rather have Chiasson at 1.5 mil (traded for a 7th round pick) vs Brouwer at 4.5 mill
Aceboogie
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- Aug 25, 2012
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Brouwer would be an excellent 3rd wheel with Hall/Drai or on McDavid or RNH's wing. Him being open to Vancouver most likely means he'd consider Edmonton as well.
The new arena is going to have an effect on the UFA market this summer. I think it might have played a part in Caggiula's decision to sign here already.
On a side note, if the Canucks add a Lucic/Brouwer/Eriksson and draft Dubois, I'm a little concerned down the line for the Oilers if they meet them in the playoffs. Guys like Horvat/Dubois/Virtanen are built for the postseason and they may prove to be a handful for a skilled team. Although I'm sure we'll be Chiarellinized by that point anyways.
Lucic and Brouwer will be sipping Ensure and comparing hip replacements by the time Vancouver sniffs playoffs
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