Proposal: Rumours and Proposals Thread III: Insert clever title here

[Aceboogie]

He clearly is better than all those players. The only one of those who may be better would be Sekera, but not for much longer. Murphy is what we want Nurse to become.

What? Murphy had 17 points this year, was a brutal 45.7% possession player and ranked 96th for ES points by a D. So 2 things wrong with his a) Sekera is better, and by alot. Klefbom is better, and by alot. b) If this is what Nurse becomes, please trade him now for whatever because that is a mighty poor upside

For reference. Davidson is a 51.9% possession player and had 5 less ES points in 20 or less less games

 

[ChaoticOrange]

You were stating it like it was incontrovertible fact. You called it "ridiculousness" to think another way even. No chance you were presenting that as merely your opinion.

In any event, faux fact or opinion, it is nonsense nonetheless.

What? I said it was ridiculousness to think Murphy is worth 4th overall by himself. He's not even close to worth that.

Kind of like when you blithely stated that Murphy is 'several levels' above Davidson while providing no background or justification?

That's 'merely' your opinion, too. I at least said Davidson is a better possession player - which he is.

 

[Seachd]

Connor Murphy is fine, although I haven't seen anything out of him that indicates he's any better than Sekera, Petry or Klefbom. And I don't think he's in any way worth the 4th overall pick, personally.

 

[Aceboogie]

You were stating it like it was incontrovertible fact. You called it "ridiculousness" to think another way even. No chance you were presenting that as merely your opinion.

In any event, faux fact or opinion, it is nonsense nonetheless.

Any this was?

He clearly is better than all those players. The only one of those who may be better would be Sekera, but not for much longer. Murphy is what we want Nurse to become.

He is not clearly better, at least not by the numbers

 

[Mcnotloilersfan]

I thought it came out that Edmonton could still offersheet and give Boston 2018 2nd?

heres the link

http://www.stanleycupofchowder.com/2016/5/21/11730094/Boston-Bruins-Oilers-Offer-sheets-NHL-Free-Agency-Chiarelli-NHLPA

Maybe every year we will find a guy we like that we have to offer sheet and give up a 2nd and keeping annoying the hell out of Boston.

 

[Soundwave]

I think we should offer sheet Seth Jones.

 

[I am the Liquor]

Any this was?



He is not clearly better, at least not by the numbers

The "numbers"?

Pffft.

 

[Aceboogie]

The "numbers"?

Pffft.

Hahahahaha ok then. Give me a scouting report. How many games of Michael Stone did you watch this year? How many times did you key in on him? What does he do well? what does he do better than Davidson, Klefbom, Sekera?

I mean you claim he is clearly better, so you must have watched him a ton and have great insight into him to make such a claim.

 

[Spawn]

I think we should offer sheet Seth Jones.

But what happens if Columbus matches? The earliest you'd find out is July 7 if you actually had him or not (July 1 first day you can send the offer, BJs have a week to match). If you don't end up getting him you've very likely missed out on most other options to address the back end.

Offer sheet should be a last case scenario type thing once you've struck out on everything else.

 

[Soundwave]

But what happens if Columbus matches? The earliest you'd find out is July 7 if you actually had him or not (July 1 first day you can send the offer, BJs have a week to match). If you don't end up getting him you've very likely missed out on most other options to address the back end.

Offer sheet should be a last case scenario type thing once you've struck out on everything else.

I'd make a trade for Vatanen first, once we have him, then I'd push on Columbus with the threat of an offer sheet, they can take that or Nugent Hopkins. See if they panic and bite, Boston did last year but they just ended up trading Hamilton to the Flames.

The dirty little secret of the NHL is IMO a lot of these US teams do *not* want to be cap max teams because the ownership doesn't want to be paying that type of $$$, especially for non-playoff revenue teams like Columbus.

I pick Tkachuk at 4 I guess (though I do like Dubois a lot). His value is going to be sky high for a long time even if we decide to deal him later.

 

[Aceboogie]

But what happens if Columbus matches? The earliest you'd find out is July 7 if you actually had him or not (July 1 first day you can send the offer, BJs have a week to match). If you don't end up getting him you've very likely missed out on most other options to address the back end.

Offer sheet should be a last case scenario type thing once you've struck out on everything else.

I agree here too. Even tho OS compensation is a loer 1st likely. You still have to overpay big time for a player, and its still not a guarantee. 1st option would be to trade for them to get them for cheaper and 100% have them. If all else fails toss an OS at them. But like you said, thats JUly 7th. You need to know before then because of Demers/Yandle likely going off market before then

 

[I am the Liquor]

Hahahahaha ok then. Give me a scouting report. How many games of Michael Stone did you watch this year? How many times did you key in on him? What does he do well? what does he do better than Davidson, Klefbom, Sekera?

I mean you claim he is clearly better, so you must have watched him a ton and have great insight into him to make such a claim.

I was talking about Connor Murphy.

I've been playing and watching the game for over 40yrs. I don't need some dude and his algorithm's to tell me who is good at hockey and who isnt.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I was talking about Connor Murphy.

I've been playing and watching the game for over 40yrs. I don't need some dude and his algorithm's to tell me who is good at hockey and who isnt.

But do you know a thing or two about winning?

 

[Soundwave]

I'm honestly not that high on signing Demers.

If you sign him fine, but he's not going to sign without a long term commitment, and if you do that then basically

Demers-Sekera is a $10-$11 million dollar pairing not leaving a lot of money in the future for a real no.1.

We need to go after guys like Seth Jones or Tyson Barrie, higher end offensive d-men.

 

[Aceboogie]

I was talking about Connor Murphy.

I've been playing and watching the game for over 40yrs. I don't need some dude and his algorithm's to tell me who is good at hockey and who isnt.

Well that doesnt answer the question

Plenty people have watched hockey for 20+ years, why would I trust a guy on the LRT spewing off about how much Petry sucks. If someone isnt watching the game, coupled with fact average joe is in no way a exceptional scout of hockey, how reliable are those statements

In your opinion, Connor Murphy, a player you rarely see play, is clearly better than Sekera, Davidson and Klefbom. Thats all good, everyone has their opinion. Someone else's opinion can be the opposite, who are you to call them out, they have as much insight and credibility as you. The objective stats can speak too, just a matter if you chose to listen or not

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Stop the personal barbs guys.

 

[Spawn]

I'm honestly not that high on signing Demers.

If you sign him fine, but he's not going to sign without a long term commitment, and if you do that then basically

Demers-Sekera is a $10-$11 million dollar pairing not leaving a lot of money in the future for a real no.1.

We need to go after guys like Seth Jones or Tyson Barrie, higher end offensive d-men.

I mean... we need both.

The Oilers were the worst team in the league 5v5 defensively. You can't just get a Jones/Barrie and say problem solved. Neither of those players are particularly strong defensively.

 

[Aceboogie]

And who cares, he has the evidence and stats to back it up at bare minimum. I mean watch this, in my opinion Chris Pronger absolutely sucked and Corey Sarich was clearly a better D. Prove me wrong, I watch the games

Find me an objective poster who has watched over 30 games of each player. 1 from worst team in league, 1 from least covered team in the NHL. And if that person says he is clearly better, thatll have weight

Go look at any poll for 2011 on, half the polls that got locked for lopsidedness probably have the loser go on to have the better career. HF is clueless when it comes to multiple team player evaluation, so why put stock into it

And the end of the day, all this stemmed from ridiculous statement that they wouldnt take 4th overall for him. Which I am more than sure you can agree is delusional and he has nowhere near the value. So the example of Davidson was just that, an example. It shows how stupid that thinking is

 

[Raab]

And who cares, he has the evidence and stats to back it up at bare minimum. I mean watch this, in my opinion Chris Pronger absolutely sucked and Corey Sarich was clearly a better D. Prove me wrong, I watch the games

Find me an objective poster who has watched over 30 games of each player. 1 from worst team in league, 1 from least covered team in the NHL. And if that person says he is clearly better, thatll have weight

Go look at any poll for 2011 on, half the polls that got locked for lopsidedness probably have the loser go on to have the better career. HF is clueless when it comes to multiple team player evaluation, so why put stock into it

And the end of the day, all this stemmed from ridiculous statement that they wouldnt take 4th overall for him. Which I am more than sure you can agree is delusional and he has nowhere near the value. So the example of Davidson was just that, an example. It shows how stupid that thinking is

Connor Murphy is younger then Brandon Davidson by two years and has played 3 times more NHL games. Davidson MAY end up the better player but right now we have to small of sample size. On value alone Connor Murphy should have more because of age and experience. In two years that might change. Anyone saying Davidson has more value then Connor Murphy has their Oiler goggles on at this stage. In saying that neither one is worth a top 10 pick in this draft IMO.

 

[CupofOil]

Murphy clearly has more value than Davidson currently, lets not be silly here.

However, I don't think that Murphy is way better than Davidson, just more proven.
If Davidson continues to play as well as he did to close last season (I have my doubts) then he is every bit as good as Murphy, but the sample size is way too small.

 

[Aceboogie]

Connor Murphy is younger then Brandon Davidson by two years and has played 3 times more NHL games. Davidson MAY end up the better player but right now we have to small of sample size. On value alone Connor Murphy should have more because of age and experience. In two years that might change. Anyone saying Davidson has more value then Connor Murphy has their Oiler goggles on at this stage. In saying that neither one is worth a top 10 pick in this draft IMO.

Murphy is unquestionably more vlaueable for your reasons stated. But ill wholeheartedly disagree that Murphy has performed better in the NHL than Davidson. People can discuss age (valid point, but Davidson battled thru cancer, losing a development year), but performance wise Murphy has done nothing to clearly disguinish himself for Davidson (I put little stock in NHL GP, more about what you do in them), hes done well in NHL for longer. Thats the easiest thread to break when comparing players, because Davidson will almost certainly match him GP for GP for the next 10 years. Like is Hanifin comparable to Sekera? Sekera is more proven with 30 times the GP, but Hanifin has matched and probably outperformed Sekera in his first year. Do I have any doubt Hanifin will outperform him going on? no, evern with only a small sample size. Murphy has done absolutely nothing to warrant even a mid 1st round pick though.

Ill leave it at that. The example used that began all this was just used to drive hom how ridicilous Murphy for 4th was, and I believe it did its job. It wasnt even Murphy vs Davidson, it was Murphy for 4th vs Davidson for 7th.

Ironically. Murphy would be a good trade down target if we were to deal 4th for 7th + Murphy. So ill start that discussion now.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Murphy clearly has more value than Davidson currently, lets not be silly here.

However, I don't think that Murphy is way better than Davidson, just more proven.
If Davidson continues to play as well as he did to close last season (I have my doubts) then he is every bit as good as Murphy, but the sample size is way too small.

No one has said that Davidson is the better or more valuable player. What I take issue with is this Murphy is 'several levels' better than Davidson nonsense, and the opinion of a few Coyotes fans that Murphy is worth just as much if not more than 4th overall. My example was this is akin to Oiler fans turning down 7th overall for Davidson.

Murphy > Davidson - for now.
4th > 7th.

 

[CupofOil]

No one has said that Davidson is the better or more valuable player. What I take issue with is this Murphy is 'several levels' better than Davidson nonsense, and the opinion of a few Coyotes fans that Murphy is worth just as much if not more than 4th overall. My example was this is akin to Oiler fans turning down 7th overall for Davidson.

Murphy > Davidson - for now.
4th > 7th.

No argument with that.

I really pray that Davidson isn't a fluke. I was blown away with how much improvement he showed from the beginning of last season until his injury.
As an Oiler fan, I'm inclined to believe it was a fluke because..... Oilers.

 

[McDrai]

With rumors that Toronto might want the 4th overall, and also rumors that Arizona owners want(ed) Mathews, would you do this trade?

To Edmonton: OEL
To Toronto: 4th overall + Draisaitl
To Arizona: Matthews

 

[McShogun99]

I think we should offer sheet Seth Jones.

I don't think Columbus will be letting Jones go anytime soon considering they have up RyJo for him. I think that they will trade their 1st to get a #1 C.