Phanuthier said:
Profiles like that.....usually turn into checking forwards. Take all the checking forwards in the NHL right now and look back when they were prospects. U'd find the same thing. Darren McCarty ripped up junior for 50 goals in a year.
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Profiles like that.....usually turn into checking forwards. Take all the checking forwards in the NHL right now and look back when they were prospects. U'd find the same thing. Darren McCarty ripped up junior for 50 goals in a year.
... and that was also the profile for Jarome Iginla.RUSqueelin said:
On the flip side, there are many profiles of high-profile skilled players that turn into busts.
It's a two-way street.
I'm sure everybody knows this, but there's usually a threshold in NHL drafts which seperates the top end of the draft to the "middle of the pack" where the middle of the pack has guys who have warts in their game that keep them from top end. For Schremp, it was supposed attitude problems and lack of defense. For Chucko, it was playing at a lower level. Want more examples? Coliagano and size, Pelech and injuries.
When it gets to that point, scouts have to make a decision on what qualities they want and what qualities they think can be improved. In Chucko's case, it was taking a gamble on a raw player. In Schremp's case, it was that he was still young and maturing.
rigger
Registered User
Phanuthier said:
I would bet you that Schremp will come into edmonton next season and have a better point total then Iginla did in his rookie year. Jarome had 50 points, a very good rookie season. I think edmonton would be happy if Schremp ends the season with 50. But this is a thread about Chucko and Schremp. Here are my predictions, Schremp plays in edmonton next season and gets 50 + points, Chucko will be playing in the NCAA or AHL and put up close to 50 points in either league. NExt year will be the kicker here. Schremp will become a house hold name, a calder candidate. Chucko will be a decent player climaxing at a top 6 forward. But it is not at all certain it will even happen.
SCHREMP any day of the week.
If you had bothered to read the entire thread, I have already said that Schremp is a far more NHL ready player then Chucko is, and have pretty much said in 3/4 of my posts in this thead that Chucko is a raw player still developing.rigger said:
Sheesh.
Besides the fact that Chucko is a late developer, he is playing in a league that develops slower then the CHL, and on a team where you have to earn every inch you get. But, in the end, it usually pays off. See Chuck Kobasew, as a guy who had to learn the other side of the puck before he was given an oppertunity on the top 2 lines. He started off on the Flames as a 4th liner, learned the defensive side of the game and strengthened up. He followed the Stanley Cup run by lighting the AHL up at both ends of the ice, and the result now? He's the Flames 2nd top forward and playing on the No 1 line with Jarome Iginla.
Why do some of you keep comparing Chucko to smyth and morrow? Is he expected to score 30 goals or something?
Chucko=Next Adam Deadmarsh. Book on it, the Flames have got a very special player on their hands right now.
As far as I can tell, I don't think anyone has any expectations of him... yet. He could very well score 40+, who knows. Or 10.RallyKiller said:
The truth of the matter is, I don't think anybody really knows who to think about Chucko, because he is such a late bloomer. Not to mention a power forward, who generally take longer to develop (see: Iginla, Bertuzzi). The handi-cap on Chucko was that he was such a raw talent, and the Flames rolled the dice that with his physical build and his talent, his hard work and character (what the Flames draft for, see busts Tkaczuk to young up-and-coming guys like Kobasew and Phaneuf, and another very raw player, Matt Pelech) will translate to learning, which translates to improving, which hopefully translates into a solid NHL career.
nomorekids said:
I think the point is that they were drafted so close. Phaneuf and Syvret were drafted rounds apart.
Not be be a homer, but i pick Schremp, simply for his offensive potential.
nuck
Schrodingers Cat
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The two are in different time zones talent wise. Schremp has the potential to score 50 goals in the NHL. If his scoring doesn't pan out the rest of his game probably won't be enough to keep him there. Chucko has absolutely zero chance of being a star so you have to stick with the guy who can give you the home run. He doesn't have first line skills, except maybe in Phoenix but can still have a career if he doesn't make his upside. Not really a fair comparison. Schremp just needs to pick up a half a step in speed and ten pounds of muscle and he should be a solid pro next year.
Wow, zero chance. Sounds like nuck here is judge, jury and prosecution here. Zero. Definate nothing player.nuck said:
They said the same thing about Jarome Iginla too...
nuck
Schrodingers Cat
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Phanuthier said:
Allright never say a ZERO chance BUT Iggy was a CHL first team allstar 63 goals and 136 points. He was in the NHL as a 19 year old. I don't recall being thrilled at them getting him for Niewendyk but Jarome was in the middle of a huge season when the trade was made and had franchise player written all over him. Nobody was saying he wasn't a potential star.
Chucko wasn't even the best player on his team in tier two or college. You can pretend he is going to be a star but I can't get behind that. By his age most future NHLers were tearing up their College leagues or already in the pros. I certainly wish him luck.
Actually, no.nuck said:
In the papers the day after the Joe Nieuwendyk trade, the headline wrote "Jarome who?"
Iginla played in the WHL, Chucko in the NCAA. You can't even being to compare the two league.
Chucko wasn't the best player with Salmon Arm? While Zajac had more points, many Silverback fans feel that Chucko was more valuble to their team then Zajac. Either way, whoever was better, there is nothing wrong with comparing Chucko to a top prospect like Zajac at all. In Collage, totally different story... your playing on a roster that is much older team, with top prospects like Phil Kessel. In Minnisota, you have to earn every inch you get. Thats why the Goalden Gophers hockey program is so highly respected around hockey circles.
As for his development, I have said multiple times that power forwards take longer to develop then skilled forwards (in this case, compared to Robbie Schremp). And, once again, Iginla is a perfect example of this... thought to be a 3rd line grinder with 2nd line upside (20 goals).
You want to look at other top prospects, and their stats in the NCAA? Let's take another Goalden Gopher alumni,
Jeff Taffe http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php3?pid=00049573
20 points his first season. Hmm... sounds awfully familiar to Chucko's stats.
And, Chucko is a late bloomer, for a power forward.
Look, I'm not saying Chucko will be anything big, but I'm taking a wait and see attitude. Your comment that he has zero chance to be a scorer is absolutely rediculous; how can you possibly give a ceiling on a prospects potential when he has
a) the physical tools
b) has shown the skills (see: prospect talent reports)
c) showed continuous improvement
d) is being developed in one of the top development programs in the country
e) shown the positive attitude of both (c) and (d) for his development
What an absurd post to already say that he has no offensive potential. If you want to say something like that, say it about Eric Nystrom who was drafted to be a "character forward." But every single talent scout report of Kris Chucko has him out to be a power forward player.
Phanuthier said:
At least we can agree on this. The CHL is known for producing the best NHL prospects year in year out. The NCAA isn't. It's a strong league and more physically mature but just doesn't have the talent that the CHL does.
One might simply ask one question. Would you prefer a good solid grinder type from a league which produces (relatively) few NHL stars - or the top scorer from the league that produces *by far* the most and the best NHL players?
I think this was a dumb thread to begin with, though. Chucko may yet prove a good solid player in the NHL but it's not fair to compare him with Schremp at this juncture. Two different players.
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CantHaveTkachev
Legends
Iginla was slated as a 3rd liner? I doubt it...Phanuthier said:
the guy scored 63 goals in 63 games in the more physical and defensive WHL and was picked 11th overall...
not exactly 3rd line draft position or 3rd line Junior numbers
Many reasonsthomasincanada said:
a) an education. Chucko is pursuing a business degree.
b) different development system. In the NCAA, you don't play as many games, and there is more emphasis on practise then game after game. In the NCAA, you play against more mature players - physically, development wise, ect - and in the NCAA, they focus more on overall development then the CHL.
Last paragraph... how true, I don't know why more people don't catch onto this. Schremp is a very talented player who is lighting up the OHL and is looking pretty hot right now. Chucko is a a player still scratching the surface of his potential, and still improving, or a work-in-progress player. You want to compare the two players? Ask me in 4 years.
Funny, a couple years ago, the Oilers drafted a very talented player from the CHL, while the Flames drafted a NCAA sniper from the BCHL - Hemsky and Kobasew. 4 years later, I have to say I'd rather have Kobasew then Hemsky.
When drafted, Iginla had 33 goals in 72 games. He was behind Darcy Tucker (64G), Hnat Domechelli (52G), Shane Doan (37G), Tyson Nash (34G) and 1 ahead of Ashley Buckberger (32G). He was 7th in team scoring.e-townchamps said:
And, drafted 11th overall.
Hey, you want to know another 3rd liner drafted 11th overall? Eric Nystrom.
Point is that Iginla was drafted as a raw power forward, much like Chucko. And like Iginla, Chucko's skating was thought to be poor and needed improvement, and now Iginla is one of the best skaters in the league.
Point is that you can't judge a power forward, or a raw power forward like Chucko, this early. I'm not taking anything away from Schremp, who might look more impressive now, but I personally have no regrets about taking Chucko right now either.
Your call. I browse the Oilers forum from time to time, and see your kin constantly frustrated with how inconsistant Hemsky is. He'll go hard one night, and dissapear the next.Tikk said:
Hemsky may have more points, but he plays in a far more offensive system then Kobasew.
I'd personally have Kobasew, who shows up every night to play, and creates tons of chances with his speed and physical play, then an inconsistant Hemsky. Just like I'd rather have a consistant Craig Conroy then an inconsistant Cory Stillman. He plays the PP as well as the PK, and is on the ice in all important situations.
And the bottum line... Kobasew is the Flames 2nd best forward and most consistant forward on the team, leading the Flames tied for the division lead. Hemsky? Helping his team barely hold down a playoff spot.
Next!
PS: Kobasew has 9 goals to Hemsky's 5.
WRONG.
You'd rather have Koba-who because you're a Flames fan!
I'd rather have Hemsky because I'm an Oilers fan, AND because he's better.
End of story.
I also love these ridiculous homeristic comparisons.
"I'd rather have Chucko than Schremp because who wouldn't rather have Iginla to Savard?" and now this new "Conroy/Stillman" BS.
How biased can you get? Flames fans put the capital "H" in "Homer"!
You'd rather have Koba-who because you're a Flames fan!
I'd rather have Hemsky because I'm an Oilers fan, AND because he's better.
End of story.
I also love these ridiculous homeristic comparisons.
"I'd rather have Chucko than Schremp because who wouldn't rather have Iginla to Savard?" and now this new "Conroy/Stillman" BS.
How biased can you get? Flames fans put the capital "H" in "Homer"!
Phanuthier said:Wow, you sure showed me.
What was there to "show" in the first place?
You just destroyed any argument you had when you called Hemsky "inconsistant" despite having almost twice as many points as Koba-who in the same number of games.
Nice one!
Chris Chucky, has The SEdins skating abilities without the hands. Wow. you call this guy a scoring foward, and he does not even have skill. You say hes a checking foward and hes not even fast enough.
You say he "drives" to the net, and that was at the BCHL level.
good pick Calgary.
You say he "drives" to the net, and that was at the BCHL level.
good pick Calgary.
AgentNaslund said:
Great post. You clearly have no idea about Chucko. On a positive note for Chucko. Their is a good blurb about him on his team's webpage about how last game Chucko took over in the 3rd period and controlled the game for the win. He scored a SH goal and the winner as well.
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