RD Timothy Liljegren - Ex-Rogle BK, SHL (2017, 17th, TOR) III

[LeafChief]

It's so salty in here.

 

[4thline]

Has he?

6 points in his last 20 games.

That is very close to the production he's had in the SHL the last 2 seasons (5 points in 19 games).

He's still young and he's had to transition to small ice, but nonetheless I can't help but feel his progress is pretty stagnant.

Short Answer: Yes.

Long Answer: Yes, his play in the AHL has largely dispelled the qualitative concerns that were the reason for his fall, namely defensive play and decision making with the puck. Additionally, arbitrarily snipping off 1/3rd of his season because it doesn't fit the spin your going for fools no one.

 

[AppsSyl]

Has he?

6 points in his last 20 games.

That is very close to the production he's had in the SHL the last 2 seasons (5 points in 19 games).

He's still young and he's had to transition to small ice, but nonetheless I can't help but feel his progress is pretty stagnant.

Please tell me, how many Marlies games have you watched this season?

 

[DatSnipeMatthews]

Has he?

6 points in his last 20 games.

That is very close to the production he's had in the SHL the last 2 seasons (5 points in 19 games).

He's still young and he's had to transition to small ice, but nonetheless I can't help but feel his progress is pretty stagnant.

Yeah, Timmy has stagnated a bit forsure. No question about that. And he's had some serious mental lapses in the D zone, but pre-draft hockey IQ concerns were WAY overblown. I don't believe the hype that he has top pairing potential written all over him but he also has big time NHL top 4 potential.

I see him as a staple in our future top-4 RHD, but I don't expect to see him as a top 4D until around 22. And you know what, that's a solid player for #17.

 

[AppsSyl]

Yeah, Timmy has stagnated a bit forsure. No question about that. And he's had some serious mental lapses in the D zone, but pre-draft hockey IQ concerns were WAY overblown. I don't believe the hype that he has top pairing potential written all over him but he also has big time NHL top 4 potential.

I see him as a staple in our future top-4 RHD, but I don't expect to see him as a top 4D until around 22. And you know what, that's a solid player for #17.

Please explain how he has stagnated other than staring at a scoresheet, and saying 6 points in 20 games. He has come leaps and bounds defensively and is continually improving his two-way play.

 

[DatSnipeMatthews]

Please explain how he has stagnated other than staring at a scoresheet, and saying 6 points in 20 games. He has come leaps and bounds defensively and is continually improving his two-way play.

He has stagnated in terms of some wild expectations by Leafs fans at the start of the year (e.g. he should have gone top 5).

In terms of actual play, he has been much, much better from inside the red line in than I expected. But he has also put up less points, especially 5v5 points, than I expected.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Additionally, arbitrarily snipping off 1/3rd of his season because it doesn't fit the spin your going for fools no one.

I don't think it's arbitrary. The last 3 seasons he has about 60 games in pro leagues at ~0,25-0,30PPG. He has 10 games at 0,60PPG. Statistically, it looks a lot like his hot start to this season was an outlier.

Please tell me, how many Marlies games have you watched this season?

I'm not really arguing that he's playing bad. For all I know maybe he's turning into Drew Doughty defensively. I doubt it based on what I've seen (highlights and the WJC), but regardless; offensive numbers is and always will be a big part of how Liljegren is measured. Concerns at the draft had a lot to do with how his offensive numbers had stagnated and even regressed to some extent. Leafs fans were happy enough to shout out his offensive numbers from the rooftops after his first 5-10 games, but now suddenly numbers don't matter? I don't buy it.

 

[Pyromaniac]

I don't think it's arbitrary. The last 3 seasons he has about 60 games in pro leagues at ~0,25-0,30PPG. He has 10 games at 0,60PPG. Statistically, it looks a lot like his hot start to this season was an outlier.


I'm not really arguing that he's playing bad. For all I know maybe he's turning into Drew Doughty defensively. I doubt it based on what I've seen (highlights and the WJC), but regardless; offensive numbers is and always will be a big part of how Liljegren is measured. Concerns at the draft had a lot to do with how his offensive numbers had stagnated and even regressed to some extent. Leafs fans were happy enough to shout out his offensive numbers from the rooftops after his first 5-10 games, but now suddenly numbers don't matter? I don't buy it.

Lmao this guy is so salty.

"If I cherry pick this and omit that then I can somehow arrive at narrative that I am trying to push."

 

[Pavels Dog]

Lmao this guy is so salty.

"If I cherry pick this and omit that then I can somehow arrive at narrative that I am trying to push."

Eh sure. "salty" is the most overused word on the site. 12 points in 30 games is hardly impressive either or enough to say he has dispelled all concerns about him. The thing about Liljegren is he has played so little hockey that I think it makes sense to look at his season in a little more detail. And 4 points his first 5 games is by far the best stretch he's had, he's not come anywhere near that in the 25 games since.

 

[Coaches Coroner]

He has stagnated in terms of some wild expectations by Leafs fans at the start of the year (e.g. he should have gone top 5).

In terms of actual play, he has been much, much better from inside the red line in than I expected. But he has also put up less points, especially 5v5 points, than I expected.

It's comical how many people continue to cite 2 or 3 posters who said wild things and attributing their posts to "Leaf fans expectations" in general.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

Eh sure. "salty" is the most overused word on the site. 12 points in 30 games is hardly impressive either or enough to say he has dispelled all concerns about him. The thing about Liljegren is he has played so little hockey that I think it makes sense to look at his season in a little more detail. And 4 points his first 5 games is by far the best stretch he's had, he's not come anywhere near that in the 25 games since.

Just curious. How many games of his have you watched in the AHL this year?

 

[Pavels Dog]

Just curious. How many games of his have you watched in the AHL this year?

Has he scored more points if you watch the games?

 

[izlez]

Lmao this guy is so salty.

"If I cherry pick this and omit that then I can somehow arrive at narrative that I am trying to push."

Coming from an entire thread pretty much devoted to:
"He's an all-time top 5 player in the time frame from October-December when you look at European AHLers born during a full moon on a Tuesday in April. What an amazing prospect!"

 

[TheBeastCoast]

Has he scored more points if you watch the games?

It was really a simple question lol. You just seem to be in here making a lot of judgments about the kids play for someone that clearly hasn't actually been watching him play and just box score scouting. I really have no problem if someone has a differing opinion or isn't a fan of a player but atleast go a little more in depth then looking up his hockeydb page.

 

[DatSnipeMatthews]

It's comical how many people continue to cite 2 or 3 posters who said wild things and attributing their posts to "Leaf fans expectations" in general.

There were a vocal minority (much more than 2 or 3 people) who claimed he was a complete steal and should have gone top 5.

 

[Pyromaniac]

Eh sure. "salty" is the most overused word on the site. 12 points in 30 games is hardly impressive either or .enough to say he has dispelled all concerns about him. The thing about Liljegren is he has played so little hockey that I think it makes sense to look at his season in a little more detail. And 4 points his first 5 games is by far the best stretch he's had, he's not come anywhere near that in the 25 games since.

Its your logic that's lol worthy. The sample size is small, so therefore we are going to divide it into even smaller samples. Like seriously what?

I am more than fine with 12 points in 30 games. Most importantly he has made the transition as an 18 year old defenseman playing in his first year in NA. People said he would be a trainwreck defensively, yet he hasn't been on for too many GF. You would have to actually watch the games to see that though, you can't just open up his ahl.com stat page.

 

[Frolov 6'3]

Folks, Timothy Liljegren part III tells me this is a freaking stud and not just another 17th overall pick.

 

[firstemperor]

Eh sure. "salty" is the most overused word on the site. 12 points in 30 games is hardly impressive either or enough to say he has dispelled all concerns about him. The thing about Liljegren is he has played so little hockey that I think it makes sense to look at his season in a little more detail. And 4 points his first 5 games is by far the best stretch he's had, he's not come anywhere near that in the 25 games since.

It's somewhat impressive when you consider his age, productivity, and comfort level at the AHL- particularly when you pace him with other comparable's at the same age.

And it certainly dispels many concerns, given how awful his draft year really was. His draft status was heavily weighed on projection and some assumptions that his stock was hurt by various factors- i.e. an awful club and a lengthy illness.

 

[Pavels Dog]

It was really a simple question lol. You just seem to be in here making a lot of judgments about the kids play for someone that clearly hasn't actually been watching him play and just box score scouting. I really have no problem if someone has a differing opinion or isn't a fan of a player but atleast go a little more in depth then looking up his hockeydb page.

Except I wasn’t judging his play, only his stats. I don’t think it’s unfair to cast SOME judgement on an offensive d-man based on numbers.
It’s good to hear he’s becoming great defensively, but pre-draft hype had a lot to do with his offensive tools.

 

[Lil Tuzzi Bert]

Except I wasn’t judging his play, only his stats. I don’t think it’s unfair to cast SOME judgement on an offensive d-man based on numbers.
It’s good to hear he’s becoming great defensively, but pre-draft hype had a lot to do with his offensive tools.

Long year for an 18 year old in his first season on NA ice. Also he's scoring at the same rate as Svech while being almost three years younger and on Defence. I'd say he's looking pretty good.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Long year for an 18 year old in his first season on NA ice. Also he's scoring at the same rate as Svech while being almost three years younger and on Defence. I'd say he's looking pretty good.

Who is Svech? I’d also say ”pretty good”, not much more. Next year should be pretty informative on his progress.

 

[Walshy7]

It's comical how many people continue to cite 2 or 3 posters who said wild things and attributing their posts to "Leaf fans expectations" in general.

you just summarized pretty much the entire of HF boards there, 1/2/3 fans says something outlandish and the entire fan base of that posters ream gets attributed to the outlandish post

 

[Lil Tuzzi Bert]

Who is Svech? I’d also say ”pretty good”, not much more. Next year should be pretty informative on his progress.

Svechnikov, actually one of my favourite wings prospects cause they're my second team. I agree he's not been dominant but for not looking out of place and having some nice wow moments here and there, nobody can say he at least doesn't look like a top 4 D potentially at least (like you said next year is big).

 

[Walshy7]

Except I wasn’t judging his play, only his stats. I don’t think it’s unfair to cast SOME judgement on an offensive d-man based on numbers.
It’s good to hear he’s becoming great defensively, but pre-draft hype had a lot to do with his offensive tools.

that's not what he is used as though on the marlies, he is used in at best a 2way role and in some cases a defensive role only. Just like free scoring Jeremy bracco right now on the marlies is being used almost exclusively defensively. It is how the leafs treat all first year AHL players especially the pure offense ones. You cant expect him to score highly while the team is going out of its way to ensure offense is one of the last priorities for him

Liljegren has been so much better defensively than his scouting report would have you believe. That if you watched his AHL games you wouldn't believe the report and the player in front of you is the same player.

 

[Walshy7]

Svechnikov, actually one of my favourite wings prospects cause they're my second team. I agree he's not been dominant but for not looking out of place and having some nice wow moments here and there, nobody can say he at least doesn't look like a top 4 D potentially at least (like you said next year is big).

next year is not big haha, every single player grows differently if he sucks next year there is absolutely no reason to right him off. It will be his 2nd season in NA and he will be 19, give the kid a chance