GDT: Panthers @ Wings | 7:30PM ET | The Why is Jimmy Howard Still Starting? Edition

[Reddwit]

He doesn't deserve blame there because he should be expected to cough up the puck at the blue line due to the fact he isn't all that great of a hockey player and has no head on his shoulders. Nobody should have been surprised by that, especially his teammates.

The anti-AA obsession is too much just as the crowd that thinks he's some future superstar is too much. He will be nothing more than a one-way player capable of scoring 40 points, unless he's on a team where elite players can make up for his glaring, obvious shortcomings.

He is the equivalent to people thinking Tatar and Nyquist were going to be Eurotwins 2.0 which, by the way, is an absolute insult to Datsyuk and Zetterberg. An insult. What the hell do Nyquist and Tatar do if they aren't scoring? Sound like somebody?

And here comes the crowd saying we never said Tatar and Nyquist were going to be that, just as people didn't lose their kneejerk **** thinking Nyquist was gonna be the next 50 goal scorer because he had an unsustainable shooting percentage that Red Wings fan thought he could sustain.

Wanna know the ****ty part of all of this?

Green is the only player worth a damn when it comes to the trade deadline. That's it. I guess Dekeyser is a steal at $5 million though, hopefully some team rings Holland for him. Maybe Holland can fleece Edmonton with Mrazek.

I could quote at least 2 dozen posts off-hand that illustrate the anti-AA obsession. Can you do the same for "AA is a superstar" crowd? Can you even quote anyone saying Nyquist would score 50?

And AA "has no head on his shoulders?" Is that why he's on pace for 40 points - a top 6 pace - despite never being given the benefit of the doubt in his career? LOL. Or that he has an average-at-worst giveaway pace? Or that he has an elite takeaway pace?

 

[Shaman464]

I could quote at least 2 dozen posts off-hand that illustrate the anti-AA obsession. Can you do the same for "AA is a superstar" crowd? Can you even quote anyone saying Nyquist would score 50?

Saying he isn't worth more than 2 million, that his holding out for what turned out to be less than what he was offered was counter productive and even a distraction, that he isn't going to be a superstar, but a complementary winger, and that he has a history of attitude problems isn't anti-AA obsession. He is what he is, fun to watch, but the body of evidence shows he's not going to be much more than a middle 6 scoring winger.

 

[Reddwit]

Saying he isn't worth more than 2 million, that his holding out for what turned out to be less than what he was offered, that he isn't going to be a superstar, but a complementary winger, and that he has a history of attitude problems isn't anti-AA obsession. He is what he is, fun to watch, but the body of evidence shows he's not going to be much more than a middle 6 scoring winger.

Wait a minute....The "body of evidence" shows that AA is going to be nothing more than a middle 6 winger......when he is currently scoring at the rate of a 2nd line winger while also currently getting the TOI of a 3rd liner.....but, also according to you, the "objective evidence" shows that Blashill is employing the correct system while the team is bottom 5 in the league, progressively getting worse, and has suffered once of their worst losses in a quarter century......?

Pardon me, brother, but I don't really buy your definition of objective evidence. But keep harping on how AA is the reason for the goal against despite the fact that he made the correct play in three zones of ice while the key defenseman overskated his man and the 3rd player wasn't even a part of the play...

Here's to adding one more post to the anti-AA dossier, complete with anti-AA comments that directly contradict statistical evidence! Cheers!

 

[TatarTangle]

I could quote at least 2 dozen posts off-hand that illustrate the anti-AA obsession. Can you do the same for "AA is a superstar" crowd?

Can you even quote anyone saying Nyquist would score 50?

Nope. Because the anti-AA crowd has more members. What does that tell you? If it walks like a duck. Quacks like a duck. It may be Gordon Bombay.

AA is a fine enough hockey player, not really trying to blast the guy, he just is what he is. A one-trick pony. Has a place on the right team, ones with defensemen that can move the puck. Certainly isn't this one.

Last time Nyquist was relevant on hfboards was when people were clamoring about it. Who the hell knows when Nyquist was relevant last. Three years ago?

 

[Reddwit]

Nope. Because the anti-AA crowd has more members. What does that tell you? If it walks like a duck. Quacks like a duck. It may be Gordon Bombay.

AA is a fine enough hockey player, not really trying to blast the guy, he just is what he is. A one-trick pony. Has a place on the right team, ones with defensemen that can move the puck. Certainly isn't this one.

Last time Nyquist was relevant on hfboards was when people were clamoring about it. Who the hell knows when Nyquist was relevant last. Three years ago?

Does it? Or does it have more vocal members in the same way that the crazed zealots about any issue speak the loudest?

Still waiting for those Nyquist quotes. Pretty search the search engines go back further than 3 years.

 

[TatarTangle]

Does it? Or does it have more vocal members in the same way that the crazed zealots about any issue speak the loudest?

Still waiting for those Nyquist quotes. Pretty search the search engines go back further than 3 years.

It has more members. Love the use of zealots. Kudos. But aren't you doing the same thing? Is what's good for the goose not good for the gander?

Fancy words!!!

To be honest bud, I laid out a huge post explaining a bunch of stuff and all you've done is beat around the bush. Literally, your only argument is. Well. Nothing. Your responses have had no substance. No stance. Nothing. I even tried saying AA is a fine hockey player, one that has a role on the right team.

Have a great night. Keep on fighting the good fight.

 

[Shaman464]

Wait a minute....The "body of evidence" shows that AA is going to be nothing more than a middle 6 winger......when he is currently scoring at the rate of a 2nd line winger while also currently getting the TOI of a 3rd liner.....but, also according to you, the "objective evidence" shows that Blashill is employing the correct system while the team is bottom 5 in the league, progressively getting worse, and has suffered once of their worst losses in a quarter century......?

Pardon me, brother, but I don't really buy your definition of objective evidence. But keep harping on how AA is the reason for the goal against despite the fact that he made the correct play in three zones of ice while the key defenseman overskated his man and the 3rd player wasn't even a part of the play...

Here's to adding one more post to the anti-AA dossier, complete with anti-AA comments that directly contradict statistical evidence! Cheers!

The stuff about Blashill:

That's what happens when the team doesn't have a core. It doesn't have a #1 center or a top defense pairing, that's 3 cornerstone pieces its missing. Not really the foundations for a great team, is it? The team is literally sitting right where anyone with half a brain predicted it would be.

As for the AA 3rd line/2nd line stuff; He's getting over 15 a night on lines that vary in usage, the only forwards getting significantly more are Larkin and Zetterberg, mostly because they are being doubleshifted more in the 11/7 scheme, a couple other players like Abdelkader is also getting a bit of a bump because of double-shifting, so just quoting ToI is vacuous. And his scoring clip is inflated by a couple good games, he's been invisible a lot more than he's been scoring. And even with most ToI he's ever had his Fenwick and Corsi are both significantly lower than his career average, showing he's not driving possession when he's on the ice. Why should he get more time than Mantha, Nyquist, Tatar, or Abdelkader (not to mention Larkin, Nielsen or Zetterberg who usually line up as centers)? All of them have better possession numbers and are scoring at higher or near the same pts/g as him. But don't take the facts into account. Because the stats say he's easily behind 4 wingers and 3 centers when you factor in points and possession, which puts him, wait for it, in or around the THIRD line.

 

[lomekian]

Nobody is talking about it, but the ice at the LCA sucked.
Simple passes were bouncing over sticks. Guys would skate along and the puck would jump over their stick. Nearly every pass the Panthers took on the point in the third period was backed by the skate, fearing it would hop over their stick.
Guys who skate well were stumbling on their push offs.

Someone needs to do something about the ****ing ice in that place.

Agreed. Its been awful quite a few games recently

 

[lomekian]

Regarding AA, one heartening thing is that I have seen a deliberate shift in his play in two ways. He's trying to use his team-mates more (not great decision making at times) and backchecking harder. Obviously neither of these things are his instinctive natural approaches, but he is trying to become a more complete player, even if the results are a bit up and down.

As for the OT goal, his linemates really should have given him a pass rather than isolating him on the point

 

[TheMule93]

The fact that Tatar-Larkin-Mantha is so good every night encourages me. They are snake bitten like hell, though. They need to start finding the back of the net or they'll get demoralized.

 

[SoupGuru]

So the consensus is that Mantha stayed out far too long on his shift to the point where it took him an age to even get to the bench?

 

[chris05]

the biggest joke going is the wings trying to showcase duds as real hockey players. look at the playing time they recieve and the team results. there is no way aa should have been on the ice when the wings coaching staff did a great job of taking him out of the game yet he still provided them with an opportunity to win the game.

 

[Redder Winger]

Get Abdelkader off Z's Wing and put Athanasiou there for 3 weeks.

Let's see what that does for AA and Z.

 

[Redder Winger]

So the consensus is that Mantha stayed out far too long on his shift to the point where it took him an age to even get to the bench?

What are you going to do.
Maybe that last time Athanasiou should have taken the puck all the way back behind his own net and allowed DK and Mantha to change.
But they're young kids and they smelled blood in the water.

 

[Dotter]

What are you going to do.
Maybe that last time Athanasiou should have taken the puck all the way back behind his own net and allowed DK and Mantha to change.
But they're young kids and they smelled blood in the water.

Lol, no they aren't.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Agreed. Its been awful quite a few games recently

People were mentioning how bad the ice was during the game, but it bears repeating.

I understand that it's a multi-use facility but with an $800 million arena they could've put a little more thought and resources into having good ice.

It's not rocket science. It's trying to keep water frozen. I'm sure smart people could figure out a way to do that better.

 

[Redder Winger]

Lol, no they aren't.

Athanasiou has 1501 minutes of NHL experience,
Mantha has 1592 minutes of NHL experience.

That's less minutes than Zetterberg played last year.

They're still young. They're still learning the league.

 

[Beltv]

I'm just happy we didn't lose by a handful of goals. Tonight it was a good game and I thought we played well. Now here goes another 2 really bad games up next...seems to be the cycle.

 

[Redder Winger]

I'm just happy we didn't lose by a handful of goals. Tonight it was a good game and I thought we played well. Now here goes another 2 really bad games up next...seems to be the cycle.

This was a sloppy game.
Not very entertaining.

 

[Dotter]

It was a boring game aside from the fights. I blame the LCA ice. The players (for both teams) couldn't get any rhythm going, it's just so damn discombobulated.

 

[ElysiumAB]

Nobody is talking about it, but the ice at the LCA sucked.
Simple passes were bouncing over sticks. Guys would skate along and the puck would jump over their stick. Nearly every pass the Panthers took on the point in the third period was backed by the skate, fearing it would hop over their stick.
Guys who skate well were stumbling on their push offs.

Someone needs to do something about the ****ing ice in that place.

To be fair, it's being talked about quite a lot. Mickey mentioned it at length last game, Z has mentioned it in interviews.

Thank the Pistons and probably the architects that didn't learn that having a HUUUUGE jumbo tron above the ice causes a lot of heat issues (ask the other arena they designed about their ice - Edmonton, same issues).

 

[Run the Jewels]

People were mentioning how bad the ice was during the game, but it bears repeating.

I understand that it's a multi-use facility but with an $800 million arena they could've put a little more thought and resources into having good ice.

It's not rocket science. It's trying to keep water frozen. I'm sure smart people could figure out a way to do that better.

The fact it's multi use is probably why the ice is so bad. At JLA the ice was constantly in use give or take the random concert. So it was being used consistently and continually resurfaced. It was a really solid sheet of ice and JLA was known for having great ice.

Those days are gone.

 

[Beltv]

This was a sloppy game.
Not very entertaining.

Lower your expectations. Remember that this is a bottom 5 team. Lol.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

The fact it's multi use is probably why the ice is so bad. At JLA the ice was constantly in use give or take the random concert. So it was being used consistently and continually resurfaced. It was a really solid sheet of ice and JLA was known for having great ice.

Those days are gone.

I think it definitely has a lot to do with it. But it's not the first ever multi-use arena.

The Staples center doesn't have great ice but its' better than LCA's at this point and they have the Kings and two NBA teams. And that's in the warm climate of Southern California. My main point is that in the design and planning for this arena it seems likely they could've put more thought into having good ice.

 

[Winger98]

I think it definitely has a lot to do with it. But it's not the first ever multi-use arena.

The Staples center doesn't have great ice but its' better than LCA's at this point and they have the Kings and two NBA teams. And that's in the warm climate of Southern California. My main point is that in the design and planning for this arena it seems likely they could've put more thought into having good ice.

I'm wondering if there isn't some sort "break in" period with new arenas, especially when they're shared with other sports teams. Was Boston's ice bad the first year they were in the new Garden (yeah, it's the Boston Garden to me)? I keep thinking Dallas had to do quite a bit of work in their early seasons to get the ice even decent. Is Chicago's multi-use?