Around the League | Round 1: FIGHT!

[quat]

Osgood always seemed whiney to me too.

Speaking of underrated goalies... Marty Turco was so frustrating to play against

They made a rule because he was so dominant at handling the puck

 

[arttk]

On that team you literally could.

The numbers don’t lie.

His mediocre performances in St. Louis/NYI smack dab in the middle of his prime don’t lie.

He was a below-average starter who fluked into a Cloutier-Burke/Crawford situation on one of the most dominant teams in NHL history.

Everyone who watched his career knew he sucked but people who didn’t come along 20 years later and try to write revisionist BS.

Waking up today and debating about Osgood was not on my to do list for sure…

On the flip side, hey at least I am thinking less about that painful game 2 loss

 

[LemonSauceD]

Yes Vlasic has looked outstanding from the games i've seen of him this year

Lightning are done

Just too reliant on 4 skaters and Vasy

Some bad contracts and questionable trades. Lost a lot of their depth guys.

They’ve lost Killorn, Colton, Gourde, Palat, and Coleman. Should’ve never given Sergachev $8.5M or Cirelli $6.5M. Bad bad contracts. Terrible McDonough + picks/Jeannot trade. They also have Stamkos who they should 100% let walk after this season.

The good thing is Kucherov is 30, Vasy is 29, and Point is 28. A few good depth players like Paul, Raddysh, and Perbix. But the rest of that team is trash. An aging Hedman and a weak prospect pool.

Some major surgery is going to be needed over there.

 

[Vector]

Osgood always seemed whiney to me too.

Speaking of underrated goalies... Marty Turco was so frustrating to play against

One of the reasons we have the trapezoid.

 

[Petey But Really Jim]

Osgood always seemed whiney to me too.

Speaking of underrated goalies... Marty Turco was so frustrating to play against

You didn't need underrated as a second seque when whiney already nailed it.

 

[LordBacon]

You replace bo with petey and we're up 2-0

This is coming from a huge Horvat fan.
His 1 goal -3 performance is insignificant and is unlikely to help the team.

 

[SopelFanThe3rd]

You didn't need underrated as a second seque when whiney already nailed it.

True. I hated him but he was so good with the puck it was so frustrating. Like 3 defenseman

They made a rule because he was so dominant at handling the puck

He was insane. You literally couldn't dump and chase.

 

[Bobby9]

You replace bo with petey and we're up 2-0

100%

 

[jd22]

100%

Wow, I'm shocked to hear such a statement coming from you.

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

Some bad contracts and questionable trades. Lost a lot of their depth guys.

They’ve lost Killorn, Colton, Gourde, Palat, and Coleman. Should’ve never given Sergachev $8.5M or Cirelli $6.5M. Bad bad contracts. Terrible McDonough + picks/Jeannot trade. They also have Stamkos who they should 100% let walk after this season.

The good thing is Kucherov is 30, Vasy is 29, and Point is 28. A few good depth players like Paul, Raddysh, and Perbix. But the rest of that team is trash. An aging Hedman and a weak prospect pool.

Some major surgery is going to be needed over there.

It's just impossible to sustain a large window in the cap era without taking significant risks which involve sacrificing draft picks and overpaying for the younger talent you have.

They gambled on Sergachev developing into a top pairing defenseman, but you are screwed when you erode all your depth on the blueline. They just needed to move on from McDonough who is slowing down now. Unfortunately for them, Hedman is on the decline and Cernak can never stay healthy.

Cirelli is an elite shutdown guy who they probably thought would evolve into a 70+ point guy.

Tanner Jeannot is essentially a Maxim Lapierre-like player who overperformed one year, became an overrated commodity but is essentially a very good 4th liner. They were banking on Jeannot turning into a middle 6 winger.

Similar to Chicago, LA and Pittsburgh, they won multiple cups and had 4 SCF appearances. It was a crazy good period for them. Now it's time for them to decent into mediocrity.

 

[Tryforthekingdom]

I still remember fondly when Hordichuk hit Marty Turco on the half wall when he was out playing the puck.

 

[Jyrki]

It's just impossible to sustain a large window in the cap era without taking significant risks which involve sacrificing draft picks and overpaying for the younger talent you have.

They gambled on Sergachev developing into a top pairing defenseman, but you are screwed when you erode all your depth on the blueline. They just needed to move on from McDonough who is slowing down now. Unfortunately for them, Hedman is on the decline and Cernak can never stay healthy.

Cirelli is an elite shutdown guy who they probably thought would evolve into a 70+ point guy.

Tanner Jeannot is essentially a Maxim Lapierre-like player who overperformed one year, became an overrated commodity but is essentially a very good 4th liner. They were banking on Jeannot turning into a middle 6 winger.

Similar to Chicago, LA and Pittsburgh, they won multiple cups and had 4 SCF appearances. It was a crazy good period for them. Now it's time for them to decent into mediocrity.

I do think Brisebois made the cardinal mistake of gambling on contradictory mandates. He paid as much as he did for Jeannot because he would technically be cost-controlled if he reached his potential... yet he also handed out a lot of fat risky contracts to incumbent players. I get it from the perspective of trying to squeeze in as much as possible while Hedman and Stamkos are still going but the age structure of the rest of the stars still makes them very competitive for 3-4 more seasons at least. So he probably should've been thinking more along the lines of "how do I get the most good seasons from my core as a whole" than "how do I make the team as good as possible right now".

Of course the Bolts still have been widely successful but it's interesting to think about the decisions made at the margin.

 

[I am toxic]

Here is a contemporary of Osgood, speaking about it, not an HF poster who has repeatedly demonstrated they have no clue about goaltending:

“Absolutely. He’s won two Cups and the wins and things like that. You got to be patient. You can’t push it. I had an advocate in the Calgary Flames organization that put some stuff together and sent it in to the Hall of Fame and kind of made your case for it. That’s kind of what you have to do I gather. My daughter wrote a letter a bunch of years ago, too. It didn’t work. Eventually, I think in Ozzie’s case, in time he’ll get there. I don’t know if it will be next year, or when. … I just think Ozzie’s got to be patient. It will come. He’s a lot younger than I am, so he’s got lots of time.”

So while we can debate when Osgood will be inducted - Rinee, Rask, and Price will go ahead of him, it is really a question of whether he gets in before or after Miller and CuJo - the idea that he was an average NHL goalie is so laughably contemptible, it makes one wish it was trolling.

But it's not. People are that clueless.

 

[VanJack]

And to think that heading into the last weekend of the season, the Canucks had a chance to overhaul Dallas for top spot in the Western Conference.

Their reward? A series against the Vegas Golden Knights. With Dallas now down 0-2 and heading on the road, you have to seriously wonder how pointless it is to push to envelope to reach the top of the mountain. And then face a team that massages the salary cap every spring, and obviously was playing 'rope a dope' for half the season, ensuring they held on to one of two wildcard spots.

Welcome to the cap era.....where if you make the top eight in each conference, almost everything is possible.

 

[Petey O]

You replace bo with petey and we're up 2-0

At least EP plays effective defense. Bo is a joke.

 

[Slapshot_11]

At least EP plays effective defense. Bo is a joke.

That's f***ing hilarious considering ep is like -4 and had a brutal giveaway and then didn't take his man for a Nashville goal

 

[Petey O]

That's f***ing hilarious considering ep is like -4 and had a brutal giveaway and then didn't take his man for a Nashville goal

If you think Bo moves the needle in any decent way right now over EP you're delusional.

EP has been trash but Bo wouldn't change a thing about this series.

 

[Slapshot_11]

If you think Bo moves the needle in any decent way right now over EP you're delusional.

EP has been trash but Bo wouldn't change a thing about this series.

Right.. ep the guy playing like tanner glass who missed 2 open nets and gave the other team a goal

We're up 2-0 with Bo

 

[bandwagonesque]

“Absolutely. He’s won two Cups and the wins and things like that. You got to be patient. You can’t push it. I had an advocate in the Calgary Flames organization that put some stuff together and sent it in to the Hall of Fame and kind of made your case for it. That’s kind of what you have to do I gather. My daughter wrote a letter a bunch of years ago, too. It didn’t work. Eventually, I think in Ozzie’s case, in time he’ll get there. I don’t know if it will be next year, or when. … I just think Ozzie’s got to be patient. It will come. He’s a lot younger than I am, so he’s got lots of time.”

Even if you disregard the "stuff," and I can see the argument for it, the "things like that" just jump out at you

 

[I am toxic]

Even if you disregard the "stuff," and I can see the argument for it, the "things like that" just jump out at you

Yeah

stealing the net from Hasek to go on to win a Cup, posting what, a .930? And then taking the team to the finals the following year, being a Conn Smythe contender if they beat Syd, Malkin and Fleury

and is he the only goalie with over 400 wins that has less than 250 losses?

average

 

[vancityluongo]

Yeah

stealing the net from Hasek to go on to win a Cup, posting what, a .930? And then taking the team to the finals the following year, being a Conn Smythe contender if they beat Syd, Malkin and Fleury

and is he the only goalie with over 400 wins that has less than 250 losses?

average

i think you're very much confusing "accomplishments" vs how good he was as a goalie.

kevin lowe was a glorified #3 defenseman who played on a dynasty. that is seen as hhof-worthy. osgood getting in would be the same thing. it's judging what should be individual accomplishment, but largely using team metrics.

if mikka kiprusoff or evgeni nabokov were drafted into the red wings organization and played in osgood's place, they'd be slam dunk hall of famers.

 

[I am toxic]

i think you're very much confusing "accomplishments" vs how good he was as a goalie.

kevin lowe was a glorified #3 defenseman who played on a dynasty. that is seen as hhof-worthy. osgood getting in would be the same thing. it's judging what should be individual accomplishment, but largely using team metrics.

if mikka kiprusoff or evgeni nabokov were drafted into the red wings organization and played in osgood's place, they'd be slam dunk hall of famers.

Lowe never accomplished anything as a D , compared to something like a Conn Smyth worthy performance on the back of a .930 Cup championship, and getting top 10 all time stats, not to mention the only goalie to get 400 wins with less than 250 losses.

Whatever people rank him relative to Kipper or Nabakov, the argument was that he was an average goalie. That's so totally bullshit, I am speechless.

But my finger still works.

 

[MS]

Yeah

stealing the net from Hasek to go on to win a Cup, posting what, a .930? And then taking the team to the finals the following year, being a Conn Smythe contender if they beat Syd, Malkin and Fleury

and is he the only goalie with over 400 wins that has less than 250 losses?

average

He was consistently one of the bottom starting goalies in the league and consistently considered the weak link on that team.

If Chris Osgood ever gets into the HHOF they should burn the whole thing down.

There was no point in his entire career that he was considered one of the top 10 goalies in the NHL. 'Average' is being incredibly generous. He was on waivers when he was 28.

 

[WTG]

Had to watch that penalty again. Draisaitl already has his hands up falling over before he gets touched. It's also telling he goes straight to the bench after

Fair play

 

[Tables of Stats]

If the Oilers are so good offensively why does it take them so many shots to score a goal?