Prospect Info: [Official]: 2016 Draft Thread

[Master Bill]

I've never seen such fascination with fans as much as this year when it comes to winning the first overall, then trading it to move down.

Is it because no media hype of Auston Matthews, is it because no on watches him, because he is American?

I don't get it. Auston Matthews is so incredibly underrated by the Flames fanbase it seems (based on all the stuff I read here and at CP). Everyone seems to want either a Finn or Dubois over him, blows my mind.

Matthews would instantly become the Flames best player, even over Gaudreau and Monahan.

Whoever suggesting trading down the 1st overall should get their brains checked. Seriously?

 

[Calculon]

I've never seen such fascination with fans as much as this year when it comes to winning the first overall, then trading it to move down.

Is it because no media hype of Auston Matthews, is it because no on watches him, because he is American?

I don't get it. Auston Matthews is so incredibly underrated by the Flames fanbase it seems (based on all the stuff I read here and at CP). Everyone seems to want either a Finn or Dubois over him, blows my mind.

Matthews would instantly become the Flames best player, even over Gaudreau and Monahan.

It's not an indictment on Matthews, but rather just an anxiety drive and/or an OCD about addressing immediate roster needs. And you can also see that again this year with some suggesting the Flames should trade the first if the BPA left are all defencemen or centres. The only way trading this year's first makes any sense is if for some reason, Gauthier is the only player left on the board as everyone else has stopped existing for a while.

It's actually really, really common too. For example, a fair number of fans wanted to trade down in 2014 to take a defenceman (Fleury) or a right winger (Ritchie/Virtanen) because the Flames already had Monahan, Backlund, Jankowski and Arnold in the system, but lacked quality defencemen and big, truculent wingers.

Granted, this year there is some debate as to whether Laine is really all that far behind, if not already equal to Matthews.

 

[AgeOfBennett]

I would almost take Laine over Matthews if we had 1OA. It's close though

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

JP, it's a number of factors I think. First being that it's a far more open type of lotto system this year, with all 3 picks being up for grabs. Secondly, the top 3 players are all potential elite talents. As such, trading down and still remaining in the top three, in theory still gives you a top player.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

Also, I think taking Mathews first would be a very easy choice. Laine is much closer to Pulju than he is to Mathews.

 

[Lunatik]

Also, I think taking Mathews first would be a very easy choice. Laine is much closer to Pulju than he is to Mathews.

agreed

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

agreed

I keep hearing how people think Laine could be the next Ovechkin, it's possible but I doubt it. I'm sure he's going to be an excellent player, but I haven't heard any professional scouts say he's a generational player. I think Laine and Pulju will probably have similar careers, Laine is more intriguing. But Mathews is a Tavares level talent and a franchise altering center, if we lucked out enough and won, you take him without blinking.

 

[SmellOfVictory]

I keep hearing how people think Laine could be the next Ovechkin, it's possible but I doubt it. I'm sure he's going to be an excellent player, but I haven't heard any professional scouts say he's a generational player. I think Laine and Pulju will probably have similar careers, Laine is more intriguing. But Mathews is a Tavares level talent and a franchise altering center, if we lucked out enough and won, you take him without blinking.

I don't see how anyone can call him the next Ovechkin when the major concern with him is that his skating apparently isn't great. lol.

 

[JPeeper]

I get the Ovy comparison with Laine's shot, because it is elite, like very very good elite.

That's where it stops begins and stops though. Ovy is 240 lb athletic freak beast, I wouldn't exactly call Laine that. Ovechkin is a top 5 skater in the world and can hit with the best of them.

Not a slight against Laine though, and his skating has improved a ton from the past year. Laine also doesn't stray away from the physicality, but he isn't the bull that Ovy used to be. With that said I can see Laine being a consistent 30-40 goal guy in the NHL on the right team and able to hit 50. If Flames are lucky enough to get Laine, he would do serious damage on our PP with Gaudreau, Monahan and Bennett.

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

Laine may not quite be Ovechkin, but he is probably as safe a bet as any the last decade to be a less truculent Iginla.

Yes Please.

 

[DomBarr]

I've never seen such fascination with fans as much as this year when it comes to winning the first overall, then trading it to move down.

Is it because no media hype of Auston Matthews, is it because no on watches him, because he is American?

I don't get it. Auston Matthews is so incredibly underrated by the Flames fanbase it seems (based on all the stuff I read here and at CP). Everyone seems to want either a Finn or Dubois over him, blows my mind.

Matthews would instantly become the Flames best player, even over Gaudreau and Monahan.

For me its not that I am underrating Matthews as I agree that he would become the flames best center if not the best forward (I really like Brodie so I can't say player) its more that I am more comfortable with the center depth and not at all comfortable with the skilled winger with size depth.
And its not that I want a Finn more than him. Its that I might want a Fin plus another high level/elite prospect over him.

 

[Siignal]

Laine's getting comparisons to Mario and McKeen has him #1 over Matthews

This year is going to be entertaining

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

Laine may not quite be Ovechkin, but he is probably as safe a bet as any the last decade to be a less truculent Iginla.

Yes Please.

So you're saying he's going to be the best winger of his era and a HOF'er?

I'm not at all saying that he won't do it, because he has all the tools. But it's a pretty bold statement to make.

 

[1989]

Because there's two strong Finnish options, they're consistently compared against each other, although it's nearly a totally useless and superficial factor.

The best way to look at this from my point of view is that this draft is another Hall vs Seguin debate. They have similar potential although Matthews (Seguin) may have a somewhat higher ceiling, but Laine has a more assured floor.

Also, Laine reminds me of Monahan's draft circumstances - on a team playing with much less support and being the standout star, versus the support Puljujarvi gets from Aho. Based off some Finnish scouting sources, the common perception is Laine is the superior.

Puljujarvi should be the third option for most teams, unless your deciding factor between Laine and Puljujarvi is forward positioning - but I feel the difference of BPA selection is strong enough that Laine should overcome that distinction for the most part.

I'd go Laine/Matthews (positional need), Puljujarvi, then everyone else. Aside from goaltending, Calgary needs a Laine over a Matthews or Puljujarvi. I wouldn't be upset with Matthews by any means.

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

So you're saying he's going to be the best winger of his era and a HOF'er?

I'm not at all saying that he won't do it, because he has all the tools. But it's a pretty bold statement to make.

As a 17 year old boy, he is leading his entire mens professional hockey league (SM-Liiga) in playoff goal scoring (8 goals in 12 games).

Bold statement is what he is making. He still has a lot of growing to do and I wouldn't mind if he's in Europe or Stockton next year but I would be beyond ecstatic if we drafted top 2. The gap down to Puljujarvi and Dubois is much, much hreater than the gap between Laine and Matthews if there is one. Puljujarvi has high upside too but is more of a great prospect than a can't-miss talent putting him next to Dubois who is the same.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

As a 17 year old boy, he is leading his entire mens professional hockey league (SM-Liiga) in playoff goal scoring (8 goals in 12 games).

Bold statement is what he is making. He still has a lot of growing to do and I wouldn't mind if he's in Europe or Stockton next year but I would be beyond ecstatic if we drafted top 2. The gap down to Puljujarvi and Dubois is much, much hreater than the gap between Laine and Matthews if there is one. Puljujarvi has high upside too but is more of a great prospect than a can't-miss talent putting him next to Dubois who is the same.

Being that I don't get much Finnish hockey on my Shaw cable, I have to mostly rely on stat watching, articles and highlights.

I have to say that I think Barkov had more hype than Laine, he had a more impressive draft season than Laine, and as much as I love Sasha, I would not classify him as a generational player either. Laine is one hell of an intriguing talent, you could very well be right about him. But I still do not see him as on the same level that Mathews or even Eichel is for that matter.

 

[tfong]

Ovechkin is a generational talent and has a chance at beating a goal scoring record set by Gretzky. Stylistically maybe you can compare Laine and Ovie but when it comes down to it, Ovie is one of the best goal scorers of all time. People are setting themselves up for disappointment if they are expecting Ovechkin.

 

[Dan403]

Whoever suggesting trading down the 1st overall should get their brains checked. Seriously?

As with everything, it depends on the price someone is willing to pay.

 

[FLAMESFAN]

As a 17 year old boy, he is leading his entire mens professional hockey league (SM-Liiga) in playoff goal scoring (8 goals in 12 games).

Bold statement is what he is making. He still has a lot of growing to do and I wouldn't mind if he's in Europe or Stockton next year but I would be beyond ecstatic if we drafted top 2. The gap down to Puljujarvi and Dubois is much, much hreater than the gap between Laine and Matthews if there is one. Puljujarvi has high upside too but is more of a great prospect than a can't-miss talent putting him next to Dubois who is the same.

Agreed

To me Matthews is still the #1 guy, but Laine is not that far behind him & definitely pulling away from Pulj

 

[Pirate King Luffy]

I ran the NHL draft simulator 20 times. I would do it 100 times, but that's just time consuming. I got interesting results though.

edit: I said screw it and it did 100 times

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

Being that I don't get much Finnish hockey on my Shaw cable, I have to mostly rely on stat watching, articles and highlights.

We're in the exact same boat, but some of those articles are making claims like:

McKeens

I can’t honestly recall scouting a forward over 6-4 with a skill set as similar to Mario’s as Laine’s,” says McCagg. “The way he creates space when he has the puck, his hands, his release, his shot, his vision…maybe he’s not quite at Mario’s level…but he’s not that far off. He’s a tier above Rick Nash at the same age…and as we know both Nash and Mario were first overall picks. I have a hard time thinking anyone should be drafted ahead of him even if I really like Matthews a lot…I see a future 50-goal NHL scorer, maybe a 60-goal guy. I don’t see that same upside with Matthews.

Hockey Prospectus

Laine is unquestionably one of the best sniper prospects to emerge since the likes of John Tavares and Steven Stamkos.

Bob McKenzie's Sources

Had to think long and hard about it,” said another scout. “Laine is right there. In the end, we favoured the centre over the winger but I don’t think it’s a reach at all to see Laine going first overall. A lot of our European scouts who see these guys think Laine is better [than Matthews].”

And Corey Pronman too, said something along the lines of being unsurprised if Laine went first overall.

Will he be an Iginla tier talent I don't know but like I said, he's as safe a prospect as any in the last decade to be that. If we took him first overall it would not be a reach.

I have to say that I think Barkov had more hype than Laine, he had a more impressive draft season than Laine,

I think it's not really an issue if one is more hyped than the other. Both would give Matthews a strong run for first overall if a team liked what they saw enough. Matthews is an amazing prospect but from what I have seen I feel he's below guys like Eichel or Malkin in terms of potential. One thing to consider is that Matthews' draft year was his 18 year old year whereas for Laine and Barkov, their draft years were their 17 year old year, the 9-11 month differences in age can skew perceptions.

 

[Lunatik]

What's the point in running it 100 times? The more you do it, the closer it will be to the odds.

 

[tfong]

Well personally I think Laine is the better player but Matthews plays the center position which increases his value.

 

[Pirate King Luffy]

What's the point in running it 100 times? The more you do it, the closer it will be to the odds.

Gives perspective for people I suppose. Some people are clinging to hope for that #1 pick

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

We're in the exact same boat, but some of those articles are making claims like:

McKeens


Hockey Prospectus


Bob McKenzie's Sources


And Corey Pronman too, said something along the lines of being unsurprised if Laine went first overall.

Will he be an Iginla tier talent I don't know but like I said, he's as safe a prospect as any in the last decade to be that. If we took him first overall it would not be a reach.



I think it's not really an issue if one is more hyped than the other. Both would give Matthews a strong run for first overall if a team liked what they saw enough. Matthews is an amazing prospect but from what I have seen I feel he's below guys like Eichel or Malkin in terms of potential. One thing to consider is that Matthews' draft year was his 18 year old year whereas for Laine and Barkov, their draft years were their 17 year old year, the 9-11 month differences in age can skew perceptions.

That's hot OKG, makes me feel all tingly inside. TBH, I really like our odds of getting a top 3 pick. They are not the best, but we are right in the thick of it.