TSN: Muzzin/Martinez could be available for an upgrade to King's top 9

[Kamiccolo]

make that 2 cups The leafs need to improve there defense If you can't see that i'm not sure what to say. Muzzin would be the leafs best defense man period He would play in all areas and eat over 20 mins a game He would help you pp and pk. He is also sign for a few years cheap. this all holds more value then a rental jvr

When I read this, I immediately disregard their opinion on the Leafs. This is classic HFism, where the general HF opinion is touted for months or seasons after it is not longer true.

I do not understand how people think the Leafs defense is a tire fire, nor that they need "defense". They have defense, and good pieces from #2 - #10. If there is one hole, it is an elite #1 D.

Muzzin is not better than Gardiner, and Zaitsev has been better since last season as well. If Rielly continues to play as he has with Hainsey, I don't see how you could say that either.

Honestly, the post just wreaks of ignorance about the Leafs situation.

 

[Liferleafer]

He was a train wreck last year. Also, everyone on a good team looks good.

For example, nobody on the Leafs has below a 50% CF right now even though some of them have been terrible their numbers look good. I'd have to check Muzzin's numbers relative to his team but it's hard to draw a conclusion on anything 5-6 games into the season. For the early part of the season, it's best to use numbers from last season.

I consider the Leafs a good team.....but there are times when our D don't look good.

 

[backburner]

read or lehtera for free.

 

[member 88115]

He was a train wreck last year. Also, everyone on a good team looks good.

For example, nobody on the Leafs has below a 50% CF right now even though some of them have been terrible their numbers look good. I'd have to check Muzzin's numbers relative to his team but it's hard to draw a conclusion on anything 5-6 games into the season. For the early part of the season, it's best to use numbers from last season.

I knew i was right. Muzzin has had one bad season, which was last year. You really think all your D are better than Muzzin because of the corsi stat?

 

[Satan]

I'd like to get Martinez or Muzzin on Dallas. Not sure how it would work with the salary cap

but if LA was for whatever reason interested in a package of Brett Ritchie/Devin Shore + Jamie Oleksiak/Stephen Johns, I'd be into it.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

I knew i was right. Muzzin has had one bad season, which was last year. You really think all your D are better than Muzzin because of the corsi stat?

How often have you watched the leafs the last 2 years to say that Muzzin would be the leafs best defender?

I always hate this shit because obviously LA fans will have watched Muzzin a ton and only the Leafs a couple times A year while the leafs fans will have only watched LA play a few times but will know their player very well.

That is why it is convenient to refer to stats as we don't all watch every single game in the NHL.

That being said I think Muzzin and the Leafs top 3 defenders are close enough in impact to call it a wash. Personally I think Zaitsev may end up the best out of the 4 of them.

 

[KingCanadain1976]

[

When I read this, I immediately disregard their opinion on the Leafs. This is classic HFism, where the general HF opinion is touted for months or seasons after it is not longer true.

I do not understand how people think the Leafs defense is a tire fire, nor that they need "defense". They have defense, and good pieces from #2 - #10. If there is one hole, it is an elite #1 D.

Muzzin is not better than Gardiner, and Zaitsev has been better since last season as well. If Rielly continues to play as he has with Hainsey, I don't see how you could say that either.

Honestly, the post just wreaks of ignorance about the Leafs situation.

Giving up 19 goals in 5 games makes your defense a weakness. I can not make it clearer then that. That is almost 4 goals a game I don't think any cup winning team has had that.

 

[Kamiccolo]

[


Giving up 19 goals in 5 games makes your defense a weakness. I can not make it clearer then that. That is almost 4 goals a game I don't think any cup winning team has had that.

You are stat watching. Andersen has not been good. Last game he was good, and we got a shutout. Leafs are middle of the pack in almost every defensive stat that is tracked.

 

[KingCanadain1976]

You are stat watching. Andersen has not been good. Last game he was good, and we got a shutout. Leafs are middle of the pack in almost every defensive stat that is tracked.

I am also watching the games and the leafs defense is giving up to many scoring chances which the stats back up. You have blinders on if you think Muzzin wouldn't help your team a lot defensively

 

[member 88115]

How often have you watched the leafs the last 2 years to say that Muzzin would be the leafs best defender?

I always hate this **** because obviously LA fans will have watched Muzzin a ton and only the Leafs a couple times A year while the leafs fans will have only watched LA play a few times but will know their player very well.

That is why it is convenient to refer to stats as we don't all watch every single game in the NHL.

That being said I think Muzzin and the Leafs top 3 defenders are close enough in impact to call it a wash. Personally I think Zaitsev may end up the best out of the 4 of them.

I never said he would be the best defender in Toronto. So get your facts straight. There is a mutual feeling when certain Toronto fan/s who think Muzzin would only push Hainsey out of their lineup, with out watching him play.

Im not going to comment on your top 3 because like you said i don't watch the leafs. That is correct.

When Muzzin is leading our 2nd pairing on undefeated team and 2nd best gaa as a team, I'm sure he can more than help a team giving up more than 3 goals a game.

 

[Kamiccolo]

I am also watching the games and the leafs defense is giving up to many scoring chances which the stats back up. You have blinders on if you think Muzzin wouldn't help your team a lot defensively

Except they are middle of the pack for shots against, and don't give up a large amount of high danger chances against.

I never said he wouldn't help the team defensively. I took issue with your statement that A) The Leafs defense needs all the help it can get implying their core is wayy worse than they are and B) that you said he would be the teams best D.

 

[leeroggy]

I've been a fan of Martinez for years and he's signed for another three years at $4 million per. I'm also starting to believe that the odds of JT signing with the Isles are rapidly going away and one of our HF posters believes he has his sights set on Los Angeles for family reasons.

What is it worth to LA to offer for JT now to give them plenty of time to negotiate an extension? And what would you offer if you could pre-negotiate and sign him to an extension? It doesn't look like your prospect pool is all that good so how do you proceed if you are LA's GM? I might even be willing to offer JT and DeHaan together so come up with an offer for the two of them also.

 

[KingsHockey24]

I'd like to get Martinez or Muzzin on Dallas. Not sure how it would work with the salary cap

but if LA was for whatever reason interested in a package of Brett Ritchie/Devin Shore + Jamie Oleksiak/Stephen Johns, I'd be into it.

Quantity does not equal quality. With that said Devin Shore is a good player but not enough for Muzzin.

 

[HawkeyTalkMan]

One slightly used Connor Murphy and Ryan Hartman for Muzzin

 

[KingCanadain1976]

Except they are middle of the pack for shots against, and don't give up a large amount of high danger chances against.

I never said he wouldn't help the team defensively. I took issue with your statement that A) The Leafs defense needs all the help it can get implying their core is wayy worse than they are and B) that you said he would be the teams best D.

I have seen more leaf games then i care to admit and in every game i see the leafs give up a lot of quality chances that the kings don't seem to. Our team forces the offensive player to the outside to get low % shots. From what i see the leafs give up more high % shots Reilly and Gardnier are more offensive defense man then defensive minded. They are improving but still a ways to go imo to get to muzzin levels. Muzzin over all game is a step ahead of both gardnier and reilly imo

 

[Ziggdiezan]

I never said he would be the best defender in Toronto. So get your facts straight. There is a mutual feeling when certain Toronto fan/s who think Muzzin would only push Hainsey out of their lineup, with out watching him play.

Im not going to comment on your top 3 because like you said i don't watch the leafs. That is correct.

When Muzzin is leading our 2nd pairing on undefeated team and 2nd best gaa as a team, I'm sure he can more than help a team giving up more than 3 goals a game.

It was kind of implied with your statement but okay. The thing is he would only push out Hainsey as Zaitsev and Gardiner look like a solid pairing and shouldn't be split up. That doesn't mean he is worse than either player just they have good chemistry.

There are other factors to LA being a good defensive team such as bonafide number 1 defender, very good starting goalie, defensively responsible forwards, system etc.

Leafs have been really bad in giving away penalties and Andersen started the year poorly. Those are big factors in the leafs poor GAA.

Question, was Muzzin playing on the top pairing last year and that's why he had a down year. I'm curious.

With all that being said I would love to have him on the leafs if the price is right. Easily would do JVR++.

 

[Satan]

Quantity does not equal quality. With that said Devin Shore is a good player but not enough for Muzzin.

I absolutely agree. However, if Dallas were to move Shore or Ritchie for Muzzin or Martinez, they would either have to trade a defenseman to LA, or find a home for one of them before agreeing to terms with LA.

 

[Stimpythecat]

I've been a fan of Martinez for years and he's signed for another three years at $4 million per. I'm also starting to believe that the odds of JT signing with the Isles are rapidly going away and one of our HF posters believes he has his sights set on Los Angeles for family reasons.

What is it worth to LA to offer for JT now to give them plenty of time to negotiate an extension? And what would you offer if you could pre-negotiate and sign him to an extension? It doesn't look like your prospect pool is all that good so how do you proceed if you are LA's GM? I might even be willing to offer JT and DeHaan together so come up with an offer for the two of them also.

Which poster said this? I've been keeping tabs on tavares since I would love to see him on the kings. I won't insult Isles fans with a lowball offer so I am hoping to get him as a UFA.

Several hockey writers have stated they believe the kings have both the interest and the cap space for Tavares as a UFA.

 

[migi]

If I were Chicago, I'm not sure I'd give up Hartman alone for either of those guys...

Well I know what you mean, Hartman has been and is very good for us, but in near future we have Hayden and possibly Sikura with larger roles, Sharp may be back again, never know about Shalunov etc..

For me upgrading our D is the crucial part but somehow I agree with you given our D has looked fine already. But:

Saad-Toews-Panik
Hayden-Schmaltz-Kane
Sharp-Anisimov-Cat

Keith-Seabrook
Muzzin/Martinez-Rutta
Forsling-Murphy

That is solid upgrade for me I think. Kempny, Rutta, Forsling and even Murphy have done nothing in postseason, both Kings Dman are 2x champions with reasonable contracts.

 

[Phion Keneuf]

Leafs needs: another solid top 4 Dman
Kings needs: a 3rd line C and a top 6 W

To Leafs:
Jake Muzzin
2019 2nd Rounder (If JVR & Bozak re-sign turns to a '19 1st)

To Kings:
Tyler Bozak
James Van Riemsdyk

 

[leeroggy]

Which poster said this? I've been keeping tabs on tavares since I would love to see him on the kings. I won't insult Isles fans with a lowball offer so I am hoping to get him as a UFA.

Several hockey writers have stated they believe the kings have both the interest and the cap space for Tavares as a UFA.

The poster is on our Islanders portion of this board. You can use the thread I just started on this Board to make the proposals. Assume you can trade for him (or him and DeHaan) NOW and have him signed to an extension. That's what I am looking for . . . what a HOCKEY TRADE for JT looks like.

 

[Trapper]

I am also watching the games and the leafs defense is giving up to many scoring chances which the stats back up. You have blinders on if you think Muzzin wouldn't help your team a lot defensively

A lot of defensemen would help the Leafs. I imagine Muzzin would help a lot of other teams as well. It's not about help, it's about price. The prices for Muzzin, Tanev, whoever in trade threads are extreme. If nobody wants draft picks, if nobody wants JVR, if all prospects like Kappy/Johnsson/Nielsen/etc. are garbage (as per posters), these conversations/trade proposals are at an end. The price can't be met.

 

[KingCanadain1976]

I've been a fan of Martinez for years and he's signed for another three years at $4 million per. I'm also starting to believe that the odds of JT signing with the Isles are rapidly going away and one of our HF posters believes he has his sights set on Los Angeles for family reasons.

What is it worth to LA to offer for JT now to give them plenty of time to negotiate an extension? And what would you offer if you could pre-negotiate and sign him to an extension? It doesn't look like your prospect pool is all that good so how do you proceed if you are LA's GM? I might even be willing to offer JT and DeHaan together so come up with an offer for the two of them also.

I am very surprised to read this and would love to read more. Can you send me a link to this discussion please? As far as a trade I am not sure we would be able to come up with a reasonable deal unless your interested in a package of our mostly bottom 6 which i doubt u would be.

 

[KingCanadain1976]

A lot of defensemen would help the Leafs. I imagine Muzzin would help a lot of other teams as well. It's not about help, it's about price. The prices for Muzzin, Tanev, whoever in trade threads are extreme. If nobody wants draft picks, if nobody wants JVR, if all prospects like Kappy/Johnsson/Nielsen/etc. are garbage (as per posters), these conversations/trade proposals are at an end. The price can't be met.

Agreed the leafs are not in a position to make a trade with the kings imo

 

[Stimpythecat]

leeroggy, thank you. I will check that thread out. I simply missed it.