Minnesota Wild General Discussion IV

[TaLoN]

Gretzky didn't have the benefit of modern surgical technique that Zach finally took advantage of. Zach looked like the Zach prior to back injury in the second half of the season and in the playoffs before the fluke sternum incident.

The sternum injury comes with zero long term complications, so it's just a matter of if the back repair continues to prove its worth... I'm much less concerned now than last year at this time.

 

[Uberdachen]

Gretzky didn't have the benefit of modern surgical technique that Zach finally took advantage of. Zach looked like the Zach prior to back injury in the second half of the season and in the playoffs before the fluke sternum incident.

The sternum injury comes with zero long term complications, so it's just a matter of if the back repair continues to prove its worth... I'm much less concerned now than last year at this time.

I'm less concerned about the back injury, but no less concerned about his tendency to be injured one way or another.

 

[TaLoN]

I'm less concerned about the back injury, but no less concerned about his tendency to be injured one way or another.

Prior to the back, his injuries tended to be short term at worst here. Typical wear and tear.

Hell, the season after the back, it wasn't even his back that held him out of games, it was his tonsils causing recurring illness. People in hindsight just see missed games and assume injury.

 

[Bazeek]

If Eriksson Ek is who we hope his is, and if Parise starts the year healthy (admittedly, two pretty big "ifs"), then those two + Coyle would make for a pretty good 3rd line. Then we would just need to find a RW for a Nino/Koivu 2nd line. Maybe Kunin is healthy by then, maybe they give Anas a shot during camp, maybe there is a cheap 'buy low' option out there (Jannik Hansen?).

Assuming no forwards are traded, of course.

I like Hansen as much as I like any UFA options. Especially after that Kane contract.

Again assuming no forwards are moved in or out, I was thinking something like:

Zucker - Staal - Granlund
Parise - Koivu - Coyle
Kunin/Greenway/??? - JEE - Nino
Foligno - Thing1 - Thing2

Nino typically makes whatever line he's on better, so if we're going to have a line of JEE + Rookie I'd like to see him on the other wing. You can pretty much mix-n-match the wings in the top-6 as well. I don't know that it leaves us with a USDA Certified 1st Line, but we might get close to three 2nd lines. A lot would depend on Eriksson-Ek, but that's probably the case no matter how you shuffle the chairs here. Best case scenario is that he takes a big enough step that we start thinking of him and Koivu as the 2A and 2B centers.

I'd also like to avoid sticking any of our better forward prospects on the 4th line. They'd be better off in Iowa if it comes to that.

 

[Wabit]

He hasn’t been attached to Datsyuk in the KHL.

I don't watch the KHL, so only basing off of the Olympics and Worlds this year.

 

[57special]

Gretzky didn't have the benefit of modern surgical technique that Zach finally took advantage of. Zach looked like the Zach prior to back injury in the second half of the season and in the playoffs before the fluke sternum incident.

The sternum injury comes with zero long term complications, so it's just a matter of if the back repair continues to prove its worth... I'm much less concerned now than last year at this time.

The back procedure that ZP had done is not new, to my knowledge, and would have been available to Gretzky. Maybe it's now a bit less invasive? Fact is, though, that ZP is brittle, and accumulates serious injuries.

 

[57special]

Playoff scoring since 2013-14 among "the core" that have, for the most part, been with the team.

Parise 30 gp, 13g, 17a, 30 pts.

Koivu 39gp, 6g, 16a 22pts.

Granlund 39gp, 8g,13a, 21pts.

Nino 39gp, 8g, 10a, 18 pts.

Spurgeon 39gp, 6g, 11a, 17 pts.

Suter 34 gp, 2g, 14a, 16 pts.

Coyle 39 gp, 7g, 6a, 13 pts.

Dumba 26 gp, 3g, 5a, 8 pts.

Brodin 39 gp, 1g, 7a, 8 pts.

Zucker 26 gp, 3g, 3a, 6 pts.

Prosser 25 gp, 0g, 3a, 3 pts.

- I know Yeo didn't give Zucker a lot of TOI, but that production has to work against him getting a big contract.
- what a great, clutch player Spurgeon has been in the PO's. Sometimes lost in all the Dumba love going around. You can trust him to play excellent D, AND he can score.
- imagine if Parise was playing like the Parise of old?

 

[melinko]

I hope Fenton doesn't rush into trading Coyle or Nino.

Their value is going to be artificially low right now because of poor seasons due to injury.

 

[TaLoN]

The back procedure that ZP had done is not new, to my knowledge, and would have been available to Gretzky. Maybe it's now a bit less invasive? Fact is, though, that ZP is brittle, and accumulates serious injuries.

Yes, it's not new, but it has been much improved over time. Hence modern surgical technique, not new surgery options.

 

[DANOZ28]

anybody watching the playoffs realize how fast these teams are? i really believe our issue is we need more speed and losing haula proved it.

 

[nickschultzfan]

anybody watching the playoffs realize how fast these teams are? i really believe our issue is we need more speed and losing haula proved it.

This year, yes. Vegas built a team for speed and instructed it defense to put puck where their skates could get to. Washington has some burners too.

Not sure if that is say the winning formula for every team, but yes the Wild were noticeably slower this year. Haula is obvious. Koivu seem to lose a step. Nino's skating was labored all year. Coyle had his injury. Parise took a while to recover and get going. Ennis is not fast for a little guy.

 

[57special]

At least we are fast on the back end. Dumba, Brodin, and Spurgeon are fast, Seeler is surprisingly fast, and Suter is above average as a skater...he just plays slow.

Then there's Prosser...

I think Belpedio is fast, Olofsson is average, Soucy average at best.

Greenway isn't bad for speed. Kunin is average. Ek is above average.

 

[Wabit]

At least we are fast on the back end. Dumba, Brodin, and Spurgeon are fast, Seeler is surprisingly fast, and Suter is above average as a skater...he just plays slow.

Then there's Prosser...

I think Belpedio is fast, Olofsson is average, Soucy average at best.

Greenway isn't bad for speed. Kunin is average. Ek is above average.

Soucy is faster than he looks. He's listed at 6'4" or 6'5" and taller guys tend to just look slow. He's not a speed demon, but does has average speed.

Kunin plays faster than he really is, in a Parise sort of way.

Spurgeon I see as more quick/agile than fast foot speed.

Brodin is fast, but doesn't use it very often (similar to how you described Suter).

 

[Nharris31]

Like the hockey podcasts the I listen to say. There is a difference of being fast and playing fast.

 

[57special]

One of the more important and underrated ways that Dmen use their speed is in retrieving a puck in the D end. You get there fast, and you have time to avoid a battle with forechecker, and move the puck uncontested.
You get there with average speed, and you have to battle with a forechecker just to possess the puck. During that battle time, other opponents can flood the zone and cover passing lanes, even if you win the puck.
You get there slowly, and the forechecker already has the puck.

I believe that Brodin, Spurgeon, and to a lesser extent, Suter, are excellent at getting back fast to retrieve the puck.

 

[BagHead]

Like the hockey podcasts the I listen to say. There is a difference of fast and playing fast.

Yeah. Foot speed isn't what killed the Wild in the post-season, passing accuracy is what killed them. If you can't get a pass to a player in stride, they'll need to slow down to catch it, and they'll look slow because of it. Our transition game was terrible. I think Soucy and Seeler did an admirable job considering the circumstances, but they were the main culprits.

 

[Wild11MN]

Yeah. Foot speed isn't what killed the Wild in the post-season, passing accuracy is what killed them. If you can't get a pass to a player in stride, they'll need to slow down to catch it, and they'll look slow because of it. Our transition game was terrible. I think Soucy and Seeler did an admirable job considering the circumstances, but they were the main culprits.

THIS!

I've always ripped on our ability to get off one-timers, and a lot of that is we just don't have many shooters who excel at that, but the bigger culprit is the passing for sure. It's very evident on the PP. It's unbelievable how we can't even connect on simple passes on the PP.

 

[DANOZ28]

Like the hockey podcasts the I listen to say. There is a difference of being fast and playing fast.

is that the same as saying one must learn to fly before one can fly?

 

[BusQuets]

I'm pretty sure Wild is faster team than Capitals based on purely foot speed but Caps are playing much faster. Wild's passing was abysmal in the playoffs.

 

[Uberdachen]

Thought it seemed like in the playoffs the Wild's transition game was massively adversely affected by having the forwards trend more defensively to compensate for Suter's absence. They didn't forecheck as deep, they backchecked more tenaciously, and as a result were out of their regular places to ever have a chance at receiving a pass in motion across the blue line and were left flat-footed in front of continuous Jets entry attempts.

On the other hand, Brodin's been unable to hit a guy in motion or in a non-suicidal position for a while now, so maybe it was just bringing that to the forefront.

Anyways, can't wait to see what way the new guy finds to fall short.

 

[BigT2002]

Thought it seemed like in the playoffs the Wild's transition game was massively adversely affected by having the forwards trend more defensively to compensate for Suter's absence. They didn't forecheck as deep, they backchecked more tenaciously, and as a result were out of their regular places to ever have a chance at receiving a pass in motion across the blue line and were left flat-footed in front of continuous Jets entry attempts.

On the other hand, Brodin's been unable to hit a guy in motion or in a non-suicidal position for a while now, so maybe it was just bringing that to the forefront.

Anyways, can't wait to see what way the new guy finds to fall short.

IDK, they looked scared to get hit most of the time. The Wild have never matched up extremely well with big-bodied teams it feels like.

 

[SomethingGeneric]

IDK, they looked scared to get hit most of the time. The Wild have never matched up extremely well with big-bodied teams it feels like.

No this is totally inaccurate and false memory after a series loss. The Wild more then held their own in the physical play department. Sure everyone remembers the big buf hits but it was the times where the Wild would finally gain control of the puck only to dump it deep and lose the forecheck (a form of physical play for sure) or even worse gain the forecheck and fail to get a shot on net that killed them. They were getting a few chances while Parise was playing but they didn't really get any after he got hurt. Losing Suter also had to hurt their offensive rhythm. Like his offensive style or not he pretty much does the same thing every time so he's probably very easy to play with in the offensive zone. Still... This is why I want Kaprizov to come over, I think at a minimum he will be a wiz on the powerplay. We need people who can do stuff with the puck in the offensive zone which is easier said then done in today's NHL.

 

[57special]

No this is totally inaccurate and false memory after a series loss. The Wild more then held their own in the physical play department. Sure everyone remembers the big buf hits but it was the times where the Wild would finally gain control of the puck only to dump it deep and lose the forecheck (a form of physical play for sure) or even worse gain the forecheck and fail to get a shot on net that killed them. They were getting a few chances while Parise was playing but they didn't really get any after he got hurt. Losing Suter also had to hurt their offensive rhythm. Like his offensive style or not he pretty much does the same thing every time so he's probably very easy to play with in the offensive zone. Still... This is why I want Kaprizov to come over, I think at a minimum he will be a wiz on the powerplay. We need people who can do stuff with the puck in the offensive zone which is easier said then done in today's NHL.

I also think that the Wild didn't show the speed to get into the offensive zone and harass their D, who I thought were their weakness, you can see what Vegas did with their speed, with great success. I think the physical stuff can be overblown, and in the future, anyway, I don't see the Wild being at a disadvantage there. I worry about a lack of speed.

 

[Wabit]

I also think that the Wild didn't show the speed to get into the offensive zone and harass their D, who I thought were their weakness, you can see what Vegas did with their speed, with great success. I think the physical stuff can be overblown, and in the future, anyway, I don't see the Wild being at a disadvantage there. I worry about a lack of speed.

Vegas plays with a confidence/drive the Wild don't have (similar to the Hawks in their Cup runs). I really think that's a bigger deal than their team speed. They don't get discouraged/deflate when they get scored on, or the other goalie is standing on his head.

 

[BigT2002]

No this is totally inaccurate and false memory after a series loss. The Wild more then held their own in the physical play department. Sure everyone remembers the big buf hits but it was the times where the Wild would finally gain control of the puck only to dump it deep and lose the forecheck (a form of physical play for sure) or even worse gain the forecheck and fail to get a shot on net that killed them. They were getting a few chances while Parise was playing but they didn't really get any after he got hurt. Losing Suter also had to hurt their offensive rhythm. Like his offensive style or not he pretty much does the same thing every time so he's probably very easy to play with in the offensive zone. Still... This is why I want Kaprizov to come over, I think at a minimum he will be a wiz on the powerplay. We need people who can do stuff with the puck in the offensive zone which is easier said then done in today's NHL.

Was talking more just in general, not just Winnipeg. When they seemed to have issues with Colorado it was when players like Landenskog or their bigger players started to rough them up. Took the Wild off their game. Same thing when they played St. Louis last year. The Wild looked off because they were trying to play a physical (fire with fire) type game.

Wild seem to flourish the most when they were allowing speed to dictate the play in the series they've been in. The issue they seemed to have ultimately with the Jets is there wasn't a lot of speed and passing was atrocious up into the neutral zone.