Player Discussion Loui Eriksson

[HSD19]

Right so my understanding is signing bonuses get paid on July 1st. So on July 2nd, 2019 he will be owed $9M more over 3 years.

If Dion Phaneuf is movable, then that is also movable.

Dion Phaneuf was move able because the sens had to take a bad contract back in Gaborik. Unless we're willing to fork up a pick or take on another bad contract there is no way we're moving him.

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

Dion Phaneuf was move able because the sens had to take a bad contract back in Gaborik. Unless we're willing to fork up a pick or take on another bad contract there is no way we're moving him.

I would trade him for Ryan.

f*** Lucic. He can rot in Edmonton.

 

[HSD19]

I would trade him for Ryan.

**** Lucic. He can rot in Edmonton.

Yep would be terrible move to trade him for Lucic. I would do it for Ryan.. if in fact it is easier to buyout Ryan?

 

[RobertKron]

I agree, all players are moveable. However, moving Eriksson probably means the Canucks are taking a terrible contract back from someone.

He was coming off a 30 goal season, in real time this wasn't a bad signing. Looking back now, it's terrible but you don't have that benefit in real time.

Looks like the buy out would be way too expensive, until his last year.

Were stuck with Loui. Plus, Benning more than likely thinks he's had a great year.

Of course it was a bad signing in real time. A “rebuilding” team signed a 31 year old to a relatively large contract until he’s 37 with an NMC/NTC. It was absolutely asinine.

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

Yep would be terrible move to trade him for Lucic. I would do it for Ryan.. if in fact it is easier to buyout Ryan?

Ryan is younger and, while he has been bad for a couple years now, his best years were on the West Coast. And the Senators are an even worse team than we are.

If we were to buy him out here are the details:

• Bobby Ryan is 31 years old at the date of the buyout
• Salary remaining: $22,000,000 (with an additional $8,000,000 in signing bonuses remaining)
• The buyout ratio is 2/3, which results in a total buyout cost of $14,666,667
• There are 4 years remaining on this contract
• The buyout will be spread out over 8 years
• The annual buyout cost is $1,833,333
• The buyout cap hit is displayed in the far right column ($3.5 million for 4 seasons, $1.5 million for 4 seasons)

Lucic

• Milan Lucic is 30 years old at the date of the buyout
• Salary remaining: $11,000,000 (with an additional $15,000,000 in signing bonuses remaining)
• The buyout ratio is 2/3, which results in a total buyout cost of $7,333,333
• There are 5 years remaining on this contract
• The buyout will be spread out over 10 years
• The annual buyout cost is $733,333
• The buyout cap hit is displayed in the far right column (all over the place...some years as high as $5.75 million and some as low as 770k...mostly around 3-4 million. What a disaster of a contract)

Eriksson

• Loui Eriksson is 32 years old at the date of the buyout
• Salary remaining: $6,000,000 (with an additional $14,000,000 in signing bonuses remaining)
• The buyout ratio is 2/3, which results in a total buyout cost of $4,000,000
• There are 4 years remaining on this contract
• The buyout will be spread out over 8 years
• The annual buyout cost is $500,000
• The buyout cap hit is displayed in the far right column ($5.5 million for 3 seasons, 550k for 5)

 

[Eddy Punch Clock]

Of course it was a bad signing in real time. A “rebuilding” team signed a 31 year old to a relatively large contract until he’s 37 with an NMC/NTC. It was absolutely asinine.

Pretty sad when you consider that if Eriksson had contributed as planned we might be just a tad higher in the standings and thus a worse draft position.

There was never any winning situation.

 

[manroth19]

Lucic is awful. Never ever trade eriksson for him. Let eriksson rot on sutters wing and on the pk and when his contract is near the end and the NTC is done trade him to a floor team. 3 mill in salary and 6 mill in cap just screams zona

 

[HSD19]

Lucic is awful. Never ever trade eriksson for him. Let eriksson rot on sutters wing and on the pk and when his contract is near the end and the NTC is done trade him to a floor team. 3 mill in salary and 6 mill in cap just screams zona

And also screams us giving up a pick...Coyotes have been smart in doing this they did it in picking up Datsyuk and Bolland contracts. Plus if Jimbo is still around I don't see Loui going anywhere.

 

[manroth19]

By the time oj petterson dahlen dahlin(pray) are all done their elc Louie’s contract is tradeable. His contract is obviously brutal but he’s still better then some of the other scrubs on this team.

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

The only real way out of this unscathed in some way is if he goes on LTIR for whatever reason and retires.

 

[manroth19]

And also screams us giving up a pick...Coyotes have been smart in doing this they did it in picking up Datsyuk and Bolland contracts. Plus if Jimbo is still around I don't see Loui going anywhere.

Different situations tho. The scenario I’m talking the cap hit will be twice as much as the actual dollars (big for a budget team) bolland had a lot of term left and datsyuk all Arizona got was a handful of spots moved up in the draft I think (might have been a filler 4th or something)

Edit - they added a late 50’s pick and some scrub

 

[Dab]

In terms of contracts I'd rather have (forget the player who cares at this point- they all bad)

Ryan>Lucic>Eriksson

That Eriksson contract is probably one of the worst contracts signed in recent memory. You seriously can't do anything with it. Eriksson's agent did an unbelievable job of securing every dime and airtight job security.

 

[RobertKron]

Pretty sad when you consider that if Eriksson had contributed as planned we might be just a tad higher in the standings and thus a worse draft position.

There was never any winning situation.

The entire basis of the decision was wrongheaded. There was no good outcome. Even if the contract in isolation ended up not being comically awful, it was still something the Canucks had no business doing.

 

[cc]

In terms of contracts I'd rather have (forget the player who cares at this point- they all bad)

Ryan>Lucic>Eriksson

That Eriksson contract is probably one of the worst contracts signed in recent memory. You seriously can't do anything with it. Eriksson's agent did an unbelievable job of securing every dime and airtight job security.

If all things being equal, you keep the bad contract with less term

 

[Eye of Ra]

if he gets traded to a good team he will put up 70 points.

 

[DDRhockey]

if he gets traded to a good team he will put up 70 points.

No just stop. He is garbage.

 

[LeftCoast]

I don't think there is any chance Erkisson can be traded without giving up a premium asset (draft pick) to get someone to take on his contract. The only real options going forward are:

• Retirement - he has $6M in Salary and $14M in signing bonuses remaining on his contract. That's a lot to walk away from, so he could be willing to mail it in for another 4 years. There is no chance he will make that kind of money playing in Sweden.
• Bury him in the minors - his NMC becomes a NTC on July 1, so he is eligible to be sent to Utica. By burying him in the minors we save $1.025 in cap space (which is more than the buyout cap saving). This is the most logical approach, but I'm not sure this mgmt group has the pills to do it - they won't even healthy scratch him this year. Would Loui be willing to play out the remainder of his contract in the minors - being scratched often due to the veteran rule. At some point he will retire and return to Sweden.
• LTIR - maybe he could develop a Marian Hossa like skin rash or join Joffrey Lupul on Robidas Island, but I also doubt any of the parties involved would do this. They are not as cagey or ethically flexible as Lou Lamoriello - and for certain the league would punish the Canucks for this
• Buyout - unfortunately his contract is almost buyout proof. According to CapFriendly, the buyout cost would be $5.5M for the next 3 years, $3.5M in 2021-22 and then $500K for the next 4 years. So we would only get $500K in cap relief for the next 3 years, then $2.5M in the last year of his contract. Additionally you have to figure the cap hit of the player that replaces him. This could really hurt us in the 2 - 3 year range with Boeser, Stecher, Demko, Pettersson, etc. all being RFAs in the time frame.

There are other option - combinations. Bury him next season and buy him out the following season, etc., but in all buyout cases, the cap savings from a buyout are less than those from burying him, and if you send him to Utica long enough, he will retire at some point.

We do have to worry about cap space we have Boeser, Stecher, Pettersson, Demko etc. all hitting RFA in the next 3 to 4 seasons, and if Luongo retires in the next 4 years (likely) we will also have to absorb a massive cap hit for his recapture penalty (depending on when he retires - $2M over 4 years or up to $8.5M in the last year).

 

[Kryten]

I don't think there is any chance Erkisson can be traded without giving up a premium asset (draft pick) to get someone to take on his contract. The only real options going forward are:

• Retirement - he has $6M in Salary and $14M in signing bonuses remaining on his contract. That's a lot to walk away from, so he could be willing to mail it in for another 4 years. There is no chance he will make that kind of money playing in Sweden.
• Bury him in the minors - his NMC becomes a NTC on July 1, so he is eligible to be sent to Utica. By burying him in the minors we save $1.025 in cap space (which is more than the buyout cap saving). This is the most logical approach, but I'm not sure this mgmt group has the pills to do it - they won't even healthy scratch him this year. Would Loui be willing to play out the remainder of his contract in the minors - being scratched often due to the veteran rule. At some point he will retire and return to Sweden.
• LTIR - maybe he could develop a Marian Hossa like skin rash or join Joffrey Lupul on Robidas Island, but I also doubt any of the parties involved would do this. They are not as cagey or ethically flexible as Lou Lamoriello - and for certain the league would punish the Canucks for this
• Buyout - unfortunately his contract is almost buyout proof. According to CapFriendly, the buyout cost would be $5.5M for the next 3 years, $3.5M in 2021-22 and then $500K for the next 4 years. So we would only get $500K in cap relief for the next 3 years, then $2.5M in the last year of his contract. Additionally you have to figure the cap hit of the player that replaces him. This could really hurt us in the 2 - 3 year range with Boeser, Stecher, Demko, Pettersson, etc. all being RFAs in the time frame.

There are other option - combinations. Bury him next season and buy him out the following season, etc., but in all buyout cases, the cap savings from a buyout are less than those from burying him, and if you send him to Utica long enough, he will retire at some point.

We do have to worry about cap space we have Boeser, Stecher, Pettersson, Demko etc. all hitting RFA in the next 3 to 4 seasons, and if Luongo retires in the next 4 years (likely) we will also have to absorb a massive cap hit for his recapture penalty (depending on when he retires - $2M over 4 years or up to $8.5M in the last year).

Overall great post except for the Luongo hysteria at the end. Mr hurt groin isnt going to walk away from any money. Luongo has injury history compared to Hossas equipment allergy. If Benning signs any bloated UFA this summer it will be the final reason for a future cap crunch

 

[iceburg]

Just to make everyone feel a little better, Eriksson has received US $761,905 per goal in the last two seasons. That's more than 1M/goal CAD. But it's hard to quantify intangibles...

 

[LeftCoast]

Overall great post except for the Luongo hysteria at the end. Mr hurt groin isnt going to walk away from any money. Luongo has injury history compared to Hossas equipment allergy. If Benning signs any bloated UFA this summer it will be the final reason for a future cap crunch

There are a lot of reasons to be concerned about Luongo's cap recapture.

Luongo basically has $8.5M in "cap savings" to be "recaptured" over the remaining term of his original contract if/when he retires early. The most likely scenario is that he plays next season and then retires with a recapture penalty to Vancouver of $2.8M/year for 3 years (and another $1.2M to Florida).

In the last 3 years of Luongo's contract he earns $1.6M, then $1M for 2 years. That may seem like a lot to you and me, but for a guy who has been earning $6.7M for the last 7 years and $10M previous to that, it is chump change. Luongo is a pretty intelligent and articulate guy who has probably managed his finances well and probably has a lot of options after hockey. Hanging around in the LTIR twilight zone, showing up at training camp to have a medical exam and be placed back on IR each year, unable to discuss his "injury" or move on with his life, just to earn another $3.6M is probably not the best approach for him.

There is also little reason for Florida to support such an approach, because Florida doesn't usually spend to the cap anyways, and doesn't really need the LTIR cap relief. For Florida, the actual cash money paid out to Luongo ($3.6M over the final 3 years) is more important than the salary cap hit. Also - after next year, Florida's recapture penalty in the final 2 years becomes insignificant - $73K in 2020 and $0 in 2021. So the best move for Florida would be to play him, or LTIR him next season, then have him retire after the 2019 season. Their cap his is a measly $73K and Vancouvers is $4.2M for the final 2 years.

It would probably be better for us to try to acquire him from Florida and then put him on out LTIR - but since he has a modified NTC, it would require Luongo's consent. But Florida would have a lot of leverage in that trade.

 

[Kryten]

There are a lot of reasons to be concerned about Luongo's cap recapture.

Luongo basically has $8.5M in "cap savings" to be "recaptured" over the remaining term of his original contract if/when he retires early. The most likely scenario is that he plays next season and then retires with a recapture penalty to Vancouver of $2.8M/year for 3 years (and another $1.2M to Florida).

In the last 3 years of Luongo's contract he earns $1.6M, then $1M for 2 years. That may seem like a lot to you and me, but for a guy who has been earning $6.7M for the last 7 years and $10M previous to that, it is chump change. Luongo is a pretty intelligent and articulate guy who has probably managed his finances well and probably has a lot of options after hockey. Hanging around in the LTIR twilight zone, showing up at training camp to have a medical exam and be placed back on IR each year, unable to discuss his "injury" or move on with his life, just to earn another $3.6M is probably not the best approach for him.

There is also little reason for Florida to support such an approach, because Florida doesn't usually spend to the cap anyways, and doesn't really need the LTIR cap relief. For Florida, the actual cash money paid out to Luongo ($3.6M over the final 3 years) is more important than the salary cap hit. Also - after next year, Florida's recapture penalty in the final 2 years becomes insignificant - $73K in 2020 and $0 in 2021. So the best move for Florida would be to play him, or LTIR him next season, then have him retire after the 2019 season. Their cap his is a measly $73K and Vancouvers is $4.2M for the final 2 years.

It would probably be better for us to try to acquire him from Florida and then put him on out LTIR - but since he has a modified NTC, it would require Luongo's consent. But Florida would have a lot of leverage in that trade.

You make good points, It will be interesting. Zetterberg makes 3.5 next year then 1m in the following two final years as well. Eriksson is still an effective player for now and my biggest dislike of him apart from salary/production is his lack of body use to break up plays, he relies/attempts to use his stick instead

 

[Hit the post]

It would probably be better for us to try to acquire him from Florida and then put him on out LTIR - but since he has a modified NTC, it would require Luongo's consent. But Florida would have a lot of leverage in that trade.

I guess the NHL would take a dim view of a handshake agreement where we would take on a garbage contract from the Panthers (around the $3.6 million dollars total on another multi-year deal) & just shove that contract in the minors (to further limit that cap hit)?

 

[M2Beezy]

if he gets traded to a good team he will put up 70 points.

You mean in the AHL right?

 

[Melvin]

To this point has any team actually been hit with any significant cap re-capture?

Every team has found a way out of it and I am sure we will too.

 

[iceburg]

To this point has any team actually been hit with any significant cap re-capture?

Every team has found a way out of it and I am sure we will too.

Florida has very little incentive to be creative though. Unlike Chicago.