Player Discussion Loui Eriksson

[Melvin]

The complicating thing is that Florida has no incentive to find a way out of it? They can just let him retire with no impact and no need to be creative.

That isn't really true. Florida would get hit with a cap penalty too, just not as large as ours.

Having said that, you may be right in that Florida isn't necessarily a cap ceiling team and it doesn't matter to them as much.

The re-capture penalty is probably the dumbest one in the CBA, which inexplicably penalizes teams more the longer a player plays. It was clearly designed as a punishment to us from the petty and vindictive Brian Burke and it needs to be done away with.

 

[Jay Cee]

I really find it so silly people still cling to this Burke is bitter narrative, as if to say that he was out to get the Canucks. The NHL warned teams who made deals like this and said it would be dealt with. If anything Brian Burke was vindictive about teams who circumvented the cap and wanted to make sure they were penalized.

 

[me2]

I guess the NHL would take a dim view of a handshake agreement where we would take on a garbage contract from the Panthers (around the $3.6 million dollars total on another multi-year deal) & just shove that contract in the minors (to further limit that cap hit)?

I doubt they would care. Way worse has happened with all the Clarkson/Horton/Datsyuk/etc dead contract dealings. They didn't bat an eyelid. We could one of those Brassard 3-ways, Florida wants Sausagebun from Humbleberg Bejesus, the Bejesus trade him to us, we trade him to Florida with $1m retained.

 

[me2]

I really find it so silly people still cling to this Burke is bitter narrative, as if to say that he was out to get the Canucks. The NHL warned teams who made deals like this and said it would be dealt with. If anything Brian Burke was vindictive about teams who circumvented the cap and wanted to make sure they were penalized.

The only issue is they didn't allow teams to restructure/terminate the affected contracts. When you make big chances to the structure their needs to be the opportunity to adapt.

 

[Kryten]

The only issue is they didn't allow teams to restructure/terminate the affected contracts. When you make big chances to the structure their needs to be the opportunity to adapt.

Not a lawyer but fiddling with contracts sounds messy if its not just buyouts. The league wrote the rules, the league approved contracts. They should have just been grandfathered

 

[iceburg]

That isn't really true. Florida would get hit with a cap penalty too, just not as large as ours.

Having said that, you may be right in that Florida isn't necessarily a cap ceiling team and it doesn't matter to them as much.

The re-capture penalty is probably the dumbest one in the CBA, which inexplicably penalizes teams more the longer a player plays. It was clearly designed as a punishment to us from the petty and vindictive Brian Burke and it needs to be done away with.

This is the point. Since Florida isn't a cap team, the recapture is meaningless to them.

 

[tyhee]

Overall great post except for the Luongo hysteria at the end. Mr hurt groin isnt going to walk away from any money. Luongo has injury history compared to Hossas equipment allergy. If Benning signs any bloated UFA this summer it will be the final reason for a future cap crunch

The last two seasons of Luongo's contract are for $1 million per season. Before those two years come up Luongo will have earned $97,532,500 in NHL salary, minus a portion that has been rolled back because of the maximum players' share of hockey revenues.

It seems to me that in those circumstances with him having earned that much, unless he's managed to squander a large portion of it there will be next to no financial incentive for him to play. Imo if he plays at that stage, it will be because he is still enjoying it and feeling useful.

Some others have suggested he'll develop some magical injury, like a stubbed toe, to get on LTIR. That ignores the fact that the Canucks don't own his rights. Is there any reason for Florida to volunteer to pay Luongo $1 million to sit on the IRL to help the Canucks?

If Luongo retires with 2 seasons left in his contract the Canucks face a $4.26 million dollar penalty for each of the two seasons left on the contract, while Florida would face recapture of just $73,147 per season for two seasons. The Panthers aren't a team that ever spends to the cap anyway. The last ten seasons they've been under the cap by anywhere from $2.5 to $12.6 million. Last year it was $8.9 million, this season Capfriendly projects they'll be $6.9 million under the cap.

So Florida doesn't need to avoid their small recapture and has no incentive whatsoever to put Luongo on LTIR if it is at all questionble. Luongo doesn't need the money and wouldn't get much (by his standards) anyway. I can't see a fake injury happening.

There is the possibility of the Canucks, facing potential recapture, trading for his rights with the intention of placing him on LTIR. That is a little like waving a red flat in front of the league and daring them to charge, or at least call in their doctors to scrutinize whether the injury if valid.

It looks to me that we Canuck fans should hope he continues to perform at a high level and enjoys playing.

 

[F A N]

I can see Luongo wanting to play, but not as a 20 game type backup. $1M salary likely isn't enough of an incentive for him to go through that. But if he was still capable of contributing? I'm not sure that Luongo would be opposed to playing. Brodeur, Hasek, Joseph, and Belfour came back on a significantly reduced salary at one time.

 

[Isi]

I feel like Luongo and co will feel like they have to keep on playing until they inevitability LTIR themselves which seems not good for anyone

 

[me2]

The last two seasons of Luongo's contract are for $1 million per season. Before those two years come up Luongo will have earned $97,532,500 in NHL salary, minus a portion that has been rolled back because of the maximum players' share of hockey revenues.

It seems to me that in those circumstances with him having earned that much, unless he's managed to squander a large portion of it there will be next to no financial incentive for him to play. Imo if he plays at that stage, it will be because he is still enjoying it and feeling useful.

Some others have suggested he'll develop some magical injury, like a stubbed toe, to get on LTIR. That ignores the fact that the Canucks don't own his rights. Is there any reason for Florida to volunteer to pay Luongo $1 million to sit on the IRL to help the Canucks?

If Luongo retires with 2 seasons left in his contract the Canucks face a $4.26 million dollar penalty for each of the two seasons left on the contract, while Florida would face recapture of just $73,147 per season for two seasons. The Panthers aren't a team that ever spends to the cap anyway. The last ten seasons they've been under the cap by anywhere from $2.5 to $12.6 million. Last year it was $8.9 million, this season Capfriendly projects they'll be $6.9 million under the cap.

So Florida doesn't need to avoid their small recapture and has no incentive whatsoever to put Luongo on LTIR if it is at all questionble. Luongo doesn't need the money and wouldn't get much (by his standards) anyway. I can't see a fake injury happening.

There is the possibility of the Canucks, facing potential recapture, trading for his rights with the intention of placing him on LTIR. That is a little like waving a red flat in front of the league and daring them to charge, or at least call in their doctors to scrutinize whether the injury if valid.

It looks to me that we Canuck fans should hope he continues to perform at a high level and enjoys playing.

They could do a 3-way.

Florida trades Luongo to Arizona for a conditional 7th pick.
Arizona trades a cash dump (cap dump with big money) to Vancouver.
Vancouver trades a conditional 7th to Florida.
Arizona waives Luongo, he waits in Florida

What does everyone get?

Luongo gets free money and sits around at home.

Arizona saves real cash.

Florida gets out from undercap hit and gets a pick.

Canucks avoid Luongo cap penalty, but take on more cash hit.

 

[absolute garbage]

Is there any reason for Florida to volunteer to pay Luongo $1 million to sit on the IRL to help the Canucks?

In before Ryan Miller comes in and tells us how the woke god emperor, being three-steps-ahead, masterminded the Gudbranson-McCann trade on that premise.

"You are going to look so silly once the plan unfolds in front of your simple eyes".

And there you have it, it was Gillis' fault all along! Show me the light Jimbo. SHOW ME.

 

[m9]

I don't think there is any chance Erkisson can be traded without giving up a premium asset (draft pick) to get someone to take on his contract. The only real options going forward are:

• Retirement - he has $6M in Salary and $14M in signing bonuses remaining on his contract. That's a lot to walk away from, so he could be willing to mail it in for another 4 years. There is no chance he will make that kind of money playing in Sweden.
• Bury him in the minors - his NMC becomes a NTC on July 1, so he is eligible to be sent to Utica. By burying him in the minors we save $1.025 in cap space (which is more than the buyout cap saving). This is the most logical approach, but I'm not sure this mgmt group has the pills to do it - they won't even healthy scratch him this year. Would Loui be willing to play out the remainder of his contract in the minors - being scratched often due to the veteran rule. At some point he will retire and return to Sweden.
• LTIR - maybe he could develop a Marian Hossa like skin rash or join Joffrey Lupul on Robidas Island, but I also doubt any of the parties involved would do this. They are not as cagey or ethically flexible as Lou Lamoriello - and for certain the league would punish the Canucks for this
• Buyout - unfortunately his contract is almost buyout proof. According to CapFriendly, the buyout cost would be $5.5M for the next 3 years, $3.5M in 2021-22 and then $500K for the next 4 years. So we would only get $500K in cap relief for the next 3 years, then $2.5M in the last year of his contract. Additionally you have to figure the cap hit of the player that replaces him. This could really hurt us in the 2 - 3 year range with Boeser, Stecher, Demko, Pettersson, etc. all being RFAs in the time frame.

There are other option - combinations. Bury him next season and buy him out the following season, etc., but in all buyout cases, the cap savings from a buyout are less than those from burying him, and if you send him to Utica long enough, he will retire at some point.

We do have to worry about cap space we have Boeser, Stecher, Pettersson, Demko etc. all hitting RFA in the next 3 to 4 seasons, and if Luongo retires in the next 4 years (likely) we will also have to absorb a massive cap hit for his recapture penalty (depending on when he retires - $2M over 4 years or up to $8.5M in the last year).

I've talked about buying him out around here, but I will re-consider and say that burying him in the minors makes the mosts sense.. at least for the next couple of years.

Trade would be even better, obviously with retention. I think that a team might be willing to take a shot on a 50% retained Eriksson contract - that would essentially give them a 4 year, $12 million contract which is better than some other contracts that will be signed this summer.

 

[Melvin]

I think Seattle might represent our only opportunity to dump the contract, but we need new management by then.

 

[VanJack]

The Eriksson contract is an albatross, no doubt about it....but then I remember the Canucks only signed him because they lost out of the Lucic sweepstakes.....so one way or another, they were determined to blow their brains out with a ridiculous FA signing.....I can safely predict that by the time the two contracts limp through to a merciful conclusion, Lucic will be far more removed from being an NHL player than Eriksson.....small consolation unless Jimbo does the unthinkable and agrees with the Oilers to flip the two players.

 

[M2Beezy]

So didnt he sign here for 6 years to play with the Sedins? Still 4 more years of this catastrophe contract so does he demand a trade or ....

 

[Pavel96]

So didnt he sign here for 6 years to play with the Sedins? Still 4 more years of this catastrophe contract so does he demand a trade or ....

He signed here for a boatload of money. (that's a period after the word money)

 

[Zippgunn]

• Bury him in the minors - his NMC becomes a NTC on July 1, so he is eligible to be sent to Utica. By burying him in the minors we save $1.025 in cap space (which is more than the buyout cap saving). This is the most logical approach, but I'm not sure this mgmt group has the pills to do it - they won't even healthy scratch him this year. Would Loui be willing to play out the remainder of his contract in the minors - being scratched often due to the veteran rule. At some point he will retire and return to Sweden.
• .

This would be the dumbest idea of all since nobody seems to realize that literally nobody really wants to play in Vancouver which is why we have to hand out these outrageous contracts in the first place. Deliberately burying Eriksson in the minors sends out a clear signal to other potential FA's: don't sign in Van unless you can guarantee you will play great or they will try to ruin your career. Perhaps we should treat the Sedins retirement as the turning of the page and presented with a fresh start perhaps Loui will find a way to improve his game (which hasn't been all that terrible, just not anywhere near his pay scale) to the point where he can help the team develop their young prospects and perhaps help the team get into the playoffs next year which is not a ridiculous goal.

 

[pgj98m3]

This would be the dumbest idea of all since nobody seems to realize that literally nobody really wants to play in Vancouver which is why we have to hand out these outrageous contracts in the first place. Deliberately burying Eriksson in the minors sends out a clear signal to other potential FA's: don't sign in Van unless you can guarantee you will play great or they will try to ruin your career. Perhaps we should treat the Sedins retirement as the turning of the page and presented with a fresh start perhaps Loui will find a way to improve his game (which hasn't been all that terrible, just not anywhere near his pay scale) to the point where he can help the team develop their young prospects and perhaps help the team get into the playoffs next year which is not a ridiculous goal.

That is complete BS......the expectation is that a player will perform and for 6 million it is fair to expect at least good performance.

 

[me2]

This would be the dumbest idea of all since nobody seems to realize that literally nobody really wants to play in Vancouver which is why we have to hand out these outrageous contracts in the first place. Deliberately burying Eriksson in the minors sends out a clear signal to other potential FA's: don't sign in Van unless you can guarantee you will play great or they will try to ruin your career. Perhaps we should treat the Sedins retirement as the turning of the page and presented with a fresh start perhaps Loui will find a way to improve his game (which hasn't been all that terrible, just not anywhere near his pay scale) to the point where he can help the team develop their young prospects and perhaps help the team get into the playoffs next year which is not a ridiculous goal.

Nobody signs in LA, NY, TO, etc

 

[Zippgunn]

Nobody signs in LA, NY, TO, etc

Nobody signs with the Rangers? Hell, EVERYBODY decent ends up with the Rangers...

 

[me2]

Nobody signs with the Rangers? Hell, EVERTBODY decent ends up with the Rangers...

Lies. After what the Rangers did to Redden not even bad UFAs sign there.

 

[DL44]

Lies. After what the Rangers did to Redden not even bad UFAs sign there.

Nice set up and execution.



Eriksson may be hard pressed to be an offensive force again... but i think his skillset will hopefully compliment playing along side some of our upcoming inexperienced, maturing prospects.

We all know the critiques... but one thing Eriksson does well in the non-offensive zones is he's always on the right side of the puck. He does something positive defensively every game. also good along the boards.

He could be a good fit along side Pettersson. Do his board work for him..
Hell.. based on Jokinen, you could try Eriksson-Horvat-Boeser.
With Gaudette-Virtanen gelling... Eriksson as their responsible LWer.
Or just stack a defensive line with Eriksson and Sutter.

He'll continue to be a point of frustration for a large portion of the fanbase that cant move past his cap hit... but hes ours for the next 4 yrs and will be in the lineup whenever healthy because coaches like the things he does well... soooooo....
Move on.

 

[Kryten]

Lies. After what the Rangers did to Redden not even bad UFAs sign there.

Shattenkirk, Nash, Gaborik, Richards. Or I missed sarcasm

Edit. Imissed it, just read the previous comment. Damn you me2, I shouldve known better

 

[M2Beezy]

Shattenkirk, Nash, Gaborik, Richards. Or I missed sarcasm

Edit. Imissed it, just read the previous comment. Damn you me2, I shouldve known better

It was obvious i thought

 

[me2]

Nice set up and execution.



Eriksson may be hard pressed to be an offensive force again... but i think his skillset will hopefully compliment playing along side some of our upcoming inexperienced, maturing prospects.

He'll continue to be a point of frustration for a large portion of the fanbase that cant move past his cap hit... but hes ours for the next 4 yrs and will be in the lineup whenever healthy because coaches like the things he does well... soooooo....
Move on.

It's why I don't think he'd be sent to the minors. Some team would take him at 50% retained for his 2-way defensive game. $3m/y is better than the $5m it would cost in the minors.