Looking Back at the Leafs two years ago and what it means for rebuilding teams

[Halla]

so you need to surround a superstar talent (Matthews) with multiple quality players (Andersen, Rielly, Gardiner, Nylander, Marner, Kadri, JVR, Marleau)

Edmonton hasnt done nearly enough to support Mcdavid, ditto Buffalo with Eichel. That why those teams are still hot garbage and the leafs are gonna be a 100pt team 2 years after being the worst in the league

 

[Halla]

See step 5 of my post lol.

Ease up, they tanked got the talent, paid front office/coaching staff and got good.

Nothing I wrote wasn't true.

tanked for 1 year. they have picked top 3 once in 30+ years....so yeah

 

[crackdown44]

Are they really so good? I mean people talk as though the leafs have alteady achieved something. What exactly?

I don’t consider them a contender yet but they are clearly a top 10 team in the league, comfortably. To answer your question they haven’t accomplished anything. I’m just trying to evaluate teams based on their current rosters and how they’re playing. Playoffs are a whole different animal. Toronto could very well go out in the first round, they could also surprise some teams and make it considerably further. Same goes for any team making the playoffs, really

 

[LeafFever]

The right coach. Not really s big fan. He’s a decent coach but always had good players in Detroit. Seems like he bailed when they started to go downhill. Now he’s got s better base.
They’re OP is good. I’d give more credit to Mr. Devil than to Shanahan.
But then again, I’m looking from the outside. I may be wrong.

Babcock left when he became UFA as a coach and was offered the most money ever for a coach. He bailed on no one.
And "Decent" coach my you-know-what. What's the excuse in Toronto then? From dead last to 7th overall in 2 years.

 

[LeafFever]

Leafs never even got a chance to even be bridemaids for longer...don't see that changing anytime soon either.

Matthews is the next Sundin, cupless wonder....sorry let me clarify, not even a single finals series, did they even get in the semis?

Leafs already have much more talent for Matthews than Sundin ever did. Leafs will be an elite contender next season.
And yes, they made the conf finals twice with Sundin.
I fully expect the Leafs to win the President's trophy next season and be a cup favourite (They are tied for 4th overall as we speak BTW). They'll be better next year.
Sundin never had the likes of Nylander/Marner ETc to play on his wing.
Looks like wishful thinking on your part.

 

[frisco]

Babcock left when he became UFA as a coach and was offered the most money ever for a coach. He bailed on no one.
And "Decent" coach my you-know-what. What's the excuse in Toronto then? From dead last to 7th overall in 2 years.

Who led them to the last overall finish? Babcock came in and promised five years of pain. With the talent already on board that was a ridiculous statement made only to lower expectations and make M.B. look good when he knew he could turn things around in a couple of years. They tanked, won the lottery, and with the players already on the roster plus Matthews are a good team. People make it sound like Shanahan/Babcock performed some kind of miracle. They inherited a good talent base and got a little lucky.

My Best-Carey

 

[LeafFever]

Who led them to the last overall finish? Babcock came in and promised five years of pain. With the talent already on board that was a ridiculous statement made only to lower expectations and make M.B. look good when he knew he could turn things around in a couple of years. They tanked, won the lottery, and with the players already on the roster plus Matthews are a good team. People make it sound like Shanahan/Babcock performed some kind of miracle. They inherited a good talent base and got a little lucky.

My Best-Carey

Babcock did. But did not everyone expect that? They were by far the worst roster in the entire NHL. And I take issue with the "Tank" idea. That team was in another universe statistically compared to every other last placed team.
I am so glad you think the Leafs were so stacked now as an organization. We heard none of this on here 2 years ago.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

take note NHL, all you need to do to rebuild is suck for a decade and get 8 top 10 picks....

 

[LeafFever]

take note NHL, all you need to do to rebuild is suck for a decade and get 8 top 10 picks....

And trade the highest ones away...

 

[McDavidCrushedLarkin]

take note NHL, all you need to do to rebuild is suck for a decade and get 8 top 10 picks....

That doesn't count though according to them. Rebuild only started last year.

 

[Paris in Flames]

Who led them to the last overall finish? Babcock came in and promised five years of pain. With the talent already on board that was a ridiculous statement made only to lower expectations and make M.B. look good when he knew he could turn things around in a couple of years. They tanked, won the lottery, and with the players already on the roster plus Matthews are a good team. People make it sound like Shanahan/Babcock performed some kind of miracle. They inherited a good talent base and got a little lucky.

My Best-Carey

OR he was just assuming they don't win the lottery and get Matthews? Even with a dead last finish that's not a smart bet to make in the current system

That doesn't count though according to them. Rebuild only started last year.

You shouldn't mistake sucking for rebuilding. That Leafs team that was bad was very much trying to win. They didn't fully commit to the rebuild until the Kessel and Phaneuf trades BUT it's also why you can't look at the Leafs as a model of a rebuild because it never really happened.

Their rebuild was essentially "one year" because they had tried and failed to win and got Nylander, Marner, Rielly and Kadri as compensation but it's not a real rebuild if you're starting with that many pieces.

 

[LeafFever]

That doesn't count though according to them. Rebuild only started last year.

Seguin and Hamilton picks count as "The Rebuild". Love it.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

And trade the highest ones away...

hey, at least the Hamilton pick was only 9th overall.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

Seguin and Hamilton picks count as "The Rebuild". Love it.

considering they were traded for a "superstar" with the expectation that adding Kessel was the missing piece...yeah, it counts.

 

[McDavidCrushedLarkin]

Seguin and Hamilton picks count as "The Rebuild". Love it.

So making bad trades resets the rebuild clock and makes it like it never happened? Good to know, Edmonton never rebuilt yet.

 

[LeafFever]

HF in 2016- "Leafs Won't Sniff The Playoffs in 5+ Years. They are a Mess".
HF Now -"Leafs Had So Many Pieces Already And So Many Years to Rebuild".
That's wonderful. How come we never heard this 2 years ago?

 

[LeafFever]

considering they were traded for a "superstar" with the expectation that adding Kessel was the missing piece...yeah, it counts.

So that was a rebuild is the ridiculous point you are trying to make?

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

Leafs never even got a chance to even be bridemaids for longer...don't see that changing anytime soon either.

Matthews is the next Sundin, cupless wonder....sorry let me clarify, not even a single finals series, did they even get in the semis?

Since you asked, yes, twice with Sundin as captain (and 4 times in 10 years if you're interested).

 

[nickdawg95]

How come the Oilers and Sabres are a crap show then?

babs

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

take note NHL, all you need to do to rebuild is suck for a decade and get 8 top 10 picks....

And yet, you need to read this carefully now because it's the original premise of the whole thread, so many teams have done the same and have failed at it. Which brings it back full circle to the original question: what can those teams learn from the Leafs' rebuild? Not a bad question really. Instead of the scorn from Oilers fans (for instance), I would be actually wondering the exact same thing after 10 years of futility and an endless stream of top 10 picks.

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

salty oilers fan? nah can't be. enjoy the draft lottery bud!

See it’s these type of posts why people can’t take Leafs fans seriously. The arrogance is outstanding.

You guys are acting as if the Leafs have a manifest destiny for the cup. In reality, the Leafs haven’t won a series since 2004. Instead, we have Leafs fans acting like the Leafs are the greatest rebuild turnaround of all time. Maybe accomplish something in the playoffs before that? No, a seven game first round exit, the second exit in the last decade doesn’t amount to that.

I also like how Leafs fans can selectively pick when their rebuild started. Guess high picks like Luke Schenn or Nazim Kadri don’t count. Or even in that time, trading for Phil Kessel (which has already been said.)

You don’t get to magically choose two years ago and somehow forget the last decade of irrelevances

 

[LeafFever]

See it’s these type of posts why people can’t take Leafs fans seriously. The arrogance is outstanding.

You guys are acting as if the Leafs have a manifest destiny for the cup. In reality, the Leafs haven’t won a series since 2004. Instead, we have Leafs fans acting like the Leafs are the greatest rebuild turnaround of all time. Maybe accomplish something in the playoffs before that? No, a seven game first round exit, the second exit in the last decade doesn’t amount to that.

I also like how Leafs fans can selectively pick when their rebuild started. Guess high picks like Luke Schenn or Nazim Kadri don’t count. Or even in that time, trading for Phil Kessel (which has already been said.)

You don’t get to magically choose two years ago and somehow forget the last decade of irrelevances

So why was the predictions so bad on here in regards to the Leafs?

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

So why was the predictions so bad on here in regards to the Leafs?

Probably because your fan base is so damn arrogant.

 

[AppsSyl]

That doesn't count though according to them. Rebuild only started last year.

The rebuild began in January 2015. That is when Shanahan had finished evaluating the organization, fired Carlyle and got approval from the MLSE Board for a scorched earth rebuild.
Up until that point the team had tried to win and make playoffs, but they were just terrible and finished low enough to draft high a couple of times before that. Saying they were rebuilding earlier, because they had a couple pieces of their core (Rielly and Kadri) before Shanahan is silly. Every team has at least a couple decent pieces before they tear it down.

 

[Liminality]

So making bad trades resets the rebuild clock and makes it like it never happened? Good to know, Edmonton never rebuilt yet.

The Leafs changed their entire management. It's not like Burke and company were trying to tank, they just sucked.