Pre-Game Talk: Leafs @ Ottawa ACC 2.0 on 19th Sep Mod Warning Post #116

[Asif16*]

Whats the D pairings for tonight?

 

[Officer Fred]

Some fans want to put a lot of weight on the erratic lockout shortened results claiming Bobby Ryan and Clarkson are equals. I just used a single example to emphasize the error of their ways.

I showed that over the previous 300+ games prior to the lockout Ryan & Kessel have similar goal production.

Are you expecting Ryan and Clarkson to be comparables this season?

I was only arguing with Zeke, who claimed that Ryan was craptastic. I wouldn't have brought Kessel or Clarkson into the discussion otherwise. In my opinion, Kessel is ahead of Ryan. Who is ahead of Clarkson.

I'll argue both of those all day. IMO, though, Kessel>Ryan>>>Clarkson.

 

[Mess]

Exactly. It's the same reason why I wouldn't compare Kessel to Ryan before. Kessel was a #1 option and the main catalyst in his offense. Ryan was a #3 option with two of the best offensive producers in the league.

Exactly, and if Kessel played in Anaheim with Perry and Getzlaf he would be a similar #3 option just like Ryan was.

Ryan now centered by Spezza has the potential to score a lot of goals this season for Ottawa, much like Kessel with Bozak should have a similar goal production.

We seem to be on the same page.

 

[theIceWookie]

2012-13 .. Jiri Tlusty 23 goals .. Kessel 20 goals

How accurate are the anomalies of lockout shorten seasons, and much weight should be placed on them to make conclusions?

The smaller the sample set the more inaccurate the results, so full seasons under normal conditions are more accurate.

I expect the based on my 4 year projection of full seasons that Bobby Ryan and Phil Kessel potentially should be relatively close in goals. As the difference from 2008-09 - 2011-12 was 5 games played and 4 goal difference over 4 years of results.

Ryan and Clarkson are not similar style players, however Kessel is.

You're still missing an absolutely huge piece of context.

Kessel and Ryan score at a similar pace, or have so far in their careers. However Ryan's done it either not being the prime focus of top defensive competition or with a top line center playing with him. Kessel hasn't anywhere near the same level of linemates, and has played the last 4 seasons against top defensive competition game in and game out.

Ryan and Kessel are not similar players. Similar results do not equal same style. Even if we completely ignore Kessel's playmaking side of the game.

 

[Muston Atthews]

Randy really is a hard ass and I loves that too. Nobody can **** with us now, Our team is the hardest. Carlyle is one of the best coaches in the world. He has great attributes. Plays with the toughest.

Lol if I could havea signature this would be it

 

[Eb]

Lol if I could havea signature this would be it

Homerism at it's finest.

But I do love me some Carlyle.

 

[mikebel111*]

If kessel can score a PPG with bozak. Than when kadri fully develops in a couple years. I wouldn't be surprised if kessel reaches 95 + points in the future. Heck he has a chance to get 90 points this year.
Ryan is a good player. But I wouldn't call him elite. Kessel is in a whole new planet. Kessel has developed a compete level something I am not sure ryan has. Plus kessel along with an elite shot has gotten a elite playmaking game. Kessel IMO is one of the elite players in the game. Heck of a talent.
Remember in the draft. Teams were saying some might pick him over Sid the Kid. It makes sense. Both have great shots and elite playmakers. The one thing Crosby has over him is leadership and heart. Kessel is a good leader in his own self. However Crosby is just much better.

IMO, kessel is really underappreciated in Leafs nation. At least he doesn't care what others say about him.

 

[Phion Keneuf]

If kessel can score a PPG with bozak. Than when kadri fully develops in a couple years. I wouldn't be surprised if kessel reaches 95 + points in the future. Heck he has a chance to get 90 points this year.
Ryan is a good player. But I wouldn't call him elite. Kessel is in a whole new planet. Kessel has developed a compete level something I am not sure ryan has. Plus kessel along with an elite shot has gotten a elite playmaking game. Kessel IMO is one of the elite players in the game. Heck of a talent.
Remember in the draft. Teams were saying some might pick him over Sid the Kid. It makes sense. Both have great shots and elite playmakers. The one thing Crosby has over him is leadership and heart. Kessel is a good leader in his own self. However Crosby is just much better.

IMO, kessel is really underappreciated in Leafs nation. At least he doesn't care what others say about him.

One thing? Are you sure about that..... Lol.

 

[mikebel111*]

One thing? Are you sure about that..... Lol.

I meant one of the things.

 

[mikebel111*]

http://www.youtube.com/


nice video here

 

[BondraTime]

usually looking at numbers from 3+ seasons ago deceives more than it enlightens, from my experience.

Last 2 years:

W P.Kessel (26): 130gms, 57gls, 134pts, 28ht, 44bk, 19:57 (82gms, 36gls, 85pts, 18ht, 28bk)
W J.Lupul (30): 82gms, 36gls, 85pts, 141ht, 32bk, 18:07 (82gms, 36gls, 85pts, 141ht, 32bk)
W B.Ryan (26): 128gms, 42gls, 87pts, 193ht, 53bk, 17:43 (82gms, 27gls, 56pts, 124ht, 34bk)
W J.VanRiemsdyk (24): 91gms, 29gls, 56pts, 92ht, 33bk, 17:15 (82gms, 26gls, 51pts, 83ht, 30bk)
W D.Clarkson (29): 128gms, 45gls, 70pts, 253ht, 25bk, 16:50 (82gms, 29gls, 45pts, 162ht, 16bk)

in terms of more recent relevant performance, the most reasonable leaf comparison for Bobby would be fellow 2nd overall pick VanRiemsdyk.

There's a chance (though far from a guarantee) that Bobby gets back to his peak 70pt type production again, though....but that still puts him well behind the likes of Kessel and Lupul who have both been PPG+ the past couple of years, while a guy like JVR has a chance to get into that 70pt range, too.

I would hate to see your predictions on Lupul when you guys got him.
His stats prior to the indicate he shoud be a 45 point player
He has been PPG for 100 games, not the past few years

 

[UsernameWasTaken]

what time/channel is it on?

 

[fahad203]

It's going to be really different this year. So many new players added, it will almost feel like a different Leafs team

It's been a long time since I got this excited about this team. I really hope we can insert a rookie or two.

 

[Raym11]

this thread is just loaded with homerism and bs lol

Excited to see Ryan, hoping we blow them out though

 

[zeke]

I would hate to see your predictions on Lupul when you guys got him.
His stats prior to the indicate he shoud be a 45 point player
He has been PPG for 100 games, not the past few years

I predicted Lupul to be a ~50ish point winger if he received 2nd line minutes, because that's what he had done most of his career. Fortunately, he's stepped it up to a whole new level with the Leafs, putting up super-elite production with first line minutes, but no, I would never have predicted that.

 

[Atomos2]

I would hate to see your predictions on Lupul when you guys got him.
His stats prior to the indicate he shoud be a 45 point player
He has been PPG for 100 games, not the past few years

Contrary to popular opinion, getting 100 pts in 100 gms is actually pretty hard to do.

 

[Pi]

Contrary to popular opinion, getting 100 pts in 100 gms is actually pretty hard to do.

True. This isn't some random 100 games over his career. This is 100 consecutive games/duration with the Leafs that he's been PPG.

Lupul was always a talented player but the depth on Anaheim as well as his injuries just buried him.

On the Leafs, he gets to play with Kessel or Kadri, he goes into those dangerous areas that I don't think he ever went in before.

 

[BIitz]

Lupul vs Ryan would be a much better debate.

Kessel vs Ryan is literally unfair to Ryan.

 

[Green Snow Storm]

I was only arguing with Zeke, who claimed that Ryan was craptastic. I wouldn't have brought Kessel or Clarkson into the discussion otherwise. In my opinion, Kessel is ahead of Ryan. Who is ahead of Clarkson.

I'll argue both of those all day. IMO, though, Kessel>Ryan>>>Clarkson.

I agree, but more like Kessel>>Ryan>>Clarkson

 

[Penalty Kill Icing*]

Dion ahead of today's game:

[NHL]445573[/NHL]


Thanks Hf for embedding NHL.com videos now.

 

[BIitz]

Why does he always wear that freaking Red Bull hat?

 

[Pyrophorus]

Abbott, Frattin and Stalberg all have something in common.

All were finalists for the Hobey Baker.
Would Miele have a role with us?

 

[SprDaVE]

Why does he always wear that freaking Red Bull hat?

Sponsor.

 

[theIceWookie]

Why does he always wear that freaking Red Bull hat?

Probably because he's paid too lol

 

[MapleLeafs9]

Why does he always wear that freaking Red Bull hat?

Because he's been a spokesperson for Red Bull for a few years now.