Ken King; Flames Ownership no longer pursuing new arena in Calgary

[snovalleyhockeyfan]

mureay Edwards is just great at bluffing.

Moving the team from
Calgary would cost him hundreds of millions. He’s not that stupid.

Also, it’s not just his decision, it’s the NHLs as they have to approve a relocation/set relocation fee. Good luck getting the other owners to move a profitable venture to some market in the USA that’s going to suck hundreds of millions of dollars before it turns profitable (if it ever does).

Not to mention the Flames get more views on TV per game then the Rangers... or any American team for that matter.

Exactly. Hence why I noted on the Seattle board that I and most of the savvy Seattle people do not see a Flames move anytime soon. BTW, here's hoping Edwards and his crew doesn't make the same mistake Katz and Co. did by snooping around Seattle before getting their arena built.........wouldn't want Edwards and his band to have to be ambushed by local media in Seattle and have to go back to Calgary with their heads between their legs having to publicly apologize in the local paper for their trip.......

 

[CorbeauNoir]

How do you guys still not understand how this works? In this situation Edwards wouldn't 'move' the team, he'd sell it to SOMEONE ELSE who would move the team into a facility they already own - of which there are now multiple candidates to choose from. This isn't some scout-other-owners-arenas ferret-the-team-away-driving-the-bus scenario. If he has any kind of financial acumen he's likely plotted out the diminishing cost-to-profit ratio his increasingly out-of-date infastructure is providing him (and Calgary's eroding local corporate landscape needed to make a professional team viable in this, the 21st century) and has his cut-off point. Cross that point and he pulls the ripcord and bails out, QC style.

What the new buyer decides to do or how profitable the team is once the transaction is finalized is no longer his problem. Edwards actually has a pretty good opportunity to pick up a shitload of cash going forward while removing a potential future financial albatross off his neck at the same time.

 

[Dack]

If they move they move. I honestly don't go to enough Flames games to care and I don't think I know anyone who does.

I love hockey and like the team but I'm watching the games on TV anyways I don't mind streaming the games or getting an NHLTV subscription.

I doubt that a move is approved by the NHL anytime soon though.

 

[StreetHawk]

If they move they move. I honestly don't go to enough Flames games to care and I don't think I know anyone who does.

I love hockey and like the team but I'm watching the games on TV anyways I don't mind streaming the games or getting an NHLTV subscription.

I doubt that a move is approved by the NHL anytime soon though.

With Katz spending $120 Mill on a house in Cali, I doubt that will make the gov and people in Calgary more inclined to go with the flames proposal.

Shows that NHL owners have money, but aren't willing to spend it on their business.

Once Houston and Seattle are taken, that's it for the big us markets. KC, Milwaukee ( bucks getting a new arena shortly.). Don't think these smaller markets will make the flames worth more than what they are in Calgary.

 

[djpatm]

Owell.

If the owners don't want to make a fair deal then that's all there is to it.

The city cannot afford to be handcuffed by funding almost all of an arena for a bunch of billionaires so that they can make more money.

 

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

I think they could've gotten all the politics of it done by 2006 when the boom was happening and the Flames were hot (literally).

But I will say, Calgary is one of the top three places in the world to host the Winter Olympics, and if they are making a bid in 2026 they better build a state of the art arena.

 

[CokenoPepsi]

City of Calgary should not budge.

NHL wpuld come running back in a few years

 

[Ciao]

If the Flames need a new arena they should build one. Nothing stopping them, and their business is profitable enough to do so.

No need for dipping into the public purse here.

I thought Alberta is the Canadian home of free enterprise and self-reliance?

 

[Oilers Propagandist]

If they move they move. I honestly don't go to enough Flames games to care and I don't think I know anyone who does.

I love hockey and like the team but I'm watching the games on TV anyways I don't mind streaming the games or getting an NHLTV subscription.

I doubt that a move is approved by the NHL anytime soon though.

Oilers will take care of you bruv.

 

[Oilers Propagandist]

With Katz spending $120 Mill on a house in Cali, I doubt that will make the gov and people in Calgary more inclined to go with the flames proposal.

Shows that NHL owners have money, but aren't willing to spend it on their business.

Once Houston and Seattle are taken, that's it for the big us markets. KC, Milwaukee ( bucks getting a new arena shortly.). Don't think these smaller markets will make the flames worth more than what they are in Calgary.

After the arena deal was done he sold the rexall pharmacy chain for $2 billion. He's doing a bunch of real estate and owns some of a Hollywood production company. Of course he has more actual cash now. Has nothing to do with him having all of that money while negotiating for the arena.

 

[uhlaw97]

Is there any serious chance that Calgary would move? Seems like a "core" NHL city. If it did, then what would be the odds of Houston being a new location?

 

[Oilers Propagandist]

If the Flames need a new arena they should build one. Nothing stopping them, and their business is profitable enough to do so.

No need for dipping into the public purse here.

I thought Alberta is the Canadian home of free enterprise and self-reliance?

Oil reliant. When it busts so do a lot of jobs. We are not diversifying our economy like some of the Middle East countries are doing (Qatar, UAE, Kuwait and recently Saudi Arabia. When we run out, we're bodied.

 

[muddywaters]

Oilers will take care of you bruv.

I feel bad for you .... Edmonton is not Calgary , no matter how much you wish it was .... I wish your city nothing but the best .... look , if the Flames did leave Calgary how long would it take until the Oilers would try and relocate here , just like all your friends and relatives ... even if there is an agreement up there to keep them in Edmonton ... lets get serious ... be happy with your Edmontonness , celebrate it ... live it ... be thankful you live in the same province as Calgary and our Rocky Mountains ...

 

[Melrose Munch]

Apples and oranges. I don't think it's a question of comparing city sizes but assessing two different groups' willingness to properly fund a project from which they will be greatly profiting. A private group is funding the Seattle project and not the city itself. Here in Calgary a private group should be fully funding our arena project as well.

Size does matter ..... Seattle GDP 330 billion .... Seattle metro area - GDP 2016 | Statistic ..... Calgary GDP 115 billion .... Calgary Economic Indicators | Calgary Economic Development ....

But more people watch hockey in Calgary, so there should be more money for this. I am with Mike Jones here.

mureay Edwards is just great at bluffing.

Moving the team from
Calgary would cost him hundreds of millions. He’s not that stupid.

Also, it’s not just his decision, it’s the NHLs as they have to approve a relocation/set relocation fee. Good luck getting the other owners to move a profitable venture to some market in the USA that’s going to suck hundreds of millions of dollars before it turns profitable (if it ever does).

Not to mention the Flames get more views on TV per game then the Rangers... or any American team for that matter.

The Rangers are worth 1.5 billion dollars. TV is about content and not views in this case.

 

[SunDancer]

How do you guys still not understand how this works? In this situation Edwards wouldn't 'move' the team, he'd sell it to SOMEONE ELSE who would move the team into a facility they already own - of which there are now multiple candidates to choose from. This isn't some scout-other-owners-arenas ferret-the-team-away-driving-the-bus scenario. If he has any kind of financial acumen he's likely plotted out the diminishing cost-to-profit ratio his increasingly out-of-date infastructure is providing him (and Calgary's eroding local corporate landscape needed to make a professional team viable in this, the 21st century) and has his cut-off point. Cross that point and he pulls the ripcord and bails out, QC style.

What the new buyer decides to do or how profitable the team is once the transaction is finalized is no longer his problem. Edwards actually has a pretty good opportunity to pick up a ****load of cash going forward while removing a potential future financial albatross off his neck at the same time.

If the new Canes owner was obligated to sign a 7-year non-relocation agreement, why wouldn't the same apply to a new owner in Calgary? I thought that was the standard.

 

[McGenerational]

Meh, the weather in Seattle is better anyway.

 

[powerstuck]

Meh, the weather in Seattle is better anyway.

For a winter sport, rain really gets down on your morale you know.

 

[CorbeauNoir]

If the new Canes owner was obligated to sign a 7-year non-relocation agreement, why wouldn't the same apply to a new owner in Calgary? I thought that was the standard.

If this 600-700mil US price tag being tossed about is anything close to accurate who's going to be left in Calgary who can afford it? Especially if they're also going to be expected to pay their own way on a new arena on top of that.

 

[Melrose Munch]

If the new Canes owner was obligated to sign a 7-year non-relocation agreement, why wouldn't the same apply to a new owner in Calgary? I thought that was the standard.

If this 600-700mil US price tag being tossed about is anything close to accurate who's going to be left in Calgary who can afford it? Especially if they're also going to be expected to pay their own way on a new arena on top of that.

Corbeau just nailed it. No arena.

 

[CorbeauNoir]

Corbeau just nailed it. No arena.

My argument has been that Calgary's broader economic situation put the Flames in trouble regardless of whether they build a new facility or not, but yes it certainly doesn't help.

 

[Melrose Munch]

My argument has been that Calgary's broader economic situation put the Flames in trouble regardless of whether they build a new facility or not, but yes it certainly doesn't help.

Fair enough, and I agree.

 

[SunDancer]

If this 600-700mil US price tag being tossed about is anything close to accurate who's going to be left in Calgary who can afford it? Especially if they're also going to be expected to pay their own way on a new arena on top of that.

It wouldn't be the first time that a new NHL owner appears out of nowhere. Just this week it was reported that multiple parties were interested in buying the Sens and you'd think Calgary has the more appealing market.

 

[Fourier]

If the Flames need a new arena they should build one. Nothing stopping them, and their business is profitable enough to do so.

No need for dipping into the public purse here.

I thought Alberta is the Canadian home of free enterprise and self-reliance?

Do you have any evidence that what you say is true...that they make enough money to justify this investment because I sincerely doubt that they do.

 

[KevFu]

If the new Canes owner was obligated to sign a 7-year non-relocation agreement, why wouldn't the same apply to a new owner in Calgary? I thought that was the standard.

It's important to know WHY that non-relocation agreement is "standard." And who it's standard for. The entire reason behind the NHL fighting for some teams to stay or rubber-stamping some relocations is so that cities keep building brand new arenas and gifting them the the NHL owners.

The NHL couldn't let the Coyotes or Predators leave cities that JUST built brand new arenas and gave them to the owners on pretty decent terms. There was obviously more to it than that with Arizona (the whole NHL gets to dictate, not a bankruptcy judge).

But WIN, MIN, QUE and HART in the 1990s, you had old buildings. If they had 25-year leases, those were essentially up. 30-year leases had few left and 1970s prices (Minnesota's was a $220,000 buyout). You had two owners willing to sell, and no one willing to buy and play in an antiquated venue that didn't offer the revenue streams. You had two owners not selling, with no lease tying them to the city, and they could move wherever they wanted.

How many years are left on Carolina's lease, for a building that opened in 1999? That's why there's a 7-year no relocation clause.

The NHL is going to let King move the Flames wherever he wants if the lease expires and he doesn't sell the team, just like the North Stars, Whalers and Islanders.
If he sells the team, the NHL is going to look FIRST for someone to buy the Flames and negotiate with Calgary to keep them there, which is what they did with the Jets 1.0, Quebec, and Atlanta.
If no one is interested in buying them to play in the Saddledome while they work on a new arena in Calgary, then the NHL will look at all the possible owners in other markets and steer the sale to their desired result.

 

[KevFu]

If the Flames need a new arena they should build one. Nothing stopping them, and their business is profitable enough to do so.

No need for dipping into the public purse here.

I thought Alberta is the Canadian home of free enterprise and self-reliance?

You're not wrong. But that's also not how the world works. If your choices are build an arena in Calgary yourself, or some other city offers you to build one for you... it's a relatively easy choice.

Even if you're a Calgary native and loyal to Calgary, most people who get sports ownership money didn't get it by being sentimental. They got it by playing hardball.

You might love your city and your job. You're looking to buy a new house. Someone offers you a job for the same money AND a free brand-new house? You're probably moving.