JVR-Bozak-Marner or JVR-Bozak-Brown ?

[Gary Nylund]

Yep.

Curiously, for a team with so many "blown leads" last year, the target never seems to go to the "shutdown" line.

To me, the other weird thing is that we never talk about the defensive pairings when the groupthinkers want to tear down our players. 5 guys are out there. Pretty sure Babcock thinks of them as a unit.

You seem to be under the impression that when we get a lead, Babcock sends out our shutdown line and leaves them there until the end of the game. Or is that groupthink?

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

You seem to be under the impression that when we get a lead, Babcock sends out our shutdown line and leaves them there until the end of the game. Or is that groupthink?

Obviously Kadri facing the best competition and dominating them isn't good enough for some people

 

[leaffaninvancouver]

You seem to be under the impression that when we get a lead, Babcock sends out our shutdown line and leaves them there until the end of the game. Or is that groupthink?

When the goalie was pulled last year and we were trying to hold onto a lead in the last two minutes. Bozak and JVR would almost never be on the ice.

It's easy to scapegoat but the simple fact is a lot of people contributed to blown leads last year.

 

[Gary Nylund]

When the goalie was pulled last year and we were trying to hold onto a lead in the last two minutes. Bozak and JVR would almost never be on the ice.

It's easy to scapegoat but the simple fact is a lot of people contributed to blown leads last year.

Sure, those guys weren't on the ice at those times but that in itself speaks volumes does it not?

As far as blown leads go, I agree that there was enough blame to go around. It was a big problem early last season that resolved itself as our guys got more experience. And despite last night, I don't expect it to be a problem this season either.

 

[leaffaninvancouver]

Sure, those guys weren't on the ice at those times but that in itself speaks volumes does it not?

As far as blown leads go, I agree that there was enough blame to go around. It was a big problem early last season that resolved itself as our guys got more experience. And despite last night, I don't expect it to be a problem this season either.

I'm not saying they should be, they have a role and it's not be on the ice to protect a lead with two minutes left. I'm just annoyed with the sheer amount of blame directed towards them and no one else.

People have whipping boys and once they pick them it seems like no matter how they play people will criticize. Look at last night and how some of the same people felt the need to criticize Bozak despite the fact he had a pretty solid game. When players play poorly they deserve to be criticized but too many people here don't care about how they played that game, they just care if they can find a flaw so they can "win" an argument online it feels like.

 

[The Apologist]

I'm not saying they should be, they have a role and it's not be on the ice to protect a lead with two minutes left. I'm just annoyed with the sheer amount of blame directed towards them and no one else.

People have whipping boys and once they pick them it seems like no matter how they play people will criticize. Look at last night and how some of the same people felt the need to criticize Bozak despite the fact he had a pretty solid game. When players play poorly they deserve to be criticized but too many people here don't care about how they played that game, they just care if they can find a flaw so they can "win" an argument online it feels like.

It's true. There are some on here that will blame Bozak no matter what. There are others who pick on Hyman no matter what. Then some who pick on Naz/ Andersen/JVR/ MoRiles/Gards no matter what. You can generally tell who they are just based on their responses.

I am one of the few who has been a fan of Bozak's since day one. Not because he is a perfect, blame free hockey player but because to me he represents someone who was never supposed to make it, someone who has been nothing but a team player since day one. He represents someone who has quite frankly given the finger to all the scouts, managers and know it alls at every level he has played.
He cost us nothing, not even a draft pick. He plays his heart out every shift and plays wherever he is asked to. He puts up points no matter who he is with.
He will never be that solid two way guy, but neither will JVR, Nylander, Marner (despite the myths out there that he already is) and many other NHlers. Some guys are offensive players, some are almost exclusively defence. Thast who they are, and not one single NHL team is made up of 23 200ft players.

To me, he is the kind of guy I would want around my rookies, someone who exemplifies working your butt off for everything you have.

To those who want to legitimately discuss players and their roles (90% of the people who are on here generally), engage them. The rest, just ignore honestly.

 

[Pookie]

Obviously Kadri facing the best competition and dominating them isn't good enough for some people

When an opponent is trailing, which of their lines do you think they put out there most often?

Maybe their top line?

I've been told our shutdown line plays against the opposition's top line.

Which.... come with me on a logic exploration... would generally mean that the shutdown line plays frequently in the late stages of games.

See? Not hard. Tell the group.

 

[Kiwi]

I still have a weird idea that jvr and carri ck will be traded for Vatanen once he is healthy.

They have
Manson Fowler
Lindholm Montoir.
BeAuch. Vatanen
Bieksa.



I would do JVR for dehaan as well but I guess that’s a no go. I think something in St. Louis maybe?

I'm not sure how much of an upgrade Vatanen would be, he's an undersized PMD with an average defensive game, that's not the best fit with our particular needs right now

If this team is playing well at the TDL I'd be surprised if we moved JVR, if anything I'd think we're more likely to add to the backend by trading futures and trying to keep the team in tact for a cup run

 

[RLF]

Pairing him with defensively superior linemates wouldn't necessarily improve his defensive level but would rather negate some of the negative impact of it. I also don't think he's capable of handling Kadris usage against the opposition's top lines

Yes, I meant the line would be better defensively as people would be in their proper positions which makes playing D easier as a line. And I agree, I am doubtful Bozak could handle same usage. I already have said I feel Bozak is average defensively, so I wasn't trying to suggest he could play Kadri's role or that he should.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I'm not saying they should be, they have a role and it's not be on the ice to protect a lead with two minutes left. I'm just annoyed with the sheer amount of blame directed towards them and no one else.

People have whipping boys and once they pick them it seems like no matter how they play people will criticize. Look at last night and how some of the same people felt the need to criticize Bozak despite the fact he had a pretty solid game. When players play poorly they deserve to be criticized but too many people here don't care about how they played that game, they just care if they can find a flaw so they can "win" an argument online it feels like.

Yes, all this is true.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Bet no one complained when that line tied the game on the PP against the Hawks

 

[ToneDog]

Bet no one complained when that line tied the game on the PP against the Hawks

Or scored the winner vs Rangers the previous game.

 

[Antropovsky]

I want to believe Marner is as skilled as Matthews and Nylander... but I don't see it.

 

[moon111]

Yes, I meant the line would be better defensively as people would be in their proper positions which makes playing D easier as a line. And I agree, I am doubtful Bozak could handle same usage. I already have said I feel Bozak is average defensively, so I wasn't trying to suggest he could play Kadri's role or that he should.

So could one assume if Kadri is better defensively and has been given a defensive role against higher opposition, that Bozak could be considered a better, more willing play-maker if he's been put with scorers his whole career?

 

[ToneDog]

What would be the most that you would be willing to give up for JT as a rental at the TD? Also considering what we would return on Bozak at the same time?

I think cost would be too high. Probably a 1st, Kappy and a prospect or two. TyBo might get you a mid to late first.

 

[ToneDog]

Lebrun says that JVR really wants to remain a Leafs and would be willing to accept a longer term deal with a lower AAV. He might also be willing to give a hometown discount.

 

[MJ65]

So could one assume if Kadri is better defensively and has been given a defensive role against higher opposition, that Bozak could be considered a better, more willing play-maker if he's been put with scorers his whole career?

The numbers and facts do not suggest your argument, the fact is Bozak has always played with better players as his wingers. Every single season his both wingers have outscored him, so he is more of a beneficiary of his wingers in getting his own points rather then generating offence on his own

He has always logged more PP time then Kadri. Despite logging more time on PP and playing with better wingers he has never out produced Kadri

No disrespect to Bozak, he still is a very useful player and there are not many "C" available to replace him. Moreover we do not any one in farm to play that position I don't see Nylander switching to "C" in near future). The draw back with switching him to checking line is not only he is incapable of checking (career -86) you also lose the offense generated by Kadri on that line

I would rather keep this line intact and let them sort out their defensive issues, hopefully this line can out produce opposing lines (while playing against weaker opponents). The whole line is responsible for give aways and need to be defensively responsible

I can understand that Marner is still young and learning the defensive side of hockey at NHL level, but both Bozak and JVR are the veterans on this line

 

[Battle Lin]

same o, they will struggle on D but this line just keeps putting assists and goals on the board, still best 3rd line in nhl

 

[RLF]

So could one assume if Kadri is better defensively and has been given a defensive role against higher opposition, that Bozak could be considered a better, more willing play-maker if he's been put with scorers his whole career?

That would be a big assumption to make from what I wrote. Bozak typically does not get enough credit for helping his lines create offence, but I think you are reaching here.

 

[Polaris1010]

same o, they will struggle on D but this line just keeps putting assists and goals on the board, still best 3rd line in nhl

The expectations have never been greater for those two JVR and Bozak in their entire stay in Toronto.

Management does appear to be serious that the time to win is now.

You cannot win with such a defensively weak line. They have to improve. This is their final chance to prove that to management in Toronto.

 

[Battle Lin]

this line almost produces like a legit nhl 1st line on offense...with 60, 50, and 70 point forwards on it, that is decent 1st line production actually...man if they played better D lol we would have like 3 lines that can potentially be called a 1st nhl line, dam we getting spoiled and getting greedy

 

[Polaris1010]

this line almost produces like a legit nhl 1st line on offense...with 60, 50, and 70 point forwards on it, that is decent 1st line production actually...man if they played better D lol we would have like 3 lines that can potentially be called a 1st nhl line, dam we getting spoiled and getting greedy

You have to get greedy.

Suppose, the other team, throws out Crosby at you, then Malkin, then everyone's favourite, the notorious Phil Hot Dogs Tastes Better in the Cup Kesssl line.

Who exactly do you match the Bozak line against?

Just who exactly.

Seriously, I no idea if they would really want to put Bozak in that position. You put people in the best position to succeed. Where is that for that line in this case.

I don't know.

 

[Legion34]

Apparently JVR really wants to stay And would take a pay cut. What that means exactly. Who knows? 5.25???

If we are going to keep him. I just dont understand the marleau signing.

 

[ACC1224]

Bet no one complained when that line tied the game on the PP against the Hawks

Why would any fan of sound mind complain about that?

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Apparently JVR really wants to stay And would take a pay cut. What that means exactly. Who knows? 5.25???

If we are going to keep him. I just dont understand the marleau signing.

More deprh is always good