Value of: JT Miller to Pens at top top dollar only

[Super Hans]

Miller was 15OA, plays as if could have been drafted higher.

This is an actual way of thinking?

 

[DearDiary]

not really.
while anything COULD happen and injuries or other COULD have Pens picking way less, as a practical statistical matter they are way better this year with Miller now and next while those picks are made and develop.

Given that, I have a right to value those picks as late 1sts.

Toronto then was not what Pens are now, so there is no such misinterpretation.

How many times have you said you were leaving, but then come back a few min later?

 

[Riptide]

This is an actual way of thinking?

For a few special individuals, absolutely.

 

[domaug]

Sure if they got Miller upfront now.

in no world is JT gosh-darn Miller worth 2 1st round picks and 2 2nd round picks.

 

[OCPenguin]

Continue to consider JT part of our young care. Strongly leaning to create cap space and retain long term deal. However, open mind, would consider dealing IF AND ONLY IF an offer that could not be refused were presented. Pens are a fit, even tho teams don't do biz usually.

Miller was 15OA, plays as if could have been drafted higher.
Not elite speed, power, shot etc but solid in all areas, versatile F plays either W or C
Fits Pens needs like a glove, and is home grown to boot.


The fact that there is a strong draft this year and next.
Late 1sts potential for a guy like Miller is not enough.

Pens 2018 and 2019 1sts and 2nds.
Then I want something on top of that

maybe Schultz, 3 years 5.5 for Staal, 4 years 5.7 and Rangers do a moderate add.
but add does not have to be that.

Again, not looking to move Miller
deals are made all the time for different reasons, and the value is not always balanced because of those reasons

I am upfront: on this occasion, do not want fair value here, coke for pepsi

Rangers have to make a killing in order to consider deal.

Do Pens overpay and if so, what is the final deal on top of draft picks
[NY does not want vets]?

Pittsburgh isn't overpaying for Miller. This is a joke. We give you four high picks, Schultz and have to take on a crap player like Staal? Again, another primary example of a post that doesn't know the value of players.

 

[Tom Hanks]

Yeah we wouldn’t trade Schultz for Miller let alone the other stuff.

 

[SkitzoMe]

Counter proposal
To Rangers
C Hagalin
M Murry
2010 3rd

To Pens
TJ Miller
2018 1st
2018 2nd
2019 1st
2020 1st

Picks non-negotiable
Best player in the deal is now Murry so you can over pay

 

[TGWL]

Yeah we wouldn’t trade Schultz for Miller let alone the other stuff.

Schultz wouldn't be the player we target if we move Miller. Both teams say no to a 1-1 swap. If we trade a young player like Miller, it's about getting future pieces back, but 99.99+% of us aren't expecting 2 first +.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Hey, here's a piece you never asked for but I'm going to demand an unreasonable price for it and if you don't like it too bad.

Sincerely,
bernmeister

 

[SomeDude]

This thread is a pretty great microcosm of the history of proposals on HFboards.

 

[One Winged Angel]

A 21yo Phil Kessel got 2 1sts and a 2nd from Toronto.

And you want 2 1sts, 2 2nds, and Justin Schultz...for JT Miller and a cap dump Marc Staal.

While the original proposal is horrendous, I don't see how you can compare trades that far apart in time.

I am absolutely beyond words.

This goes right up there with the Despres + 2 1sts for a UFA Hemsky at the TDL from the Oilers fans several years ago.

Absolutely awful. I can say with 100% certainty that this is the worst proposal of 2018.

It's bernmeister. We've been dealing with this crap on HFNYR for quite some time.

staal was never the best shut down guy in he league a cheap shot cross checking pylon. Girardi seems to be doing pretty good for the lighting. think its more like now that Girardi is untethered from staal.. there are literally 500 better choices then staal for the pens third pairing. none of which cost 5.7 million a year.

Staal from about 2009-2011 was one of the best shutdown defenders in the league at his very best and was an all-star in 2011. The concussion and the shot to his face took a lot out of him, on top of the speed of the game taking a major increased.

Pens fans, I am so, so sorry.

Seconded.

You could make the argument that JT Miller is a Matt Duchene equivalent but two years younger with more years of RFA control. He's yet to have a 70 point season like Duchene has, but he could be trending that way. So just for the sake of argument, let's look at what Duchene returned:

Defenseman prospect Samuel Girard, Nashville’s 2016 second-round pick
Forward prospect Vladislav Kamenev, Nashville’s 2014 second-round pick
Forward prospect Shane Bowers, Ottawa’s 2017 first-round pick
Goaltender Andrew Hammond
2018 first-round pick from Ottawa*
2018 second-round pick from Nashville
2019 third-round pick from Ottawa

1st, 2nd, 3rd, 3 prospects and a cap dump goalie

2 1sts, 2 2nds, a 50 pt RHS D man and you are sending the cap dump, not the other way around, is too much.

I'm not sure if I'm GMJR I would do this, but based on the above a market rate deal would be more like:

Pen's 2018 1st
Pens 2018 2nd
Pens 2019 3rd
Tristan Jarry
Andrey Pedan
Teddy Bleuger
Carl Hagelin

The above seems like way too much though, which is probably why the Pens, despite being very interested in Duchene, did not ultimately land him.

Yeah, I don't think they'd do that.

two firsts, two seconds, Schultz AND taking Staal's contract for JT Miller?

that is legit the worst proposal I've seen on here in awhile. Congrats!

You're familiar with bernmeister, what do you expect?

Counter proposal
To Rangers
C Hagalin
M Murry
2010 3rd

To Pens
TJ Miller
2018 1st
2018 2nd
2019 1st
2020 1st

Picks non-negotiable
Best player in the deal is now Murry so you can over pay

I mean bernmeister's proposal was terrible, but yours is so bad that the Rangers get two guys that don't even exist. Might want to do some research.

This thread is a pretty great microcosm of the history of proposals on HFboards.

More like a synopsis of bernmeister's trade proposal history, but yeah, I guess you can say that as well.

 

[Player big P]

I was like "What the hell is this?" before I saw it was a bernmeister proposal, so it's about par for the course.

He'll follow up with trading those firsts for four other teams' firsts, swap those firsts for more firsts, until the Rangers ultimately somehow end up with 40 first round picks this year.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I was like "What the hell is this?" before I saw it was a bernmeister proposal, so it's about par for the course.

He'll follow up with trading those firsts for four other teams' firsts, swap those firsts for more firsts, until the Rangers ultimately somehow end up with 40 first round picks this year.

 

[Jerzey Devil]

At this point there’s no telling where those Pens 1st will be. Considering how much the Flyers moved up last draft the Pens would be stupid to trade their next two firsts. This is more of an OEL or Karlsson package (closer to at least).

 

[QuadDeuces]

Are we talking about the same JT Miller that's on the Rangers now? The one who's basically a 50-55 pt player? Good lord, man, this is the worst trade proposal I've ever seen on HF, and that's saying something. JT Miller's value in a trade right now is probably about one mid-first round pick and an A prospect or a 2nd pairing D.

 

[One Winged Angel]

I was like "What the hell is this?" before I saw it was a bernmeister proposal, so it's about par for the course.

He'll follow up with trading those firsts for four other teams' firsts, swap those firsts for more firsts, until the Rangers ultimately somehow end up with 40 first round picks this year.

If it was physically possible, he would be the one to find a way.

 

[SML2]

I would like to formally request HF adds a "dislike" button.

 

[3074326]

I would like to formally request HF adds a "dislike" button.

I agree. In the meantime, a good general rule is to consider post count a dislike count. The big threads are literally always a mess.

 

[Extra Texture]

So you're basically looking to give the Penguins JT Miller, but you're expecting them to crazily overpay for him just because? That sounds logical, sounds like a great negotiating tactic. "Here's my offer, but you're going to hurt if you want to get him!"

Thank you for taking this bizarre thread down, like, immediately.

Pittsburgh isn't overpaying for Miller. This is a joke. We give you four high picks, Schultz and have to take on a crap player like Staal? Again, another primary example of a post that doesn't know the value of players.

 

[Shrimper]

This proposal is beyond terrible.

Make an offer like that and the Penguins would block the Rangers number.

 

[Riptide]

You're laughing... but in the same breath, you also know it's very very true (or at least you should). I actually feel bad for other NYR HF Fans/members.

 

[mariolemieux66]

Pittsburgh will have interest in Pkekanec and Benn. Sprong and a pick should do it.

 

[OCPenguin]

This thread is a pretty great microcosm of the history of proposals on HFboards.

Pretty much ... 99.2% of them are pretty awful. Very few ideas on this board are good.

 

[OCPenguin]

Pittsburgh will have interest in Pkekanec and Benn. Sprong and a pick should do it.

Sprong and a pick isn't going for that. Have no interest in Plekanec.

 

[OCPenguin]

I would like to formally request HF adds a "dislike" button.

Agree ... how about an ignore button too.