Blue Jays Discussion: Jays host wild-card game vs BAL....Stroman Starts

[Leaftors]

Brown bag with the word "Milk" sharpied on the front

LOL ya, theres milk in that bag officer

 

[JoeyBeans]

Bagged milk I think is more of an Ontario thing. I know out west they have cartons and jugs.

We have bagged milk in Nova Scotia. anddd its cheaper

 

[Mach85]

Thank you for that. I'd have said he was quality, too. I just think the superlatives used to describe his PLAYOFF performance last year are gradually becoming more and more hyperbole. I am happy to hear I'm not totally off base in my noobie evaluation, however I understand I need to look a little more deeply that perhaps I was.



Kinda condescending, but I guess that's what I get for asking a basic question here. Sorry about that!

I still think your definition of "great" comes with too many caveats and is an overstatement. I have absolutely no issue with the decision to start Stroman tonight - I don't trust Liriano at all - I just wanted a little more of an explanation on Stroman's legend.

Here's hoping he IS great, and we can look forward to him getting at least one more postseason start this season. Cheers.

There was no condescension intended my man - I'm just in and out of seeing clients all day and can't take the time to explain FIP. I know context can be misinterpreted over text, but I'm always happy to discuss things with people.

He wasn't a world beater in last year's playoffs, but he was good (especially considering the circumstances), and people saying he chokes or is not a big game pitcher are off base based on last year's playoff performance alone (not that I think "big game pitcher" is a good argument, but if we're using it, let's use the info we have correctly).

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

I never said they were confusing or don't make sense. I just said they're bad.

Aw man .

Tell me why they're bad?

 

[Mach85]

I remember the first time we used the Dirty...one of the posters was so upset at the lowbrow nature...I promised myself I would use it as often as possible.

Stroman calls himself "Stro-Show" so not much I can do about that. CHiPS is hilarious. I can see how the "Rugged Man" would be confusing to Canadians though.

Come on, you're underestimating Canadians' underground hip-hop knowledge.

 

[Loosie]

Why is Estrada CHiPS?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CHiPs

 

[ACC1224]

I never said they were confusing or don't make sense. I just said they're bad.

IMO, you only call someone you know by their nickname.

 

[Discoverer]

Aw man .

Tell me why they're bad?

Because you're the only one that uses them. So maybe the nicknames themselves aren't bad, but the usage is bad.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Maybe we start Dickey today and they'll be so mind-blown they'll struggle the whole game....

No? Nothing?

 

[RoyalCitySlicker]

There was no condescension intended my man - I'm just in and out of seeing clients all day and can't take the time to explain FIP. I know context can be misinterpreted over text, but I'm always happy to discuss things with people.

He wasn't a world beater in last year's playoffs, but he was good (especially considering the circumstances), and people saying he chokes or is not a big game pitcher are off base based on last year's playoff performance alone (not that I think "big game pitcher" is a good argument, but if we're using it, let's use the info we have correctly).

All good! As you said, context and tone is a tough thing to pick up over text.

I would say yes, he was quite good considering the circumstances. I just don't like the caveat, is all. I think in general, we're pretty well in agreement.

Let's hope there are a few more games to discuss this season, and perhaps then we can discuss the FIP number a little further. Enjoy the game tonight...thanks for the discussion.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Because you're the only one that uses them. So maybe the nicknames themselves aren't bad, but the usage is bad.

You're very Kurtzy today . Fine, I'll stop using them.

Why don't you just go ahead and tell me to stop posting pictures of kittens too!?









Naw, but really...if people can stumble in here and yell about small ball, half baked surface statistics, their recency bias, and 1977, then I can have my fun.

 

[zeke]

Over his first 3yrs in the majors by age 25 - 56 starts - amongst all 121 qualified SP he ranks 15th in fip and 14th in xfip. 8th in both in the AL.

Here's the top-10 in both in the AL:

FIP

1. Kluber 70
2. Sale 71
3. Carrasco 73
4. Price 76
5. Quintana 77
6. Pineda 80
7. Stroman 82
8. Keuchel 82
9. Tanaka 84
10. Archer 85

xFIP

1. Carrasco 70
2. Sale 75
3. Kluber 75
4. Keuchel 78
5. Pineda 78
6. Price 78
7. Tanaka 79
8. Stroman 81
9. Hernandez 82
10.Archer 84

Stroman is the youngest on either list by a good 2yrs.

But wait, you say - Pineda isn't an ace either!

Which is true, but in that case we can see both a huge discrepancy with his 100era- compared to stroman's 90era- over that time, AND more importantly we can see that Pineda only throws 5.7ip/gs while Stroman throws 6.3ip/gs, which is a massive difference.

And of course Pineda has consistently underachieved his fips, but Stroman has done that only for one awful stretch in his career so far.


And the salient point being that Stroman's been back to being stroman for over 2 months running now.

 

[Discoverer]

You're very Kurtzy today . Fine, I'll stop using them.

Why don't you just go ahead and tell me to stop posting pictures of kittens too!?









Naw, but really...if people can stumble in here and yell about small ball, half baked surface statistics, their recency bias, and 1977, then I can have my fun.

And I push back when people do all that other stuff too, so this is just par for the course, is it not?

And there is no situation in which I would support the end of your kitten pictures. Don't be ridiculous. Those are just pure joy.

 

[Leaftors]

You're very Kurtzy today . Fine, I'll stop using them.

Why don't you just go ahead and tell me to stop posting pictures of kittens too!?









Naw, but really...if people can stumble in here and yell about small ball, half baked surface statistics, their recency bias, and 1977, then I can have my fun.

Come on man, stromans era against the orioles sucks, so he sucks, and edwin isnt that good of a hitter because his average isnt .300

 

[ShaneFalco]

 

[ShaneFalco]

Wild card roster
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/baseball/mlb/blue-jays-roster-wild-card-1.3790769

There are 10 pitchers on the roster with Wednesday starter Marcus Stroman and fellow starters Marco Estrada and Francisco Liriano available if needed. The rest are relievers: Joe Biagini, Brett Cecil, Scott Feldman, Jason Grilli, Aaron Loup, Roberto Osuna and Ryan Tepera.

The 41-year-old Dickey (10-15 with a 4.46 earned-run average) appears to be the odd man out in a plentiful starting rotation that will be shortened in the post-season. Manager John Gibbons still has Sanchez, Happ, Stroman, Estrada and Liriano at his disposal.

The infielders on the wild-card roster are Darwin Barney, Josh Donaldson, Edwin Encarnacion, Ryan Goins, Justin Smoak, Devon Travis and Troy Tulowitzki.

The catchers are Russell Martin and Dioner Navarro with an outfield of Jose Bautista, Kevin Pillar, Ezequiel Carrera, Josh Saunders, Melvin Upton Jr., and Dalton Pompey.

 

[JoeyBeans]

huge

 

[go_leafs_go02]

First time the roof will be open for a playoff game. Last year I remembered it was beautiful outside for the ALDS and they had it sweltering inside.

 

[King Mapes]

We have bagged milk in Nova Scotia. anddd its cheaper

I'm from NS and it's true we do. I've never had it but I've seen it.

I think Stroman will be on a short leash. If he gets into trouble in the 4th-5th you bring out Liriano. Then in the 6th you do it anyway as don't let them face Stroman a third time.

It's also worth noting Os are only 39-42 on the road.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Actor Eric Estrada played a motorcycle cop in a show called CHiPS.

thanks

 

[glue]

I'm from NS and it's true we do. I've never had it but I've seen it.

I think Stroman will be on a short leash. If he gets into trouble in the 4th-5th you bring out Liriano. Then in the 6th you do it anyway as don't let them face Stroman a third time. .

It's also worth noting Os are only 39-42 on the road

Yup, that sounds like a good strategy to me, here's a good read from sporstnet that talks about that point of not leaving the starting pitcher in to face the lineup a 3rd time.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/working-guide-wild-card-tactics-blue-jays/

 

[lebdafor norris]

Over his first 3yrs in the majors by age 25 - 56 starts - amongst all 121 qualified SP he ranks 15th in fip and 14th in xfip. 8th in both in the AL.

Here's the top-10 in both in the AL:

FIP

1. Kluber 70
2. Sale 71
3. Carrasco 73
4. Price 76
5. Quintana 77
6. Pineda 80
7. Stroman 82
8. Keuchel 82
9. Tanaka 84
10. Archer 85

xFIP

1. Carrasco 70
2. Sale 75
3. Kluber 75
4. Keuchel 78
5. Pineda 78
6. Price 78
7. Tanaka 79
8. Stroman 81
9. Hernandez 82
10.Archer 84

Stroman is the youngest on either list by a good 2yrs.

But wait, you say - Pineda isn't an ace either!

Which is true, but in that case we can see both a huge discrepancy with his 100era- compared to stroman's 90era- over that time, AND more importantly we can see that Pineda only throws 5.7ip/gs while Stroman throws 6.3ip/gs, which is a massive difference.

And of course Pineda has consistently underachieved his fips, but Stroman has done that only for one awful stretch in his career so far.


And the salient point being that Stroman's been back to being stroman for over 2 months running now.

Stroman's career IP 361.2, ERA 3.91, FIP 3.38

Pineda's career IP 583.2, ERA 3.99, FIP 3.42

I don't think it's fair to call Pineda an FIP overachiever and not Stroman when both have recorded significantly higher ERA compare to their FIP thus far in their careers. Also, Stroman has significantly underachieved his FIP for both the 2014 and 2016 season so I wouldn't say this has went on with him for just one awful stretch. I am well aware that it takes years for FIP to stabilize but in Stroman's case, there is good reason to believe that his ERA will likely be higher than his FIP due to his inability to induce in field fly outs (which unlike other "balls in play results" are pretty much automatic outs and is not dependent on the defence).

 

[deletethis]

It's also worth noting Os are only 39-42 on the road

Yup, that sounds like a good strategy to me, here's a good read from sporstnet that talks about that point of not leaving the starting pitcher in to face the lineup a 3rd time.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/working-guide-wild-card-tactics-blue-jays/

This didn't really work with Stroman vs. the O's this season. Stroman allowed 13 ERs in the first 4 innings of his 4 starts this year against the O's.

 

[Hoverhand]

YES! YES YES YES!

Maybe I'm over hyping this but it just bugged me so *****ing much last yea that it was totally fine the Yankees and Astros had wall at 310 feet but Heaven forbid the Jays keep the rood open in the playoffs because "It was unfair"

 

[Shimso]

Maybe we start Dickey today and they'll be so mind-blown they'll struggle the whole game....

No? Nothing?

"BATTING THIRD: JOSHHHHHHHHH.........thole"