Proposal: James VanRiemsdyk for Mikhail Sergachev

[Gary Nylund]

Sergachev annihilate Marner? Sergachev the next Karlsson?

Has Sergachev done something in the last 5 months that I'm unaware of? Last I checked, he was your run of the mill top 10 pick with good upside but so so unproven.

To be fair, I don't think anyone said he'd be the next Karlsson. I believe the prediction was a "Karlsson with size".

 

[Habsfan2731]

Sergachev is a complete non starter. He's Markov's replacement. As much as it'd be nice to add a JVR to the current roster, this is about asset management and moving Sergachev who may very well be the best rearguard out of the draft class and could become a number 1 down the road wouldn't be smart at all.

Beaulieu, Sergachev and Juulsen to an extent are all needed as they may all become integral parts of the franchise now & in the very near future.

For now, when he gets healthy, use Hudon with Galchenyuk-Radulov or at worst case bring up Scherbak if his play continues this season (he's looked exceptional).

Our biggest need is down the middle. Size & skill down the middle. Plekanec-Desharnais in the 2C-3C holes just will not cut it.

 

[Territory]

Value is close imo.

Habs have a chance to win a cup this season. Price is in his prime and a new contract is soon. Sergachev isn't on the team to help them THIS year. JVR would help them win a cup. With a team backed by price who doesn't get scored on a lot, a 30/30 guy joining your team without losing anyone else would be huge.

That being said, I don't want to help the Habs win a cup. So screw this deal lol.

 

[smirob]

Value is close imo.

Habs have a chance to win a cup this season. Price is in his prime and a new contract is soon. Sergachev isn't on the team to help them THIS year. JVR would help them win a cup. With a team backed by price who doesn't get scored on a lot, a 30/30 guy joining your team without losing anyone else would be huge.

That being said, I don't want to help the Habs win a cup. So screw this deal lol.

Trading our best prospect for 1.5 years of JVR is not going to happen.

Valuewise, Sergachev holds much more value LONG-TERM than JVR does to the habs. Our d-prospects beyond Serg-Juulsen are fairly weak.

We can add a decent scorer at the TDL for MUCH less than Sergachev.

 

[Territory]

Trading our best prospect for 1.5 years of JVR is not going to happen.

Valuewise, Sergachev holds much more value LONG-TERM than JVR does to the habs. Our d-prospects beyond Serg-Juulsen are fairly weak.

We can add a decent scorer at the TDL for MUCH less than Sergachev.

You are right. 100%. But sometimes you have to sacrifice long term to win a Stanley Cup. I see the Habs window as the next 2 seasons, personally.

 

[Habsfan2731]

You are right. 100%. But sometimes you have to sacrifice long term to win a Stanley Cup. I see the Habs window as the next 2 seasons, personally.

Between 2-3 years is how I see it. I'd persuade Vanek out of Detroit if they're out of it.

Simply let:

Vanek-Galchenyuk-Radulov
Pacioretty-Plekanec-Gallagher
Lehkonen-Shaw-Hudon
Danault-Mitchell-Byron

Go in the postseason. If we want to upgrade C then Hanzal who per Engles I believe is on our radar.

 

[SpezDispenser]

As someone with no horse in this race, Montreal would never dream of trading Sergachev for JVR. Or they shouldn't.

 

[Vern]

heres a realistic offer, 2017 1st , 2017 2cnd, a prospect not serg, sherb, juulsen or mccarron and dd for cap reasons

Leafs need to do this quick to help their tank. if they wait until next years deadline take out the 1st and dd

only contenders going to want jvr and all contenders will require you to take salary back. habs actually a pretty good fit because we might actually be able to protect him from expansion draft unlike pretty much all other contenders.

 

[Randy Randerson]

heres a realistic offer, 2017 1st , 2017 2cnd, a prospect not serg, sherb, juulsen or mccarron and dd for cap reasons.

I think we'd get a 1st+ A-/B+ prospect from a western team (in the realm of the Scherbak/Juulsen/McCarron's of the world). I think if we're dealing within the division it would need to top the out of conference offers

Not out of the ballpark, but I think we get a little better from a team where it won't bite us, especially with retention/cap takebacks

 

[Territory]

heres a realistic offer, 2017 1st , 2017 2cnd, a prospect not serg, sherb, juulsen or mccarron and dd for cap reasons

Leafs need to do this quick to help their tank. if they wait until next years deadline take out the 1st and dd

The Leafs aren't tanking.

 

[Vern]

The Leafs aren't tanking.

sure your not lol

2-3 more tank seasons you might start to look as good as the oilers today

 

[smirob]

heres a realistic offer, 2017 1st , 2017 2cnd, a prospect not serg, sherb, juulsen or mccarron and dd for cap reasons

Leafs need to do this quick to help their tank. if they wait until next years deadline take out the 1st and dd

only contenders going to want jvr and all contenders will require you to take salary back. habs actually a pretty good fit because we might actually be able to protect him from expansion draft unlike pretty much all other contenders.

I don't see Toronto taking a quantity type deal. They need a dman back who can help out soon. Sergachev doesn't make sense for MTL.

JVR to Anaheim or Minnesota makes the most sense to me if you want a dman back.

 

[smack66]

Value is close imo.

Habs have a chance to win a cup this season. Price is in his prime and a new contract is soon. Sergachev isn't on the team to help them THIS year. JVR would help them win a cup. With a team backed by price who doesn't get scored on a lot, a 30/30 guy joining your team without losing anyone else would be huge.

That being said, I don't want to help the Habs win a cup. So screw this deal lol.

Bruins fan and therefore would like both teams to tank

that being said, I agree that Habs are in their window to win now and will need to sacrifice something significant to win. I know some Bruins fans hated that we traded Wheeler but it helped at the time to win the cup. Obviously could use him now but its the price you pay when you have a chance to win it all

 

[Randy Randerson]

I don't see Toronto taking a quantity type deal. They need a dman back who can help out soon. Sergachev doesn't make sense for MTL.

JVR to Anaheim or Minnesota makes the most sense to me if you want a dman back.

agreed on Anaheim, seems like a natural fit. I think Chicago, Pitts, SJ, Bos, Dal are also places that could make sense if each cap situation could be worked out (which likely it can because we can take bad, short term contracts)


If JVR keeps up this level of production there will be a big market

 

[Kudo Shinichi]

You are right. 100%. But sometimes you have to sacrifice long term to win a Stanley Cup. I see the Habs window as the next 2 seasons, personally.

Thats true for players like Scherbak, Juulsen and McCarron. Sergachev is on another level than these 3, and you don't sacrifice this kind of player.

 

[Vern]

I don't see Toronto taking a quantity type deal. They need a dman back who can help out soon. Sergachev doesn't make sense for MTL.

JVR to Anaheim or Minnesota makes the most sense to me if you want a dman back.

Sure but do you really see jvr approaching ufa and looking for a big payday landing a fowler or a scandella? I mean hes getting close to rental territory and what i proposed is more in line with jvr's contract situation imo. MAYBE because of some teams expansion draft issues and with some signifigant add by TO

maybe he could land an emelin type, similar contract situation, but please from someone else lol, do NOT ever want to have emelin destroying us in a leafs uniform

 

[Nylanderthal]

Sure but do you really see jvr approaching ufa and looking for a big payday landing a fowler or a scandella? I mean hes getting close to rental territory and what i proposed is more in line with jvr's contract situation imo. MAYBE because of some teams expansion draft issues and with some signifigant add by TO

maybe he could land an emelin type, similar contract situation, but please from someone else lol, do NOT ever want to have emelin destroying us in a leafs uniform

Bobby Ryan fetched a roster player a prospect and the #9 pick in the entry draft with one year to go.
JVR is very similar to production and value to BR prior to his trade. Look to that as a gauge of value and try again.

 

[Randy Randerson]

Bobby Ryan fetched a roster player a prospect and the #9 pick in the entry draft with one year to go.
JVR is very similar to production and value to BR prior to his trade. Look to that as a gauge of value and try again.

Ryan was the comparable I used as well, it was the #10 pick but done over the summer so the pick wasn't set at the time. The Sens finished around 13th overall the previous year, were getting Spezza back from injury while losing Gonchar, Alfredsson and Silfverberg and adding Ryan. The previous year was the shortened season, and they faded towards the end of it so I'm sure that also weighed into their internal evaluation of how the team would do. Anyway, I think with all the factors considered they probably thought of themselves as a playoff team but not a surefire contender - I would think they expected that pick to be in the teens-to-20ish

Silfverberg though was thought of as a good young player with top 6/first line upside in the near future, was 21 at the time and coming of a .4ppg rookie half season and a near ppg AHL half season. (Like Kapanen if he got called up at the deadline and went .4ppg the rest of the way type value)

They also added Noeson, who if I remember right was a prospect they thought would be an NHL defenseman but not a star

Those two adds I think easily bridge the value gap from what they expected that pick to be and #9OA pick, probably more

 

[Damisoph]

Think of Karlsson with size. Sweet fancy moses that's embarrassing

 

[sharks9]

You think JVR (a 1st line player) is worth McCarron (a future 3rd line player)?

Yikes.

A year and a half of a 50-60 point player isn't worth much more than a guy like McCarron and a pick.

 

[Vern]

Bobby Ryan fetched a roster player a prospect and the #9 pick in the entry draft with one year to go.
JVR is very similar to production and value to BR prior to his trade. Look to that as a gauge of value and try again.

1. at the time silfverberg was considered a prospect and ottawa was looking to not just make the playoffs but with the addition of ryan be cup contenders. No way they thought they were giving up the 10th overall pick.

2. This deal worked out horrendously for ottawa i think most will agree and is a good example of why NOT to give up a lot for guys like jvr or ryan.

3. this trade was done in july so for it to be comparable to a deal with montreal and still have "one year to go" it would have had to be done last july

4. prior to the ryan trade he had 4 30+ goal 57+point seasons. in a row. jvr has had 1. Ryan then was much more valuable than jvr now

You try again

 

[sansabri]

A year and a half of a 50-60 point player isn't worth much more than a guy like McCarron and a pick.

And even then, rather keep McCarron. JVR would only mean losing another roster player at the expansion draft.

What we need are 1 year rentals.

 

[Vern]

And even then, rather keep McCarron. JVR would only mean losing another roster player at the expansion draft.

What we need are 1 year rentals.

exactly, in fact the whole expansion draft thing makes players like jvr with an additional year left rentals.

i change my offer to a 2017 1st , b prospect and dd. Bergevin would prob manage to wait until the deadline and only give up 2cnd and b prospect though lol

leafs are way better off moving him as a rental this year so they can protect other players, if they dont he either takes up a slot or they lose him for nothing.

 

[Gary Nylund]

1. at the time silfverberg was considered a prospect and ottawa was looking to not just make the playoffs but with the addition of ryan be cup contenders. No way they thought they were giving up the 10th overall pick.

2. This deal worked out horrendously for ottawa i think most will agree and is a good example of why NOT to give up a lot for guys like jvr or ryan.

3. this trade was done in july so for it to be comparable to a deal with montreal and still have "one year to go" it would have had to be done last july

4. prior to the ryan trade he had 4 30+ goal 57+point seasons. in a row. jvr has had 1. Ryan then was much more valuable than jvr now

You try again

JVR:
2013-14 31 goals 61 pts
2014-15 29 goals 56 pts
2015-16 injured, on pace for 29 goals and 59 points
2016-17 on pace for 35 goals and70 points

Yeah you're right, comparing JVR to a guy with 4 30+ goal 57+point seasons in a row is ridiculous. He's not even in the same ballpark. I'm sure you can find much, much better comparables. Let us know when you do. Take all the time you need

 

[Gary Nylund]

exactly, in fact the whole expansion draft thing makes players like jvr with an additional year left rentals.

i change my offer to a 2017 1st , b prospect and dd. Bergevin would prob manage to wait until the deadline and only give up 2cnd and b prospect though lol

leafs are way better off moving him as a rental this year so they can protect other players, if they dont he either takes up a slot or they lose him for nothing.

Not really. We don't have that many good forwards that need protection.

Try again.