Value of: Jacob Trouba's rights

[Legion34]

Can you not trade a player for a whole calendar year after you accept a arbitrator’s ruling or am I confusing that with not being able to trade a player for a calendar year after matching a offer sheet for a player

I think it’s matching offer sheer but not sure.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

A bridge deal for 2 years brings him to free agency, so that isn't good management.

I realize when he'd be a free agent. I also realize the inherent risk in giving big money long-term to a perennially injured player at an age when most players are at their healthiest. Suppose he gets even less durable in the coming years, and gets 6.5 mil per to play 50 games a year?

I'd rather make him prove he can stay healthy for a couple years before trying to re-sign him to big money. The Jets will still be contenders in 2 years, so if he wants to leave, it won't be on account of wanting to be on a better team.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

I realize when he'd be a free agent. I also realize the inherent risk in giving big money long-term to a perennially injured player at an age when most players are at their healthiest. Suppose he gets even less durable in the coming years, and gets 6.5 mil per to play 50 games a year?

I'd rather make him prove he can stay healthy for a couple years before trying to re-sign him to big money. The Jets will still be contenders in 2 years, so if he wants to leave, it won't be on account of wanting to be on a better team.

That would be TERRIBLE asset management. Sign him for 1 year and he if still wants out, trade him for assets. Sign him for 2 years and then you're not only negotiating along side every other team in the league, you get nothing if he walks.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

That would be TERRIBLE asset management. Sign him for 1 year and he if still wants out, trade him for assets. Sign him for 2 years and then you're not only negotiating along side every other team in the league, you get nothing if he walks.

Sometimes players walk for nothing - that's a contender's mentality. In the meantime, you get a good young defenseman for 2 years to see if he can put together something like full seasons.

And you're not "negotiating alongside every other team in the league". You'd have exclusive negotiating rights until the end of his deal.

 

[Legion34]

Did it start this morning, or is it an afternoon thing?

Once they make it to arb can they only sign a 1-2 year deal or can they still sign whatever they want?

 

[kittiecarlyle]

I realize when he'd be a free agent. I also realize the inherent risk in giving big money long-term to a perennially injured player at an age when most players are at their healthiest. Suppose he gets even less durable in the coming years, and gets 6.5 mil per to play 50 games a year?

I'd rather make him prove he can stay healthy for a couple years before trying to re-sign him to big money. The Jets will still be contenders in 2 years, so if he wants to leave, it won't be on account of wanting to be on a better team.

If he is a FA in 2 years and still with the Jets you think he would sign a contract with Winnipeg? I don't.

I move him when it is the most optimal and when the best deal is to be had. That I believe is sooner than later.

 

[hockeykicker]

Did it start this morning, or is it an afternoon thing?

Once they make it to arb can they only sign a 1-2 year deal or can they still sign whatever they want?

It started at 9am eastern

 

[Legion34]

It started at 9am eastern

Ok so now that they are in it... it’s a 1-2 year deal?

 

[kittiecarlyle]

Did it start this morning, or is it an afternoon thing?

Once they make it to arb can they only sign a 1-2 year deal or can they still sign whatever they want?

It is done, it either is a 1 or 2 year deal, the club chooses. The player is tied to the contract. So if it is a 1 year deal, he is not free to sign anywhere after that nor to sign with another team till he is an UFA.

 

[Setec Astronomy]

I realize when he'd be a free agent. I also realize the inherent risk in giving big money long-term to a perennially injured player at an age when most players are at their healthiest. Suppose he gets even less durable in the coming years, and gets 6.5 mil per to play 50 games a year?

I'd rather make him prove he can stay healthy for a couple years before trying to re-sign him to big money. The Jets will still be contenders in 2 years, so if he wants to leave, it won't be on account of wanting to be on a better team.

All depends on the type of injuries. If we're talking unlucky one off kind of things, I don't see it as an issue. If it's something like the same knee or back ailment that always returns, that's something else.

 

[Maylo]

Did it start this morning, or is it an afternoon thing?

Once they make it to arb can they only sign a 1-2 year deal or can they still sign whatever they want?

Seeing as Arbitration was requested by Jacob Trouba & his side (making it 'Player Elected'), it's the #NHLJets who get to decide on the awarded term. Given that Trouba is 2 years away from being UFA, it's a safe assumption that the club would opt for a 1 year contract settlement.

By CapFriendly.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

If he is a FA in 2 years and still with the Jets you think he would sign a contract with Winnipeg? I don't.

I move him when it is the most optimal and when the best deal is to be had. That I believe is sooner than later.

He might, he might not. Winnipeg's a great young contending team, and if he's willing to sign long-term for the right money now, I don't see why it would be unthinkable later.

The main advantage to getting Trouba long-term now is that you keep his price relatively low if he breaks out and actually plays regularly over the next 2 years, but I'd say that's outweighed by the uncertainty in his durability.

 

[kittiecarlyle]

Ok so now that they are in it... it’s a 1-2 year deal?

They can still agree on a long term deal up until the ruling is sent to both parties which has to be within 48 hours.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

All depends on the type of injuries. If we're talking unlucky one off kind of things, I don't see it as an issue. If it's something like the same knee or back ailment that always returns, that's something else.

Whatever the issue(s), he just needs to play more often. There are some players who are just brittle.

 

[hockeykicker]

Ok so now that they are in it... it’s a 1-2 year deal?

They can still sign him to an 8 year deal up until the arbitrator decides

 

[GoJetsGo55]

Sometimes players walk for nothing - that's a contender's mentality. In the meantime, you get a good young defenseman for 2 years to see if he can put together something like full seasons.

And you're not "negotiating alongside every other team in the league". You'd have exclusive negotiating rights until the end of his deal.

Yes sometimes players walk for nothing. That's worse case scenario when you're talking about young talent that's shown what they're capable of. Yes he's had some injuries and that causes concern but the trick isn't to let every player that gets injured walk for free.

Hell, Matthews was injured this past year, would it be a mistake to lock him up for 8 years or keep giving him short contracts until he walks away as a UFA because "that's a contender's mentality"

Either Trouba signs or we trade him. To set him up in a position where he can walk away in 2 years would be a complete disaster on Chevy's part.

 

[kittiecarlyle]

He might, he might not. Winnipeg's a great young contending team, and if he's willing to sign long-term for the right money now, I don't see why it would be unthinkable later.

The main advantage to getting Trouba long-term now is that you keep his price relatively low if he breaks out and actually plays regularly over the next 2 years, but I'd say that's outweighed by the uncertainty in his durability.

Was anything different 2 years ago or now? Something would have to change from one side and it hasn't to date.

Signing a long term deal for the right money hasn't occurred at two pressure points so pretty unlikely it would when the player can walk and sign anywhere he wants.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Yes sometimes players walk for nothing. That's worse case scenario when you're talking about young talent that's shown what they're capable of. Yes he's had some injuries and that causes concern but the trick isn't to let every player that gets injured walk for free.

Hell, Matthews was injured this past year, would it be a mistake to lock him up for 8 years or keep giving him short contracts until he walks away as a UFA because "that's a contender's mentality"

Either Trouba signs or we trade him. To set him up in a position where he can walk away in 2 years would be a complete disaster on Chevy's part.

Was anything different 2 years ago or now? Something would have to change from one side and it hasn't to date.

Signing a long term deal for the right money hasn't occurred at two pressure points so pretty unlikely it would when the player can walk and sign anywhere he wants.

That's a false equivalency. Nobody's saying to let every player who gets injured walk for nothing. Matthews was injured in 1 season...Trouba was injured in 4 out of 5.

What a 2 year deal would be is a trial run. If Trouba's healthy, you try to re-sign him...the Jets aren't going to be a worse long-term option 2 years down the road, and if Trouba's so dissatisfied with Winnipeg after that short a time that he's unwilling to sign for good money, you probably wouldn't want him long-term anyway.

If Trouba continues to struggle to put together full seasons as he's done for 80% of his NHL career so far, you let him walk away, satisfied that you didn't commit big dollars to a band-aid with so many other healthy young stars to re-sign.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

That's a false equivalency. Nobody's saying to let every player who gets injured walk for nothing. Matthews was injured in 1 season...Trouba was injured in 4 out of 5.

What a 2 year deal would be is a trial run. If Trouba's healthy, you try to re-sign him...the Jets aren't going to be a worse long-term option 2 years down the road, and if Trouba's so dissatisfied with Winnipeg after that short a time that he's unwilling to sign for good money, you probably wouldn't want him long-term anyway.

If Trouba continues to struggle to put together full seasons as he's done for 80% of his NHL career so far, you let him walk away, satisfied that you didn't commit big dollars to a band-aid with so many other healthy young stars to re-sign.

I cannot believe how dug in you are to the idea that giving a young RHD (a very hot commodity in the NHL today) the quickest path to walk away for free is the best way to handle him as an asset.

We have 2 VIABLE options with Trouba. We either sign him long term or we trade him. I am completely flabbergasted that "sign him for 2 years and let him walk for free" is not only considered viable....but the best option in your opinion.

"Oh but you'll have all this time to negotiate with him"

Yeah....we've also had longer than that to negotiate with him previously and it got us here. You know who his agent is. There is ZERO chance he's not taking Trouba to UFA and talking to all the teams he can.

Sign or trade. Doing anything else is, once again, terrible asset management.

 

[kittiecarlyle]

That's a false equivalency. Nobody's saying to let every player who gets injured walk for nothing. Matthews was injured in 1 season...Trouba was injured in 4 out of 5.

What a 2 year deal would be is a trial run. If Trouba's healthy, you try to re-sign him...the Jets aren't going to be a worse long-term option 2 years down the road, and if Trouba's so dissatisfied with Winnipeg after that short a time that he's unwilling to sign for good money, you probably wouldn't want him long-term anyway.

If Trouba continues to struggle to put together full seasons as he's done for 80% of his NHL career so far, you let him walk away, satisfied that you didn't commit big dollars to a band-aid with so many other healthy young stars to re-sign.

Your scenario makes no sense for the Jets and there is no way Cheveldayoff would do that, nor should he.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I cannot believe how dug in you are to the idea that giving a young RHD (a very hot commodity in the NHL today) the quickest path to walk away for free is the best way to handle him as an asset.

We have 2 VIABLE options with Trouba. We either sign him long term or we trade him. I am completely flabbergasted that "sign him for 2 years and let him walk for free" is not only considered viable....but the best option in your opinion.

"Oh but you'll have all this time to negotiate with him"

Yeah....we've also had longer than that to negotiate with him previously and it got us here. You know who his agent is. There is ZERO chance he's not taking Trouba to UFA and talking to all the teams he can.

Sign or trade. Doing anything else is, once again, terrible asset management.

A young RHD is a hot commodity. One with Trouba's history is also a significant risk, so I'd do the 2 years to see if he can stay healthy and let Trouba decide from there. If he wants to play diva at that point, frankly the Jets are better off spending the money elsewhere. You can get a helluva defenseman for 6-7 mil per...one that might even play 70 games a season more than 20% of the time.

Your mileage clearly varies, but it can be prudent to at least consider options besides the best-case scenario. Believe it or not, teams have proven to regret signing injury-prone players to big money for a long time, even ones who are hot commodities.

 

[Legion34]

If he takes a 1 year deal. He could just do it again right? Even if you take the 2 the other team could sign him to an extension......

 

[jetsjetsjets]

That's a false equivalency. Nobody's saying to let every player who gets injured walk for nothing. Matthews was injured in 1 season...Trouba was injured in 4 out of 5.

What a 2 year deal would be is a trial run. If Trouba's healthy, you try to re-sign him...the Jets aren't going to be a worse long-term option 2 years down the road, and if Trouba's so dissatisfied with Winnipeg after that short a time that he's unwilling to sign for good money, you probably wouldn't want him long-term anyway.

If Trouba continues to struggle to put together full seasons as he's done for 80% of his NHL career so far, you let him walk away, satisfied that you didn't commit big dollars to a band-aid with so many other healthy young stars to re-sign.

One small thing to point out: Trouba has missed significant time due to injury in 3/5 seasons and 1 of the last 3 seasons. One season was from contract dispute.

 

[kelsier]

The ever curious case of Jacob Trouba. I wasn't following the Jets when he was drafted nor the following years when he played for the Jets. I've only heard rumours that he was misused by playing at his off-side and being at the bottom of the food chain behind Byfuglien and even Myers, according to some article at least. That and of course being paired up with Stuart (probably not an ideal partner). Only started following the Jets during the 16-17 so I really don't know how long he was misused or if he was misused at all (but just wasn't good enough for a better role). Nevertheless if that's how he felt and it was bugging him for extended period of time, I can imagine that the memory lives on quite a long time - knowing you can do better but you're not given the opportunity. At least last year he saw some good minutes and had a good partner to work with in Morrisey. If they felt he was someone they wanted to keep in the line up it's strange that no one intervened. Maurice isn't probably always the most ideal coach to work with the future corner stones, at least unless they have at least "graduated" from the ELC. Anyway as for my observations, Buff has been the go-to-guy so far and Trouba has been lurking in the shadows. There hasn't been much issues that would have caught the eye in terms of performance at least so if he goes through arbitration I'm sure he will get good $ for next year.

Not sure but Trouba is RFA for the next two more seasons? It will be quite a gamble not signing a long term contract now and let him get one year closer to UFA (where he would surely later explore his open market value). Suppose his asking price quite now is quite high since he's the last man standing. If he genuinely wanted to stay that sounds a bit contradicting or maybe he just wants to jab back for the "forced" bridge where they got him for a bargain for 2 (or ~1,5) seasons. Anyway I do hope they find a way so that the team doesn't lose him for secondary pieces. After all, he's the best bet for #1D the organization has looking forward.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

A young RHD is a hot commodity. One with Trouba's history is also a significant risk, so I'd do the 2 years to see if he can stay healthy and let Trouba decide from there. If he wants to play diva at that point, frankly the Jets are better off spending the money elsewhere. You can get a helluva defenseman for 6-7 mil per...one that might even play 70 games a season more than 20% of the time.

Your mileage clearly varies, but it can be prudent to at least consider options besides the best-case scenario. Believe it or not, teams have proven to regret signing injury-prone players to big money for a long time, even ones who are hot commodities.

None of this explains why we shouldn't just trade him if everything you are saying is true.

You're saying that he's this big risk and that he needs to prove himself.....then why would we not just trade him? Take the 1 year option and trade him to someone and say hey he's still under control after this contract.

That's a hell of a lot better than either letting him walk for free or trading him at a much lower value because teams will know he can walk.