In Defense of Chiarelli

[Mc5RingsAndABeer]

The Oilers have finished 30th, 29th, 25th, 28th, and 29th with Taylor Hall in the lineup. Ask yourselves, can this trade make us any worse?

Looking at the trade in a 1v1 perspective, we obviously lost but the trade opens up so much more opportunities for us to improve. We finally get a young stud dman, we're probably gonna get Lucic, and another dman. We badly needed to shakeup the culture of the team and this move did it. Chia has some balls. Something Tambo and MacT did not have before him.

**** logic. Hockey is a team sport. This team finished 29th with Connor McDavid. And before you say he only played half the session, the Oilers had a worse record with him than without.

Again, hockey is a team sport.

Chia is the polar opposite of Tambo. Both are garbage at trading.

 

[Rubi]

Three best, worst Peter Chiarelli moves in Boston

THE THREE BEST:

1) Signing Chara as a free agent: The Bruins made a monster splash on the first day of free agency in 2006 by signing the top player available on the market. The Bruins signed 6-foot-9 defenceman Zdeno Chara to a four-year deal worth $37.5 million. It was a home run. Chara immediately became the club’s captain and played a pivotal role in returning the organization to prominence. The shutdown defenceman won the Norris Trophy in 2008-09 and was among the best at his position for almost a decade in Black and Gold.

2) The Phil Kessel trade: Unable to sign his top scorer, Chiarelli dealt Phil Kessel to Toronto for a pair of first-round picks and a second-rounder. Unfortunately for Toronto, those first round picks yielded the Bruins centre Tyler Seguin and defenceman Dougie Hamilton. It was a career-defining deal for Chiarelli — until he screwed it up a few years later (you’ll read about that in the section below).

3) Hiring Claude Julien: The decision to bring in Dave Lewis didn’t work out, but Chiarelli reacted quickly to make up for it. The decision to hire Claude Julien in 2007 played a pivotal role in shaping the Bruins into a championship team. The club brought in Julien after he was fired mid-season by the New Jersey Devils and it turned out to be an excellent fit. Julien’s style worked well with the personnel Chiarelli was building and they built a team that perfectly represented the city of Boston.

THE THREE WORST:

1) Trading Tyler Seguin to Dallas: Chiarelli’s logic was somewhat reasonable. Seguin was coming off a rough playoff performance — one goal in 22 games — and his behaviour off the ice was concerning the organization. But it was clear from the get-go that the Bruins gave up on Seguin too early. They did not receive enough compensation from the Dallas Stars — acquiring Loui Eriksson, Reilly Smith, Joe Morrow and Matt Fraser — in return for a potential superstar. Seguin immediately flourished in Dallas, developing into the quality scorer the Bruins lacked this season. The move set the franchise back.


2)Trading Versteeg for Bochenski: In 2007, the Bruins not only gave away Versteeg, a blooming AHL player, but also had to deal a conditional draft pick in order to acquire forward Brandon Bochenski from the Chicago Blackhawks. Versteeg developed into a solid NHLer — winning a Stanley Cup in Chicago — while Bochenski played a total of 50 games with Boston. There’s nothing special about Versteeg, but the deal was a clear reflection of poor asset managemnt.

3) Trading Boychuk to the Islanders: The Bruins framed this deal as a salary dump, but it was a symptom of a bigger issue: Chiarelli’s team was too tight up against the cap. That’s a reflection of his management. The deal not only hurt the Bruins in the short-term, it boosted another team in their conference. Boychuk had a monster year while Boston was never able to replace Boychuk’s presence and production. A lack of quality defencemen played a large role in the Bruins’ early demise.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/three-best-worst-peter-chiarelli-moves-in-boston/

I guess we can start a new list for Edmonton.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

I think that part of the frustration at least on my part is that Larsson plays in the east so I for one haven't had a lot of viewings of him in recent years. IMO there is a lot to like with him, highly touted under 18 player, he was phenomenal in his pre-draft WJC's, he had a good start to his NHL career and then got injured and took a step back. Another thing for people to consider when comparing him to Fayne, Lou signed him to a $4+ million deal while he let Fayne walk for less. There is no way in hell that he is the same caliber of D that Fayne is, he is clearly ahead of waiver wire Fayne.

 

[belair]

Einstein never made that quote, its a fiction, like this thread.

I thought I saw everything on hf. But now people defending a Taylor Hall for Beans thread.

Is Klowe still managing the club? Tambo? This is the worst Oilers trade in decades.

From a quality of personnel POV, absolutely. But in terms of needs, this trade addressed something the team has sorely needed since Ryan Whitney's leg fell off--a legit top pairing defenseman.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Einstein never made that quote, its a fiction, like this thread.

I thought I saw everything on hf. But now people defending a Taylor Hall for Beans thread.

Is Klowe still managing the club? Tambo? This is the worst Oilers trade in decades.

Read again Replacement. Nobody's defending the trade. But people can see why it was made.

 

[Philly85*]

Subtract Hall and add Lucic, Larsson, and Demers and we are a better hockey team.

Some may argur subtracting Hall loses offense, the reality was we were well below average offensively because our D cannot get out of their own zone or move the puck. Larsson addresses that and Lucic will surely help with his board play.

I feel we are a better club *if* those other two moves happen also.

While I agree on this point, we better see both of those guys signed. And 2, even if the team is better off for it, they should've been able to get a better deal from NJ. Period. Hall for Larsson... Chia got pumped by Shero, there's no ands ifs or buts. I understand young RH D-men with top pairing potential are at an extreme premium, but we're talking about Taylor Hall, one of the best players in the world, scoring chance creating machine. Top 3 LW in the game. It's just not a good return, they should've been able to squeeze a pick out of NJ at least.

 

[La Bamba]

**** logic. Hockey is a team sport. This team finished 29th with Connor McDavid. And before you say he only played half the session, the Oilers had a worse record with him than without.

Again, hockey is a team sport.

Chia is the polar opposite of Tambo. Both are garbage at trading.

I'm not saying the Oilers were bad because of Hall. I said the Oilers were bad with Hall anyways so how could we possibly get worse with Larsson?

It was the inevitable that we had to make a trade for defence that we were going to lose value-vise. I always believed that but I didn't expect it to feel this bad. However, I do understand it's for the better.

 

[PinSeeker]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/three-best-worst-peter-chiarelli-moves-in-boston/

I guess we can start a new list for Edmonton.

Ok so, being devils advocate, how many cups have Dallas won with "superstar" Seguin? *And* Benn, the ultimate superstar who is one of few LW better than Hall? I think some confuse the NHL for the NBA where one superstar can single handedly win games. It is not like that.

 

[White Water Kayker]

I don't think we can judge yet. Plenty of time to make mor trades, Free Agency is just around the corner, and they are just starting to execute a plan in VERY tough circumstances.

The market is, what the market is. Tough for RHD.

 

[6 God]

Notable pieces only

Oilers forward depth:
1. McDavid
2. Hall
3. RNH
4. Draisaitl
6. Puljujarvi
7. Eberle
8. Lucic
9. Pouliot
10. Yakupov

Oilers defence depth:
1. Klefbom
2. Sekera
3. Davidson
4. Nurse

How do you win when you only have one guy capable of top pairing minutes, and one guy capable of top 4 minutes? Hall for Larsson is terrible straight across value, but the team makes the Oilers a better team.

 

[Draiskull]

So in your opinion Larsson is a top RHD?

He may not be a top RHD but he is better than Klefbom.. draw your own conclusions from that.

I would be okay with adding Demers to this group if we cant trade for an offensive Dman. Klefbom, Sekera and even Davidson have shown some offense.. Larsson not having to play 22 hardest minutes might get a look to shine on PP as well.



http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=10713

"Overall a very strong player with few weaknesses. Does a good job on the powerplay and is equally valuable in shorthanded situations."

He was given less than 14mins of PP time ALL season in NJ which give him 10 seconds \ game PPTOI
He was 3rd in the entire league when it comes to SH TOI.. and top 5 for SHTOI\game

Larsson may not be worth Hall but he is a good young big RH Dman.

 

[RattsSSV]

He may not be a top RHD but he is better than Klefbom.. draw your own conclusions from that.

I would be okay with adding Demers to this group if we cant trade for an offensive Dman. Klefbom, Sekera and even Davidson have shown some offense.. Larsson not having to play 22 hardest minutes might get a look to shine on PP as well.



http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=10713

"Overall a very strong player with few weaknesses. Does a good job on the powerplay and is equally valuable in shorthanded situations."

He was given less than 14mins of PP time ALL season in NJ which give him 10 seconds \ game PPTOI
He was 3rd in the entire league when it comes to SH TOI.. and top 5 for SHTOI\game

Larsson may not be worth Hall but he is a good young big RH Dman.

I agree he's definitely talented and there is a good chance his point production increases due to the increase in offensive talent on the Oilers, however not only do I fear the loss of Hall is going to sharply affect Draisaitl's game, but also the number of points the team produces.

 

[Replacement*]

I agree he's definitely talented and there is a good chance his point production increases due to the increase in offensive talent on the Oilers, however not only do I fear the loss of Hall is going to sharply affect Draisaitl's game, but also the number of points the team produces.

Of course it will. Drai without Hall? C'mon, that's like a Rum and Coke without Rum.

and I like draisaitl.

Chia has just insured that this club has trouble with line consistency next season. You don't replace a Taylor Hall, ever.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I agree he's definitely talented and there is a good chance his point production increases due to the increase in offensive talent on the Oilers, however not only do I fear the loss of Hall is going to sharply affect Draisaitl's game, but also the number of points the team produces.

Yeah they might finish 30th instead of 29th!

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Of course it will. Drai without Hall? C'mon, that's like a Rum and Coke without Rum.

and I like draisaitl.

Chia has just insured that this club has trouble with line consistency next season. You don't replace a Taylor Hall, ever.

You don't get better defensemen without trading something significant either

 

[redgrant]

So in your opinion Larsson is a top RHD?

He is not a PK, Karlsson, Doughty, Faulk or Weber. The price for those is one that is not feasible.

Larsson in my opinion is a 25 - 28 minute a night steady hand like Chiarelli stated he was last year with the toughest match ups.

I dont know if he will be a top 5 dman in the league. I DO know keeping taylor hall on this team is a guaranteed missed playoff year in perpetuity.

What people cant accept is this is the value of a winger like Taylor Hall in the league.

 

[Philly85*]

I agree he's definitely talented and there is a good chance his point production increases due to the increase in offensive talent on the Oilers, however not only do I fear the loss of Hall is going to sharply affect Draisaitl's game, but also the number of points the team produces.

I think a trade of this magnitude shakes up the mindset of the team... it's a major wake up call to everyone. Dramatic changes were/are in order, and it's time to put your game faces on and get serious. Apologies for using all those broad cliches, but it's true. You add a guy like Lucic into the dressing room, that instantly helps. I think Chiarelli and the coaching staff are probably telling the players, the leadership is all on your guys' shoulders now, and there shouldn't be any more whispers about dressing room clicks, any of this immature ********.

I imagine McLellan was consulted on this and I think he had the respect of the players, even in just a year coaching, but he's had Hall and Eberle for the WC's and a full NHL season, so he probably had a good sense of what was going on and gave Chiarelli his blessing in this. He was probably begging for competent D.

 

[redgrant]

Hall tilts the ice every time he is out there. D-man or not, he could do it alone. Hall is an all-star.

When you trade an all star expect to get one in return; Chia got us the next Tom Poti. Fire Chia before he trades McDavid for pieces.

He didnt do it alone so i dont know what this 'could' youre speaking of.

You have no idea if he is the next Tom Poti. Its just sour grapes on Hall fans parts. Only time will tell.

All I know is we traded a winger for a dman that can play 25+ minutes a night of the toughest minutes.

 

[MessierII]

People are as per usual

Overrating Hall coming off back to back dissapointing seasons.

Underrating Larsson who's a legit top pair right shot D with huge upside still

And underestimating the impact of a culture change. You ship out the face of the losing culture and division in the dressing room and bring in winning vets like Lucic and Demers it has a massive impact. Huge wake up call for Eberle and Nuge.

 

[RattsSSV]

He is not a PK, Karlsson, Doughty, Faulk or Weber. The price for those is one that is not feasible.

Larsson in my opinion is a 25 - 28 minute a night steady hand like Chiarelli stated he was last year with the toughest match ups.

I dont know if he will be a top 5 dman in the league. I DO know keeping taylor hall on this team is a guaranteed missed playoff year in perpetuity.

What people cant accept is this is the value of a winger like Taylor Hall in the league.

Larsson averaged 22:31 time on ice per game last year, and just under 21 minutes the year before (with substantially better numbers).

The fact that Chia bit does not mean this was a proper evaluation of Hall's value.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Larsson averaged 22:31 time on ice per game last year, and just under 21 minutes the year before (with substantially better numbers).

The fact that Chia bit does not mean this was a proper evaluation of Hall's value.

Isles said they wouldn't trade Hamonic for him.

He didn't get enough but I think that he got the best he could.

Hall isn't worth as much as people might think he is.

 

[redgrant]

Yeah, but a big part of that is adding Lucic and Demers which do not require subtracting Hall.

Try this one: Subtract Hall and add Larsson and we are a better hockey team. - I'm not buying it.

Or how about: Add Lucic and Demers and subtract no one and we are a better hockey team - I like this one better.

How are we better with no top pairing dman...please do share.

Demers is nice but you have to trade for genuine talent 25 minutes a night against the toughest competition.

 

[RattsSSV]

Isles said they wouldn't trade Hamonic for him.

He didn't get enough but I think that he got the best he could.

Hall isn't worth as much as people might think he is.

I understand and accept that, but then again it would be stupid of Snow to trade Hamonic (especially with that contract).

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I understand and accept that, but then again it would be stupid of Snow to trade Hamonic (especially with that contract).

You are correct. No reason for Snow to make that deal. Defensemen are an extremely valueable commodity that Oiler fans need to appreciate.

 

[redgrant]

Einstein never made that quote, its a fiction, like this thread.

I thought I saw everything on hf. But now people defending a Taylor Hall for Beans thread.

Is Klowe still managing the club? Tambo? This is the worst Oilers trade in decades.

What Im saying is they needed a 25 minute a night steady right hand shot dman. They got one.

Do you disagree that the team needed one?

Okay, if you do please tell me the trade you wanted.

We already know that on paper Hall is better than Johansen yet certain positions like centre are viewed as more important. Wingers are easily replaced. Hell even Columbus passed on the BPA to take a questionable centre.