OT: Fitness and Nutrition Part V

[Kriss E]

4 years ago i went from couch potatoe to lifting a bit too fast so I injured myself. So now I'm completely healed by physiotherapy, and two months ago I started lifting again, it went really fast and I trained hard so I started to lift heavier. There's a red light that went on in my mind, maybe going from couch potatoe to lifting hard and frequently isn't the best idea.

So I went to a gym where they do it hiit classes, and I intend to do it for 3 months before going back to lifting.

Does it make sense?

You don't have to do that. You can be very lean and strong with HIIT classes but get hurt on your first lift when you go heavy.
If your objective is to get stronger and lift heavy, then just stick to lifting. What is important is to learn how to lift properly and how to split up the lifts throughout the week. For technique purposes, there is no better option than finding a good trainer that can help you with this, and yes, you will need to dish out a bit of cash. Shop around. Find a good trainer, one that has experience in powerlifting lifts. Should be your best bet to find a trainer adequate in technique.

Btw, even in HIIT classes, you can still get hurt. Doing 400 bad air squats can be just as damaging as lifting moderate weight on bad form.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

If that's what you're going to do, consider doing bodyweight training at home during these months just to get your body back and ready instead of just diving in and lifting heavy off the bat.

3 days a week of home total body workouts built around pushups and pullups would be helpful IMO.

 

[Kriss E]

If that's what you're going to do, consider doing bodyweight training at home during these months just to get your body back and ready instead of just diving in and lifting heavy off the bat.

3 days a week of home total body workouts built around pushups and pullups would be helpful IMO.

Won't be helpful at all if he doesn't learn how to squat, deadlift, press, row, clean, snatch, properly once he goes back to lifting. So don't waste time doing BW training. Just go straight to lifting. Get a coach.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

Won't be helpful at all if he doesn't learn how to squat, deadlift, press, row, clean, snatch, properly once he goes back to lifting. So don't waste time doing BW training. Just go straight to lifting. Get a coach.

Obviously, but I'm talking about doing the bodyweight stuff while doing the HIIT training before he starts up with the weight training (as I read it as though he's taking a 3 month break from weight training).

 

[Mrb1p]

My GF wanted to start training so we got her a one month subscription at the gym, started her right off the bat on the 5/3/1 program, no f***ing around. We've had great success so far after a month, she loves it and says she'd much rather train this way than train with machines like she used to a few years ago when she got a subscription at Nautilus (Yuk.).

There's just a few cues I am not able to teach her, she's super stubborn and proud so she won't take my advice. I've been trying to teach her to hip hinge and to not collapse her upper body when coming out of the squat but we've hit a wall. Before she starts moving serious weights I gotta fix that.

She also went from not being able to do one single pull up to sets of four in a matter of weeks. Take that @DAChampion or was it @Kriss E ?

If that's what you're going to do, consider doing bodyweight training at home during these months just to get your body back and ready instead of just diving in and lifting heavy off the bat.

3 days a week of home total body workouts built around pushups and pullups would be helpful IMO.

I understand what you're trying to say but I don't think that's effective at all. Maybe if he doesn't have the time/money/whatever to actually go to a gym where he can learn these things properly. But there's little that body weight training can teach your body about heavy lifting. The mechanics are pretty far apart.

 

[Mrb1p]

Obviously, but I'm talking about doing the bodyweight stuff while doing the HIIT training before he starts up with the weight training (as I read it as though he's taking a 3 month break from weight training).

Which is the point, the 3 month break from weight training wont achieve much.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

My GF wanted to start training so we got her a one month subscription at the gym, started her right off the bat on the 5/3/1 program, no ****ing around. We've had great success so far after a month, she loves it and says she'd much rather train this way than train with machines like she used to a few years ago when she got a subscription at Nautilus (Yuk.).

There's just a few cues I am not able to teach her, she's super stubborn and proud so she won't take my advice. I've been trying to teach her to hip hinge and to not collapse her upper body when coming out of the squat but we've hit a wall. Before she starts moving serious weights I gotta fix that.

She also went from not being able to do one single pull up to sets of four in a matter of weeks. Take that @DAChampion or was it @Kriss E ?


I understand what you're trying to say but I don't think that's effective at all. Maybe if he doesn't have the time/money/whatever to actually go to a gym where he can learn these things properly. But there's little that body weight training can teach your body about heavy lifting. The mechanics are pretty far apart.

It really comes down to his health I guess. I'm reading it as though he suspects there might be an injury still hidden inside him... and that he's going to do 3 months of HIIT training as he tries to recover... I'm suggesting doing bodyweight training during this recovery....

Though perhaps I'm interpreting it wrong?

 

[Mrb1p]

It really comes down to his health I guess. I'm reading it as though he suspects there might be an injury still hidden inside him... and that he's going to do 3 months of HIIT training as he tries to recover... I'm suggesting doing bodyweight training during this recovery....

Though perhaps I'm interpreting it wrong?

Trying to recover on HIIT sounds like a stupidly bad idea depending on the injury, so I hope not.

 

[Kriss E]

Obviously, but I'm talking about doing the bodyweight stuff while doing the HIIT training before he starts up with the weight training (as I read it as though he's taking a 3 month break from weight training).

He is taking 3 months off because he thinks HIIT training will prepare him for weightlifting more, which it won't.
If he wants to lift, he should learn how to lift and focus on that.

I am assuming he got hurt because he didn't know what he was doing, which won't change unless he learns. He isn't going to learn about weightlifting doing BW and HIIT training, that was my point.

 

[Andrei79]

I agree with Kriss.

Getting a coach who has a good grasp on technique was the best thing I did to stay injury free.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

Trying to recover on HIIT sounds like a stupidly bad idea depending on the injury, so I hope not.

Depends on the HIIT training, you can HIIT train on a spin bike and perhaps it's a shoulder?

I guess this just needs to be clarified.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

He is taking 3 months off because he thinks HIIT training will prepare him for weightlifting more, which it won't.
If he wants to lift, he should learn how to lift and focus on that.

I am assuming he got hurt because he didn't know what he was doing, which won't change unless he learns. He isn't going to learn about weightlifting doing BW and HIIT training, that was my point.

I certainly agree with that. Comes down to if he's hurt or not.

 

[groovejuice]

The vegan crab cakes are incredible.

Food that is an oxymoron scares the crap out of me.

 

[Mike Mike Caron]

Won't be helpful at all if he doesn't learn how to squat, deadlift, press, row, clean, snatch, properly once he goes back to lifting. So don't waste time doing BW training. Just go straight to lifting. Get a coach.

Yes, I already know how to deadlift, front/back Squat, row, bench, overhead, curl. I had pre existing conditions that lead to injury, my technique was good as I went through a program when i was in CEGEP. My everyday posture was problematic thought, so my knees and shoulders were weak .

But im actually a full blown couch potatoe since three years, so i thought a boot camp was a good idea. Also I'm already fat, so going to lift weights and eat a lot might not be the best idea. I just want to go through a remise en forme and then go for the heavy lifting again.

 

[Mike Mike Caron]

All my injuries are fully healed for over a year. I went through physio to heal and get a better posture.

 

[Kriss E]

Yes, I already know how to deadlift, front/back Squat, row, bench, overhead, curl. I had pre existing conditions that lead to injury, my technique was good as I went through a program when i was in CEGEP. My everyday posture was problematic thought, so my knees and shoulders were weak .

But im actually a full blown couch potatoe since three years, so i thought a boot camp was a good idea. Also I'm already fat, so going to lift weights and eat a lot might not be the best idea. I just want to go through a remise en forme and then go for the heavy lifting again.

Well, doing a program in cegep doesn't mean the slightest bit of anything, no offense, and I don't believe anybody has a good technique on lifting unless they have been doing it for quite some time with meticulous focus or coaching.
That is from experience. Even the big football guys that I know were given weightlifting programs including the squats, presses, cleans, pretty much all of them have flawed technique. So again, my personal opinion is for you to get a qualified coach.
If he tells you that it's all good, then great, at least you can be confident with that.

But hey, if you are already convinced that your form is good, and you got hurt because of posture, which is now fixed, well then I don't see why you wouldn't want to go straight back to lifting.

If you want to go for a sweat doing simple exercises, well you can do that AND lift heavy. Split your lifts Mon-Wed-Fri, do some bootcamp hiit classes Tue-Thu. If 5 days/w is too much, do 2 heavy lift days, 2 HIIT or even just 1.
But if your goal is to lift heavy, then lift. Start slowly. Take 2 weeks to introduce the lifts back. Start with the empty bar, go through the motions again, stick to no load, following week, go very light load, and slowly start upping as you get more and more comfortable through the weeks.

As I said, it depends on your goals. If your objective is to lift, then lift. Do your ''remise en forme'' via very light loading lifts. Progressively increasing weight slowly as weeks go by.
If you want to shake off some rust, well you can do that and lift, alternating days throughout the week.
If you don't care for lifting, well just do HIIT.

 

[Paddyjack]

But im actually a full blown couch potatoe since three years, so i thought a boot camp was a good idea. Also I'm already fat, so going to lift weights and eat a lot might not be the best idea. I just want to go through a remise en forme and then go for the heavy lifting again.

There is nothing wrong with eating a lot when lifting weights even if you are fat, providing that you are eating properly and cutting the crap. It is a great way to lose weight actually.

 

[Mike Mike Caron]

@Kriss E

So you think i could do like a bunch of air squat one day and do squats with weights the following day? Given that my technique is perfect.

Not saying my technique is perfect.

 

[DAChampion]

3rd post in a row... but have you ever tried recipes from hotforfoodblog.com ? It's a vegan recipe blog, everything they do is too damn tasty. The vegan crab cakes are incredible.

No, thank you for the suggestion though. I like cooking and regularly take cooking classes. I'm also hosting a dinner party in two weeks in two weeks and may try one of the recipes for kicks. I'll let you know.

 

[DAChampion]

The two injuries that have significantly impacted me are shin splints and lower back pain.

I got shin splints in 2006 after a summer of very extended cardio. I was young then and did not even know about shin splints, I just ran and biked all summer, I even completed a duathlon at the end end. That's 5K run, 40 K bike, 10K run. I was fit, but once I got the shin splints I could not do significant running for two, maybe three years. The pain was excruciating. It went away with time -- years.

I had lower back pain in two episodes, once around 2009 and another time around 2015. The one I got first had much more severe pain, and I couldn't walk without looking ridiculous, however I recovered within a few weeks of doing good physiological and sleeping on the floor. I got it from overusing the elliptical trainer, I was (and succeeding) at losing weight by doing lots, and lots, and lots of cardio. I'd go one hour every morning, right when waking up, to the gym next door. It's a common injury and I would not do that again. Given these two experiences, I am now a skeptic of heavy cardiovascular exercise, I think that it should be done sparingly to prevent overuse injuries.

The second episode was around 2015. The pain was not as severe but took a lot longer to treat. I could not sit down for long periods which made it hard to either drive or take planes. I used some combination of weight loss, better posture, physiotherapy, pilates, osteopathy, yoga, to get better, with the combination changing with time as it took a year. I'm not sure which factor mattered most.

 

[Kriss E]

@Kriss E

So you think i could do like a bunch of air squat one day and do squats with weights the following day? Given that my technique is perfect.

Not saying my technique is perfect.

Air squats should be in your warm up to lifting.
I would advise you to start with lifting. If you haven't done crap in a long time, jumping into a class with high intensity is the perfect way to get injured and be completely sore for the next 3 days.
Intensity should be progressively increased. If you go to your local gym HIIT classes though, chances are you're going to be pushed for about 45-50min, and wrecked by the end of it, which should be the last thing you want to do.
1) Your body isn't in a state where it will support this right now.
2) Due to this, you have an increased chance of injury, even with BW movements.
3) You have been away for a while, going back to the gym regularly and as often as possible to get you into a habit of it should be the priority.

Again, I am saying these things with the assumption that Lifting is what you want to get into.

If you absolutely want to do HIIT though, well try to avoid whatever muscle you are going to work on the following day. If you're going to lift tuesday with some squats, don't do HIIT on your legs monday.
You should use HIIT to compliment your lifts, not the other way around.

 

[Kriss E]

The two injuries that have significantly impacted me are shin splints and lower back pain.

I got shin splints in 2006 after a summer of very extended cardio. I was young then and did not even know about shin splints, I just ran and biked all summer, I even completed a duathlon at the end end. That's 5K run, 40 K bike, 10K run. I was fit, but once I got the shin splints I could not do significant running for two, maybe three years. The pain was excruciating. It went away with time -- years.

I had lower back pain in two episodes, once around 2009 and another time around 2015. The one I got first had much more severe pain, and I couldn't walk without looking ridiculous, however I recovered within a few weeks of doing good physiological and sleeping on the floor. I got it from overusing the elliptical trainer, I was (and succeeding) at losing weight by doing lots, and lots, and lots of cardio. I'd go one hour every morning, right when waking up, to the gym next door. It's a common injury and I would not do that again. Given these two experiences, I am now a skeptic of heavy cardiovascular exercise, I think that it should be done sparingly to prevent overuse injuries.

The second episode was around 2015. The pain was not as severe but took a lot longer to treat. I could not sit down for long periods which made it hard to either drive or take planes. I used some combination of weight loss, better posture, physiotherapy, pilates, osteopathy, yoga, to get better, with the combination changing with time as it took a year. I'm not sure which factor mattered most.

I developed back pain as well, it is incredibly frustrating. I got it from being poorly coached. Terrible coaching cues during the squat and deadlifts. Destroyed my back at a crossfit competition because my idiot first coach cared more about having all his members join competitions than actual coaching.
I should give him credit though, if it weren't for this then maybe I never would have researched and studied the technical aspects of movements as much as I have.

A lot of stretching and myofascial release helped.

Did you use any of the shin splints creams?

 

[DAChampion]

Medical researchers from the University of Toronto who receive funding from pasta manufacturer Barilla have published a paper arguing that pasta is good for weight loss:

Here is the paper:
Effect of pasta in the context of low-glycaemic index dietary patterns on body weight and markers of adiposity: a systematic review and meta-analysis of randomised controlled trials in adults

Here is a past news report on their research funding, they've previously taken money from soft drink manufacturers:
Canadian researchers have received hundreds of thousands from soft-drink makers and the sugar industry

 

[DAChampion]

I developed back pain as well, it is incredibly frustrating. I got it from being poorly coached. Terrible coaching cues during the squat and deadlifts. Destroyed my back at a crossfit competition because my idiot first coach cared more about having all his members join competitions than actual coaching.
I should give him credit though, if it weren't for this then maybe I never would have researched and studied the technical aspects of movements as much as I have.

A lot of stretching and myofascial release helped.

Did you use any of the shin splints creams?

No, I don't recall using such creams. What are they?

I just waited two years or so for it to go away, it might have been three years. The student-physiotherapists told me to run a little bit and to experience a little bit of pain, to stimulate the healing process.

 

[Dominator13]

I'm really going to need a good reason to avoid lypo soon. No matter what I do, how much weight I lose or muscle mass that I gain, I CANNOT get rid of the side fat in the chest area. I've been fighting it for 15 years now..