Spirits
Avalanche and Vikings
- Jul 12, 2014
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So you’re declining to engage in good faith about where inside the top 20 McDavid would land with a needed Cup win?
Let's see if he can win a series vs a non Pacific team first.
So you’re declining to engage in good faith about where inside the top 20 McDavid would land with a needed Cup win?
Let's see if he can win a series vs a non Pacific team first.
Crosby 5× 13,14,15,16,17At this point, it looks very likely that McDavid will finish somewhere in the top five in Hart trophy voting. If that's the case, it will be his 8th consecutive year. The only players with longer streaks, in all of NHL history, are Wayne Gretzky and Gordie Howe.
Most consecutive seasons, top 5 in Hart voting (1924-2023)
- 12x - Wayne Gretzky (1980 to 1991)
- 10x - Gordie Howe (1957 to 1966)
- 8x - Bobby Orr (1968 to 1975)
- 7x - Connor McDavid (2017 to 2023) - soon to be 8x?
- 6x - Bobby Hull (1964 to 1969)
- 6x - Guy Lafleur (1975 to 1980)
- 5x - Bobby Clarke (1973 to 1977)
- 5x - Gordie Howe (1951 to 1955)
You're right - thanks for the correction.Crosby 5× 13,14,15,16,17
???I don’t know if it affects their legacy so much as their standing amongst the greats.
Not really. Their legacy is what they’re ultimately known for whereas their standing is where they fall in terms of the best ever. Regardless if he wins a cup Connor will be seen as a top ten player of all time, yet his legacy can be vastly different if he’s got a ring.???
those are identical
I didn't actually understand the exercise was this silly. Parsing between "what they're ultimately known for" and "where they fall in terms of the best ever" for a top player is the same thing, and it's an insult to intelligence itself to listen to you explain otherwise. Come on man.Not really. Their legacy is what they’re ultimately known for whereas their standing is where they fall in terms of the best ever. Regardless if he wins a cup Connor will be seen as a top ten player of all time, yet his legacy can be vastly different if he’s got a ring.
Okie dokieI didn't actually understand the exercise was this silly. Parsing between "what they're ultimately known for" and "where they fall in terms of the best ever" for a top player is the same thing, and it's an insult to intelligence itself to listen to you explain otherwise. Come on man.
I know it's a flawed stat, but Dionne was a +27 in his career even with almost 500 ES goals, while the Flower was a + 446 and nearly 400 ES goals.Of course. Compare the careers of Dionne and Lafleur and tell me which one is held in greater esteem than the other and why
Yea that is the case but I can't imagine it's due to Lafleur hustling on the backcheck. (Not that Dionne ever did either)I know it's a flawed stat, but Dionne was a +27 in his career even with almost 500 ES goals, while the Flower was a + 446 and nearly 400 ES goals.
But that also affects legacies in terms of the teams surrounding them and the expectations. Certainly helps to be lazy on the backcheck when you have Lapointe, Savard, Robinson and Dryden in nets than it does Bob Murdoch, Dave Hutchinson and an aging Vachon.Yea that is the case but I can't imagine it's due to Lafleur hustling on the backcheck. (Not that Dionne ever did either)
Fully agreed. Especially cups where the player is the best or 2nd best player on the team.Cup wins don't really effect the legacy of stars or lesser players much. They effect the legacy of superstars/generational players though.
Yup and right or wrong these outside things DO impact how we think of each guy. Maybe not you and I but the great majority.But that also affects legacies in terms of the teams surrounding them and the expectations. Certainly helps to be lazy on the backcheck when you have Lapointe, Savard, Robinson and Dryden in nets than it does Bob Murdoch, Dave Hutchinson and an aging Vachon.
While I'm certain Bowman's leash for Lafleur was longer than most guys on the team...it is hard to imagine he'd have been really cool with #10 sauntering back every game on a back check. As good as Lemaire defensively was plus the big 3 on D, Montreal's greatness was all pulling in the same direction...even when to spite Bowman,But that also affects legacies in terms of the teams surrounding them and the expectations. Certainly helps to be lazy on the backcheck when you have Lapointe, Savard, Robinson and Dryden in nets than it does Bob Murdoch, Dave Hutchinson and an aging Vachon.