Devils 2017-18 team discussion (player news and notes) - Offseason part VIII

[Devil X]

I'm not sure Ray knows what a good Dman is? He has a history of hiring bad coach and making questionable moves with defesnemen.

His last 3 coaching hires - Therrien, Bylsma and Hynes...Wooof

Scudari, Murray, Traded for a broken down Jordan Leopold

David Schlemko
John Moore
Gragnani
Warsofsky
Quincey
Lovejoy
Auvitu
Stollery
Prout
Kapla

Just Brought in
Brian Strait
Mirco Muller

Talk about a big steaming pile of crap?

I think Shero should hire someone to deal with the defense and picking coaches. Let him stick to trading for forwards.

These guys (bold) weren't that bad. I know take a lot of crap around here but you could do far worst then him, see some of the other names on this list. Schlemko was fine while he was here, for a while he was one of the better Dman on the team. Lovejoy was coming off an impressive cup run and we misuse him, expect him to play above his head because we dont have anyone else who can. But on a 3rd paring maybe even a second he would be fine. Ov2 never got a fair shot, as many people pointed out he had good underlying numbers.

Its not fair at all to judge Mueller until the guy plays some games for us. He has what 54 NHL games! Hardly worth an evaluation. Kapla is a college FA who played some games with us again not even close to fair to judge him yet.

Dman are harder and harder to get now-a-days and the fact of the matter is we needed offense way more then we needed D when Shero came in. We all thought our D prospects were studs and now we are left with Severson and Santini the two we thought would be the better of the group.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

My problem with it is we are going to have to give both Henrique and MarJo longterm deals next summer and I am not sure that I want to do that.

 

[Devil X]

I just don't think he's all that great and was particularly mediocre last year. And frankly, I'd be disappointed if Zacha alone doesn't match what Henrique was able to do last year. Mojo, Zacha's development, Hischier, McLeod, Boyle in for Fiddler, etc. all should help the offense. And presumably the defenseman we'd get for Henrique would help the offense some.

Henrique could be playing against 3rd liners next season. He would do damage against most 3rd liners next year. Thats depth that i want, a former 30 goal scorer, likely a 20-25 goal guy on a 3rd line.

Its way to early for put lines out but if McLeod doesnt make the team or if the move Hischer to RW then its easy to see Henrique as our 3rd line LW.

 

[britdevil]

Can't we just be happy that we're going into next season with a seemingly competent forward core?

Larsson returned friggin Taylor Hall. Defense is a premium we can't afford right now.

Shero has a history of good trades. Hopefully he can work his magic, but I won't hold out hope.

Excited to see what our young forwards can do!

 

[EnglishDevil]

My problem with it is we are going to have to give both Henrique and MarJo longterm deals next summer and I am not sure that I want to do that.

With the cap rising i'm not too worried about this, they already cost $4m & $4.5m respectively and using the Oshie contract as a benchmark I can't see either getting considerably more than $6m.

Obviously they'll be 28-29 when their contracts expire, so i'd be hesitant to extend them for 8 years, but i'd happily give them 5-6 years at a slightly higher salary.

 

[devilsblood]

It would be really nice if Mueller works out.

As of right now, I'd say there is a lot riding on that.

And it's why I'm not so into the idea of going out and getting a Markov.

We made a move for Mueller, let's see what he's got.

 

[Setec Astronomy]

Shero's drafting history with the Penguins is largely irrelevant since his scouting staff with the Devils is not the same. (Or at least largely not the same; not clear if there are some junior scouts that were with the Penguins). For the most part, Castron presents options in the first round to Shero and Shero makes a decision. Pretty much after the first or second rounds, the scouts make the draft decisions except Shero might say we need to start drafting at a particular position.

The one huge draft blunder Shero is supposedly responsible for while in Pittsburgh was vetoing his scouts on Brandon Saad because of supposed "attitude issues." That's the story anyway, who knows whether it's true.

 

[Better Call Sal]

Can't we just be happy that we're going into next season with a seemingly competent forward core?

Larsson returned friggin Taylor Hall. Defense is a premium we can't afford right now.

Shero has a history of good trades. Hopefully he can work his magic, but I won't hold out hope.

Excited to see what our young forwards can do!

I agree with the Brit!

 

[devilsblood]

With the cap rising i'm not too worried about this, they already cost $4m & $4.5m respectively and using the Oshie contract as a benchmark I can't see either getting considerably more than $6m.

Obviously they'll be 28-29 when their contracts expire, so i'd be hesitant to extend them for 8 years, but i'd happily give them 5-6 years at a slightly higher salary.

There's a lot of math involved but as long as we are in position to sign Nico, Zacha, McLeod etc when the time comes, 5 x's 6 for either guy seems fair.

 

[JimEIV]

Shero's drafting history with the Penguins is largely irrelevant since his scouting staff with the Devils is not the same. (Or at least largely not the same; not clear if there are some junior scouts that were with the Penguins). For the most part, Castron presents options in the first round to Shero and Shero makes a decision. Pretty much after the first or second rounds, the scouts make the draft decisions except Shero might say we need to start drafting at a particular position.

The one huge draft blunder Shero is supposedly responsible for while in Pittsburgh was vetoing his scouts on Brandon Saad because of supposed "attitude issues." That's the story anyway, who knows whether it's true.

That is why in my original statement I left out draft picks only mentioned transactions....Never mentioned draft picks, that was someone else....

Poopooliot

 

[SpeakingOfTheDevils]

Can't we just be happy that we're going into next season with a seemingly competent forward core?

Larsson returned friggin Taylor Hall. Defense is a premium we can't afford right now.

Shero has a history of good trades. Hopefully he can work his magic, but I won't hold out hope.

Excited to see what our young forwards can do!

Like I said, I'm not opposed to moving Henrique if it's a good value deal for us. But, as it stands, the D market is stiff, and I don't think there are any rip-offs for Shero to take advantage of.

Hall-Hischier-XXX
Zacha/Johansson-Johansson/Zacha-Palmieri
Henrique-Zajac-McLeod
Wood-Boyle-Noesen

I mean, that's some gorgeous depth.

 

[MartyOwns]

Are we talking a #4 d-man? I'd rather have the 30 goals.

I’d rather have a top 4 defenseman. and to answer your question, that would be a first or second pairing defenseman.

I would love the hypothetical 30 goals too, but it’s more important to have a defenseman who can keep the puck on NJ's sticks (preventing shots/goals against) and can transition the puck out of our zone without looking like a caveman stooge. those things add up to more than 30 goals over the course of a season

 

[Stephen Gionta]

in 359 days from now, offer John Carlson a 7 year, 56 million dollar deal.

 

[Stephen Gionta]

My problem with it is we are going to have to give both Henrique and MarJo longterm deals next summer and I am not sure that I want to do that.

It will only be a ~1 million raise for MoJo and a ~1.5 million raise for Henrique. Not too tough to swallow

 

[Edmonton East]

Nico isn't going to play center if he makes the team. They will start him on the wing.

He's a center. Constantly shifting players out of position is foolish.

Everyone constantly putting him at Center out of the gate isn't being realistic.

It is extremely rare for an 18 year old to start at C in the NHL. Even McDavid played a good amount of wing just last season. Starting a (probably) 185 pound 18 year old kid at Center is foolish. And he has played a good amount of wing, so it isn't "shifting him out of position." And finally, the team has several more experience Centers. Will be shocked if he doesn't start the season at wing, most likely right.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

It will only be a ~1 million raise for MoJo and a ~1.5 million raise for Henrique. Not too tough to swallow

Its moreso about locking up these players longterm than the cap hit

 

[AfroThunder396]

The problem is that high quality defensemen just aren't available that often.

When they are, teams jump all over it (Scandella). It's tough to be the one standing tall when you're competing with 20 other GM's for the same player.

As a result, inferior defensemen get bloated contracts out of desperation (Kulikov, Alzner, Russell) which end up hurting the team long term.

Clearly our plan is to look into the big fish (Shattenkirk, etc), but instead of signing low quality guys to big deals just to say we did something, instead we're signing mid/low tier guys to reasonable 1-3 year deals that can easily be dumped.

We are in no position to be giving up the asinine overpayment some teams are asking for. Edmonton could afford to lose Hall because they had McDavid, Draisaitl, RNH, Klefbom, Eberle at the time, Nurse, etc. We don't have anywhere near that surplus of quality a the moment.

 

[Triumph]

Scandella is not a high quality defenseman. He's a decent 2nd/3rd pairing guy.

The Devils have to find someone around the league who is undervalued. Hopefully they've done that with Mirco Mueller but I'm pretty skeptical there.

 

[NjDevsRR]

I'm not sure Ray knows what a good Dman is? He has a history of hiring bad coach and making questionable moves with defesnemen.

His last 3 coaching hires - Therrien, Bylsma and Hynes...Wooof

Scudari, Murray, Traded for a broken down Jordan Leopold

David Schlemko
John Moore
Gragnani
Warsofsky
Quincey
Lovejoy
Auvitu
Stollery
Prout
Kapla

Just Brought in
Brian Strait
Mirco Muller

Talk about a big steaming pile of crap?

I think Shero should hire someone to deal with the defense and picking coaches. Let him stick to trading for forwards.

How can you even question the ones I highlighted above? Those are absolutely no risk pickups. We were in no position to be trading away assets so picking up these type of players hoping they can find their game and round out to be good NHL defensemen is exactly what Shero had to do. You cannot criticize that. Also guys like Lovejoy, Quincey and Prout are temporary stop gaps because we literally have nothing else. As Tri said they have to find undervalued defensemen and until you can afford to give away assets you cannot do much else.

 

[Hellraiser]

I could sound stupid saying this but IMO this defense is as bad as the Stars defense of the past few seasons. We could have all the offense in the world and Cory but this team won't do any better than a bubble team if Ray doesn't address the D. I don't mind being bad for another season and having a shot at a really good player again but something must be done to fix the defense before the start of the 18-19 season whether it be signing Carlson and trading for a top 4 defenseman. By this point one of the kids will be expendable to make a trade

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

I don't see any way Washington lets Carlson walk.

I think you guys should put an end to that pipe dream right now.

 

[devilsblood]

I’d rather have a top 4 defenseman. and to answer your question, that would be a first or second pairing defenseman.

I would love the hypothetical 30 goals too, but it’s more important to have a defenseman who can keep the puck on NJ's sticks (preventing shots/goals against) and can transition the puck out of our zone without looking like a caveman stooge. those things add up to more than 30 goals over the course of a season

obviously if we can get a legit top pairing guy you make that trade. But a run of the mill 2nd pairing d-man? I'll keep Rico and cross my fingers on Mueller and Santini.

 

[Scorcho]

Drafting Rasmus Dahlin would do a lot for this team. Keep Henrique and Zacha, and see how this season unfolds. If we challenge for the playoffs, fine. If we can draft at the top again, fine aswell. This is a very deep draft and can help us a lot for the future years. We have to think long term here.

Imagine drafting Dahlin and signing Carlson next off-season. Defense is set for many years.

stop it, i need to change my pants

 

[The 29th Pick]

I don't see any way Washington lets Carlson walk.

I think you guys should put an end to that pipe dream right now.

I agree and its too bad, he'd be the one big free agent that wants to come home..to us

 

[Desert Devil]

I'd honestly rather just sign a veteran dman to shore up the backend than trade a young forward. I doubt other teams value Henrique like we do. We would be getting a defenseman that is more inferior at his position than Henrique is at his position if that makes sense.

Depending on how the Capitals do this year I could easily see Carlson testing the market. The Caps haven't done anything lately and he would get paid a ridiculous amount on the open market. I don't think it's that out of the question. Plus he was Devils fan growing up!