Common Sense Line-up for 2014-2015

Mule93

Registered User
Mar 3, 2014
12
0
Times change my friend. Old players don't always stay the same. I guess you've been doing other things than watching hockey the last few seasons? Welcome back to the sport then! :)

Sure, times do change mate but EVERY team will ALWAYS need blue collar, workman style role players. The freakin Kings just won 2 cups with a grind team. Abs and Cleary are more then capable of doing that. And just because I don't post here doesn't mean I don't watch hockey, in fact, I probably watch more then you and your basic post with nothing to back up your stupid claim shows that maybe you should watch or play some more
 

Vladdy84

L-O-Y-A-L-T-Y
Dec 1, 2011
10,675
12
Farmington
Sure, times do change mate but EVERY team will ALWAYS need blue collar, workman style role players. The freakin Kings just won 2 cups with a grind team. Abs and Cleary are more then capable of doing that. And just because I don't post here doesn't mean I don't watch hockey, in fact, I probably watch more then you and your basic post with nothing to back up your stupid claim shows that maybe you should watch or play some more

Huh? You mean their 4th line? I'd like to think they won because they have Quick, Doughty and insane center depth and highly skilled wingers. Not to mentioned 4 or 5 really good d-men.Seriously don' put DFC in the same realm as the Kings 3rd and 4th line players.
 

Mule93

Registered User
Mar 3, 2014
12
0
, who around here is optimistic that Cleary is capable of doing that again? And that's what it's all about, guys like him have to deliever right now. Where else is the sense in resigning him?

I am. Every team needs experienced role players to fill the voids. Cant have 100% speed and skill for a team, it doesn't work. He knows the R.W system and Babcock knows how to use him. Noone *****ed about Draper/Maltby sticking around. This is EXACTLY the same.
 

Vladdy84

L-O-Y-A-L-T-Y
Dec 1, 2011
10,675
12
Farmington
I am. Every team needs experienced role players to fill the voids. Cant have 100% speed and skill for a team, it doesn't work. He knows the R.W system and Babcock knows how to use him. Noone *****ed about Draper/Maltby sticking around. This is EXACTLY the same.

I absolutely loathed the last few years of Draper and McCarty.
 

Mule93

Registered User
Mar 3, 2014
12
0
Huh? You mean their 4th line? I'd like to think they won because they have Quick, Doughty and insane center depth and highly skilled wingers. Not to mentioned 4 or 5 really good d-men.Seriously don' put DFC in the same realm as the Kings 3rd and 4th line players.

Having C depth and solid D is the back bone of a grind style team. Any team style really so that doesn't mean anything. Only high skill player on their team IMO is Gaborik now. Kopitar is solid but doesn't have much wow factor. They have a good system. They built a blue collar grind team, got that working and are now slotting in skill. They'll be tough for a while now.
 

Mule93

Registered User
Mar 3, 2014
12
0
I absolutely loathed the last few years of Draper and McCarty.

Well, maybe I'm just a sucker for the status quo :p I loved them in '08. Think we would've got the cup without them? Probably, but I am sure they helped haha
 

Vladdy84

L-O-Y-A-L-T-Y
Dec 1, 2011
10,675
12
Farmington
Having C depth and solid D is the back bone of a grind style team. Any team style really so that doesn't mean anything. Only high skill player on their team IMO is Gaborik now. Kopitar is solid but doesn't have much wow factor. They have a good system. They built a blue collar grind team, got that working and are now slotting in skill. They'll be tough for a while now.

Okay. :laugh:
 

Mule93

Registered User
Mar 3, 2014
12
0

That's called reality :p but I mean for their forwards. Not talking about D. No denying that they have skilled D. Without Doughty, they might not have even made the playoffs let alone make that dream cup run.

Can we talk about RW lines now. Dunno why everyone hates Abs with Dats. Unless we stack the 1st line and have Pav and Z together. Having Dats C for Abs and Cleary seems a very logical option. They have hours of ice time together. They could easily make perfect room for Dats to just go nuts and work the magic.

Sure, you could make it Abs, Dats, Tats. But then you compromise the Tats, Helm, Glendening speed grind line. Tats and Helm are good buddies irl. Let them play together and magic will happen. Therefore, line 2 can only be Abs, Dats, Cleary. Unless again, you stack line 1 and *puke* use Weiss as 2nd C. Which isn't ideal... In the slightest
 
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Mule93

Registered User
Mar 3, 2014
12
0
Kopitar is to LA what Datsyuk/Zetterberg have been to Detroit.

Totally, he is part of the foundation of that current team. I was just trying to say while he is very adept, he still relies on physicality. He isn't a massive threat like Gaborik is.
 

abparry87

Registered User
Jun 11, 2010
204
67
Australia
That's called reality :p but I mean for their forwards. Not talking about D. No denying that they have skilled D. Without Doughty, they might not have even made the playoffs let alone make that dream cup run.

Can we talk about RW lines now. Dunno why everyone hates Abs with Dats. Unless we stack the 1st line and have Pav and Z together. Having Dats C for Abs and Cleary seems a very logical option. They have hours of ice time together. They could easily make perfect room for Dats to just go nuts and work the magic.

Sure, you could make it Abs, Dats, Tats. But then you compromise the Tats, Helm, Glendening speed grind line. Tats and Helm are good buddies irl. Let them play together and magic will happen. Therefore, line 2 can only be Abs, Dats, Cleary. Unless again, you stack line 1 and *puke* use Weiss as 2nd C. Which isn't ideal... In the slightest

Did you watch any hockey with the D, abs and cleary line? It was just horrible
 
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Tomas W

Registered User
Oct 23, 2007
7,097
489
Sweden
Sure, times do change mate but EVERY team will ALWAYS need blue collar, workman style role players. The freakin Kings just won 2 cups with a grind team. Abs and Cleary are more then capable of doing that. And just because I don't post here doesn't mean I don't watch hockey, in fact, I probably watch more then you and your basic post with nothing to back up your stupid claim shows that maybe you should watch or play some more

Not impossible, I usually watch 1-2 NHL game a week, so I might have missed the games were Cleary looked like he did something usefull, but judging from the stats and from the rest of the crowd in this forum, I don't really think so.

Everyone got thier opinion though, I'm happy for Cleary that he got some fans left. We'll see if he can hold on to a spot on the team this year. There is a risk that he will get benched.
 

Mule93

Registered User
Mar 3, 2014
12
0
Not impossible, I usually watch 1-2 NHL game a week, so I might have missed the games were Cleary looked like he did something usefull, but judging from the stats and from the rest of the crowd in this forum, I don't really think so.

Everyone got thier opinion though, I'm happy for Cleary that he got some fans left. We'll see if he can hold on to a spot on the team this year. There is a risk that he will get benched.

I wouldn't say I'm a Cleary fan.. Haha.. I kinda just think he is getting alot of unfair criticism. When healthy, he is a very capable role player. If someone steps up at training camp or pre season and takes his spot. Then good for them and another wrap on the knuckles for Kenny.

But we can only make lines with what we have. And to me, line 2 Abs, Dats, Cleary makes the most sense if you want to avoid stacking line 1 with D and Z and using Weiss other then the 4th line.

I just really want to see line 3 as - Tats-Helm-Glendening - and to get that, that 2nd line is the only option
 
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Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,267
14,765
I just really want to see line 3 as - Tats-Helm-Glendening - and to get that, that 2nd line is the only option

You want a player who scored 1 goal in 56 games to be on our 3rd like???!
 

HisNoodliness

The Karate Kid and ASP Kai
Jun 29, 2014
3,677
2,044
Toronto
Mule93-I'm trying so hard to figure out if you're being sarcastic or not. Firstly Kopitar is one of the most skilled players in the league. I don't agree with these people, but there are many that are starting to throw him into the whole best player in the league conversation. Once again, I don't think he's on that level, but that some people do demonstrates how high up there he is. In SKILL and every other part of the game. (While the Kings are very physcial, and grind very effectively, they're also very skilled-one dimensional teams that are only good at grinding or only skilled can't win the cup, you have to be at least pretty good at everything, and really good at some things to win) Next I can see no way that anyone likes Cleary more than Weiss. Did Weiss play horribly last season? And a couple before? Yes, but he uses injuries as an excuse and because he has been skilled in the past and we threw him a five year deal, we sort of have to give him the benefit of the doubt and hope he can maybe be an acceptable 2nd line center. If it really was all injuries then I see no reason why he can't be a decent #2 C. If he fails then either Helm or Sheahan will get a shot, and if they can't survive that position, then unfortunately Z will have to play C. Regardless Weiss/Helm/Sheahan should be plans A, B and C with Z being plan D. Cleary has faced injuries as well, but even when healthy it's been a long long time since he's been a contributing player in any way, offense, defense, (I guess he has leadership and maybe can inspire people by looking like he's trying-even if his effort is entirely in vain). Abby on the first line is ok, there are guys I'd rather see, but I can accept it, I guess. Finally, Glendenning on the third line: I am almost lost for words that this is your holy grail third line. Helm and Tats together, that's fine. I like Sheahan in that spot, but I love Helm so I'm fine with him there too. Regardless, Glendenning is a fringe fourth line player. He cannot score, I have seen dead animals put the puck in the net more. I know scoring isn't the goal of the third line, but you need some contribution. We have so many forward options that can slot in there, honestly besides Cleary (Gustavsson, Howard, and Lashoff I guess should be included as well, but they aren't forwards so they don't count, but I'd take Smith there over Glendenning every day of the week) I don't think there is anyone on the team worse suited for that spot than Glendenning. Also before you do some watch/play more claim, I practice twice a week, play once/twice a week (dependent on schedule) and watch 82 wings games a year, 41+ Bolts games, and probably another 41 random games a year, not including playoffs. You might watch/play more, but I find it a little doubtful.
 

Chance on Chance

Registered User
Jul 15, 2009
2,851
0
Canada
Pretty good article on the defense: http://www.wingingitinmotown.com/2014/9/3/6087059/red-wings-wowy-defense

Basically it says to play Brendan Smith on the top pair, and bury Quincey on the 3rd pair. And give Kindls spot to a rookie. And uses stats to support it.

Pretty much matches up with what I think.

Yup, between this, the zone entry article and watching him after being split from quincey he should start with Kronwall. Also only 16 days till training camp means DDK will be signed for something new to talk about
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,267
14,765
Yup, between this, the zone entry article and watching him after being split from quincey he should start with Kronwall. Also only 16 days till training camp means DDK will be signed for something new to talk about

Quincey is not the ideal partner for a rookie, but then again, he's not the ideal partner for anyone.

I would set the lines like WIIM suggests.

Kronwall-Smith
Dekeyser-Ericsson
Quincey-Rookie

I think that's ideal. Maybe swap Smith and Big E.
 

Chance on Chance

Registered User
Jul 15, 2009
2,851
0
Canada
Quincey is not the ideal partner for a rookie, but then again, he's not the ideal partner for anyone.

I would set the lines like WIIM suggests.

Kronwall-Smith
Dekeyser-Ericsson
Quincey-Rookie

I think that's ideal. Maybe swap Smith and Big E.

I dont like Quincey with a rookie either. Its almost as he needs to play with DDK or E and then have the other one with a rookie.

Kronwall - Smith
DDK - Quincey
E - Rookie

With PK time and other situations Ericsson gets his 20 min
 

Henkka

Registered User
Jan 31, 2004
31,216
12,208
Tampere, Finland
I dont like Quincey with a rookie either. Its almost as he needs to play with DDK or E and then have the other one with a rookie.

Kronwall - Smith
DDK - Quincey
E - Rookie

With PK time and other situations Ericsson gets his 20 min

I like that too (if there's a rookie, not Kindl, on the field).
 

Cyborg Yzerberg

Registered User
Nov 8, 2007
11,152
2,372
Philadelphia
Firstly, Draper and Maltby's last few years here, even Holmstrom's, were extremely contested.

As for the comments regarding LA's team, they have a top 5 center, goalie, and defenseman. They are extremely deep, have the best GM in the league right now, who prudently uses advanced stats. So, they're not some grind team.
 

Mister Ed

Registered User
Dec 21, 2008
5,256
969
I dont like Quincey with a rookie either. Its almost as he needs to play with DDK or E and then have the other one with a rookie.

Kronwall - Smith
DDK - Quincey
E - Rookie

With PK time and other situations Ericsson gets his 20 min

This is what I would do too, the rookie being Sproul in this situation, playing on the PP.
 

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