Rumor: Chris Tanev Mega Thread - All proposals & discussion

[terrible dee]

People praising his defense are totally forgetting one of the best qualities in his game,

See, most people don't know this, but there is a difference between an offensive defenceman and a "puck-moving" defenceman,

Scotty Bowman famously was not a fan of Paul Coffey, and traded him twice, due to the fact that he was not a good puck mover unless he was rushing the puck.

Tanev's first pass out of the zone is as good as anyone's, he is a top quality "Puck-Mover" he would have to be, guys who only play "D" really don't cut it in the NHL anymore. You have to be able to regain possession, hang onto the puck long enough for the break out to get set, then deliver the pass,

THIS is why Tanev is highly coveted, and why he is so valued, by world cup teammates and the leagues GM's and coaches,

Tanev can read the play coming at him, break it up, regain possession and send the forwards back into the offensive zone, he has minimal points because the Canucks haven't scored a goal off the rush in a decade. It's been all about the Sedin Cycle, now it's all about muck around and hope something happens.

If you put Tanev on a team with skilled fast forwards, LOOK OUT

It's amazing how little people know about hockey on this board, you get Connor Mc David naming him one of the leagues best, and internet Couch and Potato chip guy is all: "I say he sucks (Munch munch) ya, not enough goals, not a puck-mover..(Munch) sucks"

Luckily, the people who actually make the trades know what he's worth....except maybe the guy who would trade him

 

[terrible dee]

cant see leafs parting with liligren or major roster piece seeing as trading for tanev is meant to make us more competitive not less.

not sure what position vancouver would be looking for?

i think base would be martin for salary + 1st and then pick your prospect.

not sure if toronto has a prospect good enough after liligren to get it done and i cannot see toronto moving liligren.

the injuries are a major concern imo. it would be great to work something out for tanev but he isnt the player i would go all in on.

You'd do Liligren in a second....Benning is gun shy after drafting what's his name?

 

[DownGoesMcDavid]

cant see leafs parting with liligren or major roster piece seeing as trading for tanev is meant to make us more competitive not less.

not sure what position vancouver would be looking for?

i think base would be martin for salary + 1st and then pick your prospect.

not sure if toronto has a prospect good enough after liligren to get it done and i cannot see toronto moving liligren.

the injuries are a major concern imo. it would be great to work something out for tanev but he isnt the player i would go all in on.

If we cant get Liljgren and be eating up Martins contract then it better be something worth it

1st 2018
2nd 2018
2nd 2019
Martin
Rasanen

 

[firstemperor]

If we cant get Liljgren and be eating up Martins contract then it better be something worth it

1st 2018
2nd 2018
2nd 2019
Martin
Rasanen

I wouldn't do it, but that's about the value I'd expect if he got traded. 1st + 2 2nd's....in your case, 1st + 3 2nd's and eating a bad deal, probably overshooting a bit but whatever.

 

[Hockey Rush]

cant see leafs parting with liligren or major roster piece seeing as trading for tanev is meant to make us more competitive not less.

not sure what position vancouver would be looking for?

i think base would be martin for salary + 1st and then pick your prospect.

not sure if toronto has a prospect good enough after liligren to get it done and i cannot see toronto moving liligren.

the injuries are a major concern imo. it would be great to work something out for tanev but he isnt the player i would go all in on.

Lilegren is the go-to because of his right shot skillset. We would take another prospect though if the right offer was on the table. Cal Foote is one guy our fans really want. I would love a dynamic forward prospect but outside of a blue chip we already have several quality forward in the system.

 

[Hockey Rush]

If we cant get Liljgren and be eating up Martins contract then it better be something worth it

1st 2018
2nd 2018
2nd 2019
Martin
Rasanen

How much term left on Martin's contract?

If it expires next year i'd even take less then Rasanen. I'd rather a mobile D man over a big guy. We already got Tryamkin to eventually replace Gudbranson.

 

[Hockey Rush]

How much term left on Martin's contract?

If it expires next year i'd even take less then Rasanen. I'd rather a mobile D man over a big guy. We already got Tryamkin to eventually replace Gudbranson.

I wouldn't do it, but that's about the value I'd expect if he got traded. 1st + 2 2nd's....in your case, 1st + 3 2nd's and eating a bad deal, probably overshooting a bit but whatever.

Just looked it up... 2 years left after this season. I would be hesitant to take on that contract. Brock Boeser has a big payday coming up.

If they took Gagner back - who may be an actual help on the 4th line. I'd take on that contract in my own be a gm world lol The pot would need to match your request though of the former 2nd rounder or a Bracco or whomever.

Gagner would be a good fit on the 4th line. Can win draws plays both C and Wing. Great on the PP. Gagner's contract ends at the same time as Martin. His contract (Gagner) is $3,150,000 so it is essentially 650k more a season than Martin.

Some leaf fans believe in the Hamonic valuation of a 1st + 2 x 2nds. Would you guys dump Martin and a prospect to land Chris Tanev and Sam Gagner? if that was a stipulation for taking that. to get the return like below:

Vancouver:
1st 2018
2nd 2018
2nd 2019 (or SJS 2018)
Martin (cap dump - 2 more years)
Rasanen/Bracco

Toronto:
Chris Tanev (2 more years)
Sam Gagner (2 more years) 650k more a season than Martin (good 4th line Winger/C who can take draws 45% FO average over career)

Share your thoughts leaf fans!

 

[RebuildinVan]

Just looked it up... 2 years left after this season. I would be hesitant to take on that contract. Brock Boeser has a big payday coming up.

If they took Gagner back - who may be an actual help on the 4th line. I'd take on that contract in my own be a gm world lol The pot would need to match your request though of the former 2nd rounder or a Bracco or whomever.

Gagner would be a good fit on the 4th line. Can win draws plays both C and Wing. Great on the PP. Gagner's contract ends at the same time as Martin. His contract (Gagner) is $3,150,000 so it is essentially 650k more a season than Martin.

Some leaf fans believe in the Hamonic valuation of a 1st + 2 x 2nds. Would you guys dump Martin and a prospect to land Chris Tanev and Sam Gagner? if that was a stipulation for taking that. to get the return like below:

Vancouver:
1st 2018
2nd 2018
2nd 2019 (or SJS 2018)
Martin (cap dump - 2 more years)
Rasanen/Bracco

Toronto:
Chris Tanev (2 more years)
Sam Gagner (2 more years) 650k more a season than Martin (good 4th line Winger/C who can take draws 45% FO average over career)

Share your thoughts leaf fans!

Canuck fan likes it

 

[Smeagoal]

Canuck fan likes it

You know that 1st and 2nd are super late in the draft especially if the Leafs grab Tanev to shore up their D? Considering VAN has crap drafting I wouldn't hold my breathe of anything coming from it other than Benning re-signing Martin.

 

[Oduya]

Leafs should go all in for him.

 

[Jozay]

Just looked it up... 2 years left after this season. I would be hesitant to take on that contract. Brock Boeser has a big payday coming up.

If they took Gagner back - who may be an actual help on the 4th line. I'd take on that contract in my own be a gm world lol The pot would need to match your request though of the former 2nd rounder or a Bracco or whomever.

Gagner would be a good fit on the 4th line. Can win draws plays both C and Wing. Great on the PP. Gagner's contract ends at the same time as Martin. His contract (Gagner) is $3,150,000 so it is essentially 650k more a season than Martin.

Some leaf fans believe in the Hamonic valuation of a 1st + 2 x 2nds. Would you guys dump Martin and a prospect to land Chris Tanev and Sam Gagner? if that was a stipulation for taking that. to get the return like below:

Vancouver:
1st 2018
2nd 2018
2nd 2019 (or SJS 2018)
Martin (cap dump - 2 more years)
Rasanen/Bracco

Toronto:
Chris Tanev (2 more years)
Sam Gagner (2 more years) 650k more a season than Martin (good 4th line Winger/C who can take draws 45% FO average over career)

Share your thoughts leaf fans!

Keep gagner

Id do this in a heartbeat tho

 

[firstemperor]

Vancouver:
1st 2018
2nd 2018
2nd 2019 (or SJS 2018)
Martin (cap dump - 2 more years)
Rasanen/Bracco

Toronto:
Chris Tanev (2 more years)
Sam Gagner (2 more years) 650k more a season than Martin (good 4th line Winger/C who can take draws 45% FO average over career)

Share your thoughts leaf fans!

Hm I'm not the best person to ask, as I'm in the boat of Leaf fans that don't want Tanev near market value- which I acknowledge is roughly what Hamonic got (i.e. 1st + two 2nd's). I just don't think he swings the needle enough, I think his worth is overstated (I'm talking idealistically with the entire Rielly-Tanev, short-tourney WC pairing) as Hainsey is adequate on the top pairing with Rielly, who's taken a step up this year....and because of risk management concerns...etc.

And, because I think this is a stacked draft that's deep, and I'm keen on a number of players in the 1st and 2nd round.....I really think this is one of the best, deepest drafts I followed since 2015 and then going back some.

I think I'd either continue the process and continue leveraging those assets, or give them in a bigger package (if possible) for a bigger ticket....but that's something I've been consistent about for a while and it goes well beyond Tanev. I don't deny he's a good defensive player and all of the above though. We have a good thing going and are in no rush....the window can be sustained and stockpiled even further.

I don't think Gagner is of any interest to us either, dumping Martin for Gagner is lateral at best....he would have negative value on our team as a bad contract and a downgrade over Bozak. I think we could use a center, but only very specific niche centers- ideally one with size that can produce- like an Anisimov....or a higher-end #4C at a good hit/term like Glendenning or Letestu (though certainly, I wouldn't be comfortable giving up any significant assets for either, I think Moore is more than adequate...just a picking at straws factoid)

Appreciate the response otherwise...as an aside, I'm sure there are other Leaf fans that would be fine with that framework you posted (remove Gagner). There's like a spectrum of Leaf fans that have sometimes outlandish opinions on things and they are far more diverse than your own imagination sometimes.... I think it's a bit more of a high-end ask practically though.

 

[Cquant]

Vancouver:
1st 2018
2nd 2018
2nd 2019 (or SJS 2018)
Martin (cap dump - 2 more years)
Rasanen/Bracco

Toronto:
Chris Tanev (2 more years)
Sam Gagner (2 more years) 650k more a season than Martin (good 4th line Winger/C who can take draws 45% FO average over career)

I'd do it if it were Rasanen instead of Bracco. I'd also be happy to replace Gagner with Granlund. Martin would effectively get Granlund's spot anyway, and it's not like Granlund is being put into a spot where he could show his offensive acumen. He could do well in another system, and the Leafs are one where I think Granlund could shine in a third/fourth line role.

Do we even have room for Martin if another player isn't coming back (Gagner, or someone else)?

 

[Hockey Rush]

You know that 1st and 2nd are super late in the draft especially if the Leafs grab Tanev to shore up their D? Considering VAN has crap drafting I wouldn't hold my breath of anything coming from it other than Benning re-signing Martin.

I am aware they would be later picks. I am pretty confident in Jim's scouting to find the right pieces. Boeser was a 23rd overall and some of our recent 2nd rounders look pretty solid. I gather we would likely see Tanev moved for 2019 picks as well as 2018 though. The rumour is the 2019 Entry Draft will be held in Vancouver. Which to me gives him a desire to maybe add some picks for that draft. If we leverage 2019 picks off another team we can maybe get a lottery selection as well. (If a contender this year moves on him and they falter somehow). I would be more than confident in Jim with the let's say the 29-31 pick, 60-62 pick, 32-62 pick, and a prospect. I think Jim would rather keep Gagner so if not retaining on Martin is possible i'm sure he would be down.

 

[Hockey Rush]

Keep gagner

Id do this in a heartbeat tho

We probably wouldn't retain on Martin then. would that be ok with you?

 

[Hockey Rush]

I'd do it if it were Rasanen instead of Bracco. I'd also be happy to replace Gagner with Granlund. Martin would effectively get Granlund's spot anyway, and it's not like Granlund is being put into a spot where he could show his offensive acumen. He could do well in another system, and the Leafs are one where I think Granlund could shine in a third/fourth line role.

Do we even have room for Martin if another player isn't coming back (Gagner, or someone else)?

Granlund might be a guy we move at the draft. He is currently is on IR with a busted ankle. I'm sure he could be worked in somehow but I have a feeling the asking price would go up a tad. Likely include a 3rd with a condition if leafs make it to the eastern finals it becomes a 2nd or something. Granlund has been primarily used in a shutdown role this season. The minute Green put him back with the twins he scored 2 goals. The issue is though he lacks production elsewhere in the lineup. Perhaps more O zone starts can help him out. I think they are using him in a shutdown role in his rfa year to reduce the cost of re-signing him. that is just my conspiracy but apparently, green likes his speed and checking ability.

 

[Hockey Rush]

Canuck fan likes it

I want to clear Gagner out to make room for some kids. We have Gaudette possibly joining the team this summer. Then we have Petterson, Dahlen, Goldobin, Virtanen, and Lind likely all competing for spots. It just gets crowded in the bottom 9. Sutter is a good C, very clutch but I feel he would be better suited moving to a contender once we get a reasonable solid C to replace him. Gaudette may be that guy but its way to early to compare his NCAA success to nhl success. Having Sutter, Dowd, Eriksson, Gagner, Granlund, then the possibility of Vanek and the twins back... we have no room for the kids. Eriksson's contract isn't going anywhere so someone has to go. Dowd has been a good surprise plays well as a 4th line C. Green likes him I think he comes back. Granlund is a guy I've speculated they are going to move. I wouldn't be surprised if one of Baerstchi or Golodbin are dealt too.

 

[Smeagoal]

I am aware they would be later picks. I am pretty confident in Jim's scouting to find the right pieces. Boeser was a 23rd overall and some of our recent 2nd rounders look pretty solid. I gather we would likely see Tanev moved for 2019 picks as well as 2018 though. The rumour is the 2019 Entry Draft will be held in Vancouver. Which to me gives him a desire to maybe add some picks for that draft. If we leverage 2019 picks off another team we can maybe get a lottery selection as well. (If a contender this year moves on him and they falter somehow). I would be more than confident in Jim with the let's say the 29-31 pick, 60-62 pick, 32-62 pick, and a prospect. I think Jim would rather keep Gagner so if not retaining on Martin is possible i'm sure he would be down.

Boeser is luck of the draw. Benning with the 29-31st OV pick is not going to get another player like him. This is the guy who whiffed on 2 (two) top 5 picks. Sure, 'it's too early to tell' but if those drafted behind you are producing and looking like regular NHL players than you missed pretty hard. Tanev is, at worst, a top-4 D man who is a top-2.

The Canucks need a prospect who is looking to be an NHL player, or a higher draft pick. Else keep him to develop the younger D-man, else you're left with Erik Gudbrandson/Edler showing the youth how to play D. Which is bad.

 

[Hockey Rush]

Boeser is luck of the draw. Benning with the 29-31st OV pick is not going to get another player like him. This is the guy who whiffed on 2 (two) top 5 picks. Sure, 'it's too early to tell' but if those drafted behind you are producing and looking like regular NHL players than you missed pretty hard. Tanev is, at worst, a top-4 D man who is a top-2.

The Canucks need a prospect who is looking to be an NHL player, or a higher draft pick. Else keep him to develop the younger D-man, else you're left with Erik Gudbrandson/Edler showing the youth how to play D. Which is bad.

Jim had Boeser as his next best player available at #10. he didn't even expect him to fall. They released a video from the draft where at pick 9 or 10 he was wanting him to fall. Jim didn't just stumble into him. Plus Elias Pettersson is arguably the best non NHL prospect according to Craig Button. He is putting up better numbers in Sweeden's top league then William Nylander. Pettersson was a reach some had him at 12. That Edler Gudbranson pairing looked good until he got his extension lol. Tanev is definitely miscast I call him a good #3. He can easily slot in on your first pair and your #2 d man can lead the 2nd pairing.

I also wouldn't say he whiffed on The Juolevi and Virtanen picks either. Juolevi is putting up record-shattering point totals in Finland. Virtanen is also starting to find his way at the NHL level. He's still young but he is getting there. He might not be as bad as previously anticipated. He has fans divided.

 

[Hockey Rush]

A deal around these perimeters I feel would work for both sides. The prospect Rasanen may need to be swapped out for another prospect. Perhaps someone drafted later a former 3rd or 4th rounder. I just do not know how Jim values Rasanen. But I'm sure he could be flipped if Jim wasn't 100% a fan of him. The basic structure of the deal would be satisfactory for most Canuck fans I believe. What do all you leaf fans think? Would this be satisfactory? (Martin's cap can be dumped on another team NYI might be interested)

Vancouver:
1st 2018 (Pick 17/31)
2nd 2018 (Pick 46-62)
2nd 2019 (or SJS 2018)
Rasanen (Pick #59 in 2017)

Toronto:
Chris Tanev

 

[Hockey Rush]

I wouldn't do it, but that's about the value I'd expect if he got traded. 1st + 2 2nd's....in your case, 1st + 3 2nd's and eating a bad deal, probably overshooting a bit but whatever.

You feel its an overshot? Martin does have some serious term left on his contract. hmmm.. You probably wouldn't be a fan of the above proposal then I take it?

 

[eviohh26]

Boeser is luck of the draw. Benning with the 29-31st OV pick is not going to get another player like him. This is the guy who whiffed on 2 (two) top 5 picks. Sure, 'it's too early to tell' but if those drafted behind you are producing and looking like regular NHL players than you missed pretty hard. Tanev is, at worst, a top-4 D man who is a top-2.

The Canucks need a prospect who is looking to be an NHL player, or a higher draft pick. Else keep him to develop the younger D-man, else you're left with Erik Gudbrandson/Edler showing the youth how to play D. Which is bad.

huh? He does pretty decent after the 1st round

Forsling @ 126
Gaudette @ 149
Tryamkin @66
Demko @36
Gadjovich @55
DiPietro @ 64
Lind @ 33

Outside of the 1st round i personally think he is pretty good.

 

[gabeliscious]

i have a hard time seeing lou trade a 1st, 2 seconds, and rasanen for tanev.

tanev is making 4.5ish and martin is making 2.5ish. it is rare in todays nhl for one team to take a player with cap and not send back something for roster and cap purposes.

this has been a shockingly civilized discussion so good job everyone. i am not looking to derail anything i am only giving my thoughts.

there has been some people saying vancouver would prefer forwards to defense? our top forward prospect not on the nhl roster is johnsson. he is killing it in the ahl.

would something like the following be of interest?

johnsson - stocky speedy 2 way scoring winger
carrick - inexpensive right handed pmd
1st -2019
2nd- 2018

carrick is relatively inexpensive and not a dump.

i dont think toronto would be a team to do more then this based on what the new management has done to date. i guess it comes down to what prospect you like the most?

 

[Contenderorpretender]

I'd do it if it were Rasanen instead of Bracco. I'd also be happy to replace Gagner with Granlund. Martin would effectively get Granlund's spot anyway, and it's not like Granlund is being put into a spot where he could show his offensive acumen. He could do well in another system, and the Leafs are one where I think Granlund could shine in a third/fourth line role.

Do we even have room for Martin if another player isn't coming back (Gagner, or someone else)?

I would prefer to give up bracco. Wingers are a position of strength for the leafs. Even if bracco does become a 50-60 point winger. I wouldn't lose any sleep over trading him and keeping our d prospects and letting them mature in the minors longer

 

[Longtimeleaffan85]

huh? He does pretty decent after the 1st round

Forsling @ 126
Gaudette @ 149
Tryamkin @66
Demko @36
Gadjovich @55
DiPietro @ 64
Lind @ 33

Outside of the 1st round i personally think he is pretty good.

Out of those guys wheres thr ggod pick ...dont see any all stars there